Creating Second Life Last Names

Untrue. In SL every avatar (and every object for that matter) has a key which uniquely identifies that avatar. This is sumetimes referred to as the UUID or Asset KEy in SL. In text based mucks it is called the DBRef

If the name is changed in a muck (eg. with the @NAME command) the DBRef is the same and the player retains all their objects and whatnot. Some inept coders will write scripts that address eg. *Lum rather then #54563 and these will break upon a name change, but generally this is the responsibility of the coder to fix this.

Name changes do happen in SL as it is, when someone has an offensive name the Linden's will change it, and nothing seems to break. I would be very suprised if any of the SL code associated posessions to avatars using the name when the key is far more useful and reliable.

Regarding the idea that people would choose inappropriate surnames: People *already* choose inappropriate FIRST names, so what's the difference? Idiots will be idiots. Offensive surnames should be dealt with just as offensive first names.

Having a unique surname: I like the idea of one person creating a unique surname. If others wish to use the same surname, they would need permission from the creator. However, this can present some problems in instances of common names (ie: Smith, Johnson), and thus may not be practical. Perhaps by associating a fee with the use of the surname would satisfy the reluctance of some to share their name.

Changing your avatar's current name: Wow, I am going to sound materialistic, but I think associating a fee with this as well may prohibit (or discourage at the least) people from changing their name constantly. Or perhaps enforce a limit on how many times (one, two?) a person *can* change their name. I feel bad for everyone who chose uncapitalized first names and now walk around like this: tom Smith. The option to change their name would resolve that: Tom Smith. Perhaps a registry could be set up to track name changes. In this manner, people who change their name to avoid being associated with their actions could be monitored.

Personally, I don't horribly mind a new surname for my character. It was a bit disconcerting at first not to be able to choose my own. As one person stated, my character also has a history in many MMORPG's. Giving her a new last name took away a bit of who she was. But that's ok, too. I mean, she's a different person in this game anyway. And I'm enjoying it. I'll probably keep my same last name even if new ones become available to me. However, I think it's a *wonderful* idea to offer the option.

Now then, how can I help my poor boyfriend get his first name capitalized.

Another point that I don't think anyone has brought up yet is the attempts to make SL reach an international market, we have a Japanese and a Korean subforum here, but the vast majority of available surnames are western. The only Japanese surnames I've seen around are Kojima, and Onizuka, the latter being the name of the lead character from a popular anime and TV series that has seen a western release. The only Chinese surname I have seen here is (obviously) Chung and I have never seen a Korean surname.

We have seen people post here that they nearly didn't sign up because they thought the names sucked, obviously we will never hear from the people who didn't sign up for this reason, though server logs may well provide this information, this could have the effect of limiting the demographics that actually decide to play the game and go part way to explaining why the vast majority of avs here seem to look like white middle-class American teenagers.

I am against free namechanges for the reasons stated in the post above mine. I would prefer either a cost, or no namechanges, with the exception that people who signed up from the restrictive list of surnames get to make a one-time change. Some of the online communities I am in have people constantly changine their name (hello Furry IRC!) and it is just confusing and unhelpful.

That's me. I'm a typo, and my player actually plays someone else. If I could pick a better name maybe my player would play me instead.

Give me a second chance in Second Life. Or let my player bury me without having to pay for a new name. I don't own anything, I don't have any land, I've got no ratings, nothing... there's nothing at stake for Linden Labs, but everything for me...

As for the proposals... I can see why Linden wouldn't want the pool of names growing too fast.

if someone wants a new surname, let them propose it when they sign up. The most popular (by number of submissions, or by votes from other users) surname(s) in a month get put into rotation, and the people who proposed the name get the option to change their signup name or get a free second Basic account with the new name.

Myself?
I dislike this idea greatly.

Providing a service whereby player's can change their name to one already on the list is fine.
But allowing purchase or ownership of new-user created names isn't.
Remember that we are after all online, and trust me. There's gonna be some very messed up nicks going on, not to mention the name baron / technical issues linked to the options.

Also, quick thought. Wouldn't allowing people the rights to the name they create leave Linden open to a few copyright problems? I mean, fantasy scenario, what if I changed my ingame name to something trademarked by an RL corp or company? Wouldn't that then leave Linden and myself open to a fair bit of grief? Just a thought.

How about giving us the option to have a middle name. Then we ca select either our First Name or Middle Name to Disply and have the middle name editable so that we can change it but not the first or last name. That way it will still be viewable and searchable by others.

The middle name can function like having an "alias" or "nickname".

That would be really good. Now, remember, some people go by all three names. The options should include "first", "middle", or "both" so I can be Persial January Hebert (and someone else can be Martin Wallace Graynor or Rebel Elizabeth Mudlark).

If it is setup so that ANYONE has the opportunity at any "legal" last name, I would be interested in it.

No buying a last name and then charging others to get it stuffs. If your first name is George and you are the first George to want the last name of Jefferson (example only of course), then you pay the fee and get renamed. Presuming of course that these new last names will be restricted to prevent someone walking around with a famous name or copyright violation.

I would really like the option to change my name in general, especially since I chose my name based on an error. When I signed up, I wanted the name Echo, however the first last name I picked said that Echo + that last name was taken. I'm guessing there was an error, since every Echo + last name combination I tried had the same result. I settled for ShadowEcho instead, but after creating my account and doing a name search, I found that the name I wanted was NOT taken afterall. This happened to my girlfriend as well who signed up for an account at the same time. If paying a small fee for the ability to have our names changed is what it takes, so be it - but we would both like to be able to have the names we intended.

Firstly, what are the effects of "innapropriate" last names. We also must consider tose names ending up on the Teen Grid (which is all PG anyhow). Unless, of course these names are approved on a point-by-point basis, but, bah. Ignore me, I don't know where I'm going with this.

Secondly, as for changing my last name...
I'm not 100% sure many people would go for this.
I'm Armath Severine, not the best last name in the world, but it's me.
I've grown rather attatched to it.
I'm sappier than most, but I'm sure some of the more established/involved residents might feel the same way.

I'm not saying it shouldn't be an option, I'm simply saying I, personally, wouldn't change my name. ^_~

On the other hand, however, It might be nice for partners or families to have the same last name... but then again, Identity is Identity... It's yours to create.

::Edit:: Woohoo! 100th post! ::Edit::

Would it even be possible to change your last name? I tried emailing support about my girlfriend and I wanting to change our names because of the sign up error, but I was told that it's "impossible to change the name of an account, since it is tied to information such as your billing data and in world property." But from reading this thread, I gathered that all of that was linked to an avatar key? :/

Sorta depends on how LL sees itself as the authority behind the product -- purely corporate or government entity?

In the first case, sure, sell it all! Whoever has the money and inclination to control a name commodity in-world should be allowed to buy all the 'rights' he can afford and let the secondary consumer figure out for himself how to work into the system.

But in the latter scenario, Linden should maintain more of a controlling, obvious presence in the process, akin to the sale of vanity car tags by state transportation department. Allow flexibility and ownership within narrow parameters so that the naming market doesn't inadvertantly run amok and create problems you don't want.

I'd suggest the second, with an eye for phased deregulation over time. Or perhaps test-case naming options (beta!) available to only a few people to get a better feel for what's ahead.

In some sense this question reminds me of the Beanie Baby and Stikfas marketing plan, when a company tries to keep the demand and value of its product high by limited release. How does Linden envision avatar surnames as a product?

I like the idea for purchasing unique names, but only with some conditions.

In the event of used names, you have to find anyone (not just a singular owner) who already has the name to "inherit" it. This alone would kill any name squatting market since you could buy use from a previous holder and circulate it freely after that.

Next, anyone can pay to be the first person possessing any given name (real or otherwise) if no one else currently uses it. If someone is using the name, they will have to seek out someone with the name to get a "copy". The exception to this, however, is if the name is in any position on the credit card used to pay for the account. This would allow anyone to have access to any part (or all) of their own real name, no matter who had previously used it in-game.

After this, charge whatever you want for making a custom name, obtaining a custom name (actually attaching a created name, one you created or one you inherited), and keeping a custom name.

Creating your own Second Life last names

Please take a moment to read the following two idea descriptions. What do you think? Would you take advantage of the ability to create your own Second Life last name? Do these approaches make sense, or do you have another idea for increasing the flexibility of the naming system in SL? What seems like a reasonable fee for these services? Do you agree with the payment options (recurring or single fees)? Anything else you want to tell us?

Own a Second Life Last Name
Purchase a SL last name that doesn't currently exist in the name choices. You own the rights to the name and can transfer it to other residents through an invitation to use it. The name right is analogous to an Internet domain name -- it can be transferred to another person. The fee for ownership would be a recurring annual fee.

Start a New Second Life Last Name
You can create a new Second Life last name list and be the first to use it. The fee for create the name would be a one time set up charge.

First Option
Whoa. Expensive. but I do like the fact that I can have 'family members' in game who can have the same last name. So it's possible to create family Clans in-game with people you are close to and not just some random person who shares the last name. Kinda like a Guild Name in most MMORPGs. It's just a trifle expensive to use if I have to pay every year for a name.

Second Option
This is a good idea too. I'd like to keep a name I'd like to claim for myself... but does this mean other people can't use it too?

They're both good ideas, but I prefer to combine the two. Like only having to pay once to get the Last name of your choice and the ability to invite other folks too. However, maybe it will be more profitable, that those invited to use the last name also pay for the change. Just to be fair to the player and the Lindens. it is business after all.

What about the change of last names to married avies? Maybe giving them the option that for an additional fee, your spouse's last name will be changed to that of the husbands? Or maybe an option to use both last names? ^_^

The only con I see to this is that this opens a lot of inappropriate names to crop up in the game. Not to mention the use of trademarked names and the use of ASCII symbols for names (ahh! nightmare!!).

I just hope you also open this feature up to the existing players and I hope the last name isn't a one time change. Although, yeah that could be subject to abuse...

I had a really strong "anti" reaction when I read these proposals. Maybe it's just a personal thing but there's something about the idea of 'buying' names in SL that makes me feel queasy.

I'm still pretty new to SL and I remember that when I first joined and saw that there was a limited list to choose from I had two reactions. The first was "Why can't I choose my last name? Why are my choices limited?" followed by "Oh, okay there are only certain names allowed in the game. Guess that makes all of us 'Murakamis' like family. Cool."

I'd actually prefer to have a free choice or continue with the current state-sponsored list.

The problem that I have with the proposals is that they introduce a market into yet another area of Second Life. I can understand the rationale for a market for resources such as land and for goods that creative individuals have applied their talent in creating. But names? I know that some have made the analogy with car number plates but I feel that names are too personal to be reduced to commodities. It makes me wonder if there is any aspect of the game that LL would not be prepared to monetise? I'm sure it sounded like a cool idea, and to be fair there has been significant support on the forum, but I'm afraid I just plain don't like it!

another option is to allow those who own land to change thier lastname to the name of the land( island or plot) that they own ..
I'm in favor of free or relativly low linden$

I don't like this idea at all. Robin, I hope Linden Lab takes into consideration the harm it does when we see someone's name in SL. Now it is, "That was a really creative way to make a first name to match with the last name. Trimming Hedges, Essence Lumin" (well you be the judge on mine). If you do this, it will just be, Oh someone bought the name.

I only read the first of 8 pages in this thread because it is depressing.

OK, I decided to be brave and read the other seven pages. I don't know, I'm surprised there isn't more of an uproar. Some people object. I don't get the impression they think this is a really, really bad idea. I do.

My mom gave me my name. She didn't have to pay for it. For the most part I can't change it. If I were a woman and married some guy it would traditionally be changed to his name. That was an interesting idea from the thread. I think you should be able to take the last name of your spouse if you marry. However if you decide to divorce you should lose it.

As wild and money oriented as the real world is, you might have to pay some license fees but you can't buy a name. LL integrates money into the game more as time goes on. I really hope this idea is discarded though.

i like the choice of choosing first and last names when you register as well but i think current players should be allowed a 1 time option to change there last name. also i think it would be nice when couples are partnered to allow an option of changing the last name for some extra fee.

I agree with that completely. Letting people making their own name could result in many problems. And less and less people will have the same surname anymore. It's still a preasure to meet my own 'relative' who use the same surname as me in-world

Letting people vote for a new name is a good idea. Or...maybe you can charge the new register for Real $US if they really want to create their own surname. That will sure make them think twice (and more) before create a new surname, not just throwing random thing into their name.

I really like the idea of Middle-name and custom title though

Under this system, can I purchase a blank/null surname for everyone to use, and keep it permanently available? If so, go for it.

I'm not a fan of the current naming system in place, and in the spirit of users making the world our own, I want to abolish, circumvent, or otherwise render it moot. It'd be most helpful if you could enable the use of spaces in the first name field, and make its length sufficient for this purpose, as well (I haven't tested either, yet; I don't know if they exist.) Yes, I know, you'll have to ensure that people don't set "* Linden" or "Cubey Terra" in that field.

Here are the problems I see with the current system:

1. There's no current support for those who want a non-western naming order.


2. There's no current support for those who don't want a surname at all (a category into which I fall). None of us belong to these "families" except by choice ... taking the name of a family should also be by choice.

I didn't pick Talamasca because I knew other Talamascas and wanted to join them. I choose it precisely because I could not use the software unless I chose something. That sort of thing pisses me off, and does NOT make me amenable to interacting with other Talamascas on the basis of our shared name. Quite the contrary. It's not a badge of pride or a statement on my personality. It's something I'm stuck with because of an arbitrary restriction SL has, and I treat it as such.


3. Self-identification is a very personal decision and choosing a name is the first big opportunity new residents have in SL to get creative about who they are.** And what do we get?

We have to choose from a short list of semi-randomly available names. It's not even a complete list. This does not give a good first impression of a place that is supposed to be about user creativity and users building the world. It is not empowering to choose from your list; it is stifling.

(** Self identification is terribly important here. In the real world, we can choose to ignore our legal names on an interpersonal level and use nicknames, etc. Here, we can't ... it's floating over our heads to contradict us every moment we are online, it's announced on chat every time we speak, and it's permanent: we have no mechanism available to change it short of trashing our avatar and making a new one (which brings up issues with the ability to transfer some of our property due to the permission system). Even in RL, most people have the option of going to the courthouse to have their name legally changed.)


4. Every single person I've referred to second life so far has said something along the lines of "So, uh, we have to pick from the list of names? That's ... lame." I agree. It's sort of sadly ironic that I had more flexibility to choose my own identity in a strongly themed world like City of Heroes than I do in SL.

I recognize that you are trying to make naming more flexible with this suggestion, but this doesn't go far enough.

It also strikes me as more than a little bit mercenary to charge for something that really should have been in SL from day 1.

I don't mind if the current naming list (the WHOLE list ... none of this artificial exlusivity nonsense from making names unavailable) is presented as a list of suggested names. Not everyone is good with cooking up names; I have trouble with it myself sometimes. But it should never have been the only option.


Some side commentary:

* If people are afraid that I will make a name that they dislike ... well, frankly, I've very little sympathy for their position. If my name violates TOS, report me. Otherwise ... please mind your own business.

* I neither need nor want a "random web of social connections". And I resent the idea that one should be forced on me. If I want social connections, I'll bloody well go out and find them myself, and they won't be random.

* Finally, I don't appreciate people who want to force users to stick with this naming system (by denying them any alternative). If you want others to share your surname or whatever, then press for Linden to allow people to take surnames by choice (marriage, adoption, etc) or something. That way, it will actually make some form of sense to have one, and if people want to do it, then they will.

Conversely, if they don't, then they won't. And if they don't want to do it, why would you want to force them to? And by what right are you justifying doing so?

I love this idea! Aside from being charged, since other games let you choose your first and last name it seems somewhat unfair to charge for it. But, if you HAVE to charge for it, I think allowing premium accounts to have this FREE (one time only) and charging Basic accounts for it is fair. Simply because Premium accounts are already paying monthly recurring fees. Now, before all the Basic account holders scream and yell at me about this, I have one Premium and one Basic account and would be willing to pay for this on my Basic account. So no yelling or name calling please. It's just an idea.

I like the idea of ppl being able to change their last name to whatever they chose but within the parameters of the Linden issued last names. And I would have to say there should be both a monetary fee for this service as well as a limit of how many times one avie can change names (3 seems like a fair number).

Honestly I would be happy with just being able to change our last name period. I am getting married and of course didnt know whom id marry when i created the name. Would like to have our last name's be the same. But of course if any of these name ideas were implemented and we were able to change our current avatar's name then we could have the same last name anyway.

I do not have a problem with choosing a last name that is from the list, as with the ability to make Your own first name,,its unique anyway. No matter what system is in place for choosing ones name, someone will not be happy about it. That is the way the world is, never a total and complete consensous.

If one is going to be charged to change a last name, how is it different than the way SL has it set up now?..You get an alt and change names, and with all the get togethers and split ups, it could cost alot of people a fortune,,for the sake of a last name. The name change can be signified in the profile, people look at it anyway.

Well that is my two cents worth on this subject *smiles*, hope everyone has a wonderful and pleasant evening.