Scientific Proof of the Existence of God
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Kevn Klein
God is Love!
Join date: 5 Nov 2004
Posts: 3,422
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10-19-2005 13:44
From: Chip Midnight I love this stuff. It's fun to contemplate. My point of view is that our understanding of the quantum world is so in its infancy that ALL theories to explain its oddities are wild guesses. We currently lack the technology to get a clearer picture. I think we're going to have to wait a while before we understand the true nature of the quantum world. I feel that people like Gotswami who try to assert that our lack of understanding somehow proves mysticism are getting way ahead of themselves and doing what mystics have done since the dawn of time... trying to fill in the blanks with what they can imagine rather than what they can observe, measure, or verify. It's interesting, but it's not science. It's philosophy. Chip, at least we can agree we don't have all the info to suggest anyone has cornered the market of truth. I adhere to my beliefs, and once in a while allow myself the right to delve into things that bring into question everything I hold as truth. It would be wonderful if we could all seperate our bias from our quest to understand what is real. |
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Icon Serpentine
punk in drublic
Join date: 13 Nov 2003
Posts: 858
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10-19-2005 13:49
From: Kevn Klein Ghoti posted this link in another thread that I thought was worthy of it's own thread. "Scientific Proof of the Existence of God": http://www.wie.org/j11/goswami.aspWhat a load of self-centred bull. We have to get over this whole, "Wow we're sentient" crap. It doesn't make us all that smart. Obviously. Ever drank until you passed out at a party and woke up somewhere different than where you fell asleep?
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
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10-19-2005 13:52
From: Icon Serpentine Ever drank until you passed out at a party and woke up somewhere different than where you fell asleep? Ooh. You should post this to the "That was WEIRD!!!!!" thread.  ~Ulrika~
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Chance Abattoir
Future Rockin' Resmod
Join date: 3 Apr 2004
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10-19-2005 13:53
From: Ulrika Zugzwang Ooh. You should post this to the "That was WEIRD!!!!!" thread. ~Ulrika~ 
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
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10-19-2005 13:56
From: Chance Abattoir Image Whoa! We've got a three-thread cross post going. To me that's Scientific Proof of the Existence of God. EDIT: DOH! That's the name of this thread. ~Ulrika~
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Chance Abattoir
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Trinity.
10-19-2005 13:59
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Ghoti Nyak
καλλιστι
Join date: 7 Aug 2004
Posts: 2,078
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10-19-2005 14:01
From: Chip Midnight I feel that people like Gotswami who try to assert that our lack of understanding somehow proves mysticism are getting way ahead of themselves and doing what mystics have done since the dawn of time... trying to fill in the blanks with what they can imagine rather than what they can observe, measure, or verify. It's interesting, but it's not science. It's philosophy. I acknowlege your point, and can only suggest you read his book and judge his science for itself, not form an opinion based on a 3 page sensationalistic article and an appearance in an admittedly controversial film. -Ghoti
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"Sometimes I believe that this less material life is our truer life, and that our vain presence on the terraqueous globe is itself the secondary or merely virtual phenomenon." ~ H.P. Lovecraft
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Seth Kanahoe
political fugue artist
Join date: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 1,220
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10-19-2005 14:03
From: Chip Midnight Your points are well taken, Seth, but I need to set you straight on Einstein. He was an atheist. Yes, I've read that book. Einstein did, however, subscribe to a classical view of cosmic process that began with a "first cause" or "ulterior hand". His famous quote about God not playing dice with the universe, which was meant metaphorically but was taken literally, is a defense of that classical perspective. To Einstein, "God" meant "Creation", and the almost metaphysical complexity and beauty of form and dynamic in "living" concert. Which has as much merit as the Christian, Muslim, or Daoist definition of "God", and perhaps more. |
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Chance Abattoir
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Join date: 3 Apr 2004
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10-19-2005 14:04
From: Ghoti Nyak I acknowlege your point, and can only suggest you read his book and judge his science for itself, not form an opinion based on a 3 page sensationalistic article and an appearance in an admittedly controversial film.
-Ghoti Way to bring down his inner child. 
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"The mob requires regular doses of scandal, paranoia and dilemma to alleviate the boredom of a meaningless existence."
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
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10-19-2005 14:15
From: Kevn Klein Chip, at least we can agree we don't have all the info to suggest anyone has cornered the market of truth. I adhere to my beliefs, and once in a while allow myself the right to delve into things that bring into question everything I hold as truth.
It would be wonderful if we could all seperate our bias from our quest to understand what is real. I agree wholeheartedly. I think the big difference between myself and others is that my default position on all things is disbelief until adequate proof is provided. I resist the urge to believe in things simply because I think it would be really cool if they were true. That's why my atheism isn't in any way a leap of faith. I could very well be a believer some day if proof turned up. I freely admit that I'm biased against mysticism and the paranormal for the simple fact that no real proof has ever been provided in all of human history so far. That's a pretty bad track record if you ask me. We've come to understand a great many things over the past few thousand years. None of those things have bolstered mysticism or the paranormal. Quite the contrary. I profess no foreknowledge or special insight other than a belief that the scientific method has proven itself to be an excellent means (the best we have) of separating the wheat from the chaff.
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
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10-19-2005 14:21
From: Seth Kanahoe To Einstein, "God" meant "Creation", and the almost metaphysical complexity and beauty of form and dynamic in "living" concert. An anthropomorphic metaphor does not a religious man make 
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
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10-19-2005 14:21
I'd just like to pop in and remind everyone that God does not exist. Fools.
~Ulrika~
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Chance Abattoir
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10-19-2005 14:26
From: Chip Midnight I profess no foreknowledge or special insight other than a belief that the scientific method has proven itself to be an excellent means (the best we have) of separating the wheat from the chaff. You stick to your magical science to feed you. I'll be laughing as I ride this guy: 
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
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10-19-2005 14:27
From: Chance Abattoir You stick to your magical science to feed you. I'll be laughing as I ride this guy: hahaha, touche! (damn literalists!).
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Chance Abattoir
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10-19-2005 14:28
From: Ulrika Zugzwang I'd just like to pop in and remind everyone that God does not exist. Fools.
~Ulrika~  Don't you mean the probability is incredibly low?
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"The mob requires regular doses of scandal, paranoia and dilemma to alleviate the boredom of a meaningless existence."
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Neehai Zapata
Unofficial Parent
Join date: 8 Apr 2004
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10-19-2005 14:40
I'm confused. Is there a god now or not?
If there is no god, the who is this guy that keeps asking me to deliver mesages?
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Chance Abattoir
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10-19-2005 14:42
From: Neehai Zapata I'm confused. Is there a god now or not?
If there is no god, the who is this guy that keeps asking me to deliver mesages? That's Bob.
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"The mob requires regular doses of scandal, paranoia and dilemma to alleviate the boredom of a meaningless existence."
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Kevn Klein
God is Love!
Join date: 5 Nov 2004
Posts: 3,422
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10-19-2005 15:10
From: Chip Midnight I agree wholeheartedly. I think the big difference between myself and others is that my default position on all things is disbelief until adequate proof is provided. I resist the urge to believe in things simply because I think it would be really cool if they were true. That's why my atheism isn't in any way a leap of faith. I could very well be a believer some day if proof turned up. I freely admit that I'm biased against mysticism and the paranormal for the simple fact that no real proof has ever been provided in all of human history so far. That's a pretty bad track record if you ask me. We've come to understand a great many things over the past few thousand years. None of those things have bolstered mysticism or the paranormal. Quite the contrary. I profess no foreknowledge or special insight other than a belief that the scientific method has proven itself to be an excellent means (the best we have) of separating the wheat from the chaff. And knowing we are stuck in time and space, as 3-d characters, without the tools to cure the common cold, we must assume there is so much more to know than we currently know. With that assumtion, the possibilities are limited only to our imagination. We are at the footstool of knowledge. In 100 years people will look back on us and wonder how we thought we had a clue. I only assume there is a creator because there is a creation. When it's provn everything just happened, I believe that. |
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Jillian Callahan
Rotary-winged Neko Girl
Join date: 24 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,766
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10-19-2005 15:20
From: Chance Abattoir That's Bob. Again? |
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Dianne Mechanique
Back from the Dead
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2,648
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10-19-2005 15:25
From: Ghoti Nyak Yeah, I have to go with 'egg' as well. I come to this conclusion because modern theory holds birds (including chicken, I'd assume) are evolved from dinosaurs... hence you don't need as chicken to make the first chicken egg.
-Ghoti Everyone knows the chicken came first, thats why the egg never gets to come at all. |
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Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
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10-19-2005 15:27
There is no god. There is only ZUUL!
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Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
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10-19-2005 15:29
From: Ghoti Nyak Yeah, I have to go with 'egg' as well. I come to this conclusion because modern theory holds birds (including chicken, I'd assume) are evolved from dinosaurs... hence you don't need as chicken to make the first chicken egg.
-Ghoti Eggs have been around since Beta! |
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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10-19-2005 15:32
From: Kevn Klein I only assume there is a creator because there is a creation. When it's provn everything just happened, I believe that. That's funny! Kevn said provn. ~Ulrika~
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Desmond Shang
Guvnah of Caledon
Join date: 14 Mar 2005
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10-19-2005 16:12
From: Chip Midnight I think the big difference between myself and others is that my default position on all things is disbelief until adequate proof is provided. I resist the urge to believe in things simply because I think it would be really cool if they were true. That's why my atheism isn't in any way a leap of faith. I could very well be a believer some day if proof turned up. See, that's the crux of it right there: to *honestly disbelieve all things* would take tremendous effort. In practice, without any proof at all really, don't you think there are sentient creatures reading your words in this forum? If not, wouldn't posting here simply be a form of self-stimulation? Sorry, I'm still giggling over the word "panspermia" used in an intellectual manner. This whole discussion has been stimulating to me, perhaps a little too stimulating. - one very giddy Desmond Shang |
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Chance Abattoir
Future Rockin' Resmod
Join date: 3 Apr 2004
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10-19-2005 16:19
From: Ulrika Zugzwang That's funny! Kevn said provn.
~Ulrika~ I pity tha fool! 
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