BEWARE: Stolen Textures In Second Life!!!!!

You really have no idea? Well most of us here know the answer to that, if you don't then I can't regard anything you have to say on the subject as the least bit informative. The million monkeys argument does not wash with me.

Part of the answer lies in digital watermarking, of which some may have suggested before. If a digital watermark is placed by the asset server on the uploaded texture, it can record which avatar uploaded and prevent another avatar from uploading the copied texture bearing the watermark. This does not affect textures which are identical so it doesn't prevent others from uploading their own legitimate but identical looking textures.

Most watermarks are relatively quite robust in holding the information in the image and only gives way when severe modifications have been done to the original image. Simple things like painting over, rotations and minor deformations will not affect the watermark. To remove the watermark, the copier would have to degrade the original to the point where it has little commercial value left.

For those who use Photoshop, there is a demo of the digimarc filter which you can experiment on. Its one of the built-in filters. Apply the filter and try and degrade it in various ways to break the watermark.

I suppose one of the downsides is, Linden Lab may not have the expertise to develop a decent digital watermarking algorithm and might have to resort to a third party, which costs money.

There may be other ways, but I think digital watermarking is the least obstrusive way that also require minimal human intervention.

There may be no way to stop this type of theft, but I am sure that the content creators of Second Life could certainly blacklist people. If LL isn't going to do anything officially about it and we own the IP rights to our work -- then it really is up to us. Frivilous lawsuits for texture theft and reverse engineering would be quite stupid. But, it would be nice to have a list of known offenders who steal textures, reverse engineer and sell other peoples work that is either intended to be free or to make a profit. I certainly wouldn't buy from anyone on that list nor would I encourage my friends to. Sure, it sounds mean and petty, but really what else can we do to protect our creations?

Personally, I don't know if people are ripping off my work or not because I don't have the time to check every single place in SL. If its brought to my attention that is pretty much the only way I will know. I'm just tired of seeing the hard work of so many designer friends completely ripped off by shallow pathetic money grubbing chodes.

I've gone back and forth on the issue and while I am well aware of the "knock off" mentality. There is a HUGE difference between making your version of someone elses design and copying it directly. I can see incidences of using the same photosourcing reference or the same fabric or similar design qualities, but the blatant theft of textures is inexcusable and anyone who violates that gets what they deserve.

-Jennyfur

*sigh* READ the post please...

Sorry to see this happen Lost =x
I kinda agree with everyone else..i really dont see a way of stopping ppl from stealing textures which really blows =/
They must be really money hungry how could they have gotten the texture if the skin was no modify? @_@

what some people will do these days

Sorry, but if Lost shows even the small moles on her original skin which are identical on the stolen one, there is very good cause for suspicion of theft here.

Lost: Texture theft discussions have gone into some depth over in the Design/Textures section, and it was suggested that LL demand the thieves either produce their 1024x1024 layered masters (submitted to LL, no need to risk sharing legit templates with others), it might determine their guilt. If they only have 512x512 1-or-2 layer masters, then the texture was ripped.


Are you well versed in graphics and Photoshop? Ever create a skin? And since you don't know how this can be done, let me assure you -- there is a VERY easy way to steal textures in SL or any other game that uses graphic textures. There is nothing LL can do to stop it other than post-facto enforcement if the perp has the nerve to sell their stolen wares and gets caught.


That answers my question. You've never created your own skin, have you?

I agree that its not theivery if someone uses the same photosource and two people just happen to have made the same thing, but IMO there is a fine line between someone ripping off someones work that was photosourced not by any accidentally using the same photosource, but deliberately through means of stealing the textures through SL. There is so much gray area when it comes to texture theft that its no wonder that LL doesn't get more involved.

In this case with the skins, even if there is photosourcing involved there is still a high level of manipulation involved in the use of the templates and stuff. I've tried to make skins on a couple of occasions and it is quite hard especially when you take into account seams and stuff like that.

-Jennyfur

Is there a way to be more certain when I buy a skin it's not a ripped texture? Or would naming of names be somethig we'd only see on other forums because of the TOS?

I want to avoid supporting texture theft.

From what I understand of the way SL "bakes" it's textures the only things that would be easy to steal are skins. SL should be actually baking all textures on an Avatar into one on the SERVER side, not the client. So what you are downloading will be a big mush of skin and clothing. This unfortunately puts skins at high risk of being stolen, but stealing any clothing worth the effort of stealing probably wouldn't be a process that would appeal to anyone lazy enough to consider reselling stolen clothing.

If I'm wrong about this please let me know.

Doc,
If I took someone’s software and slapped a different UI on it, it would look different, possibly behave differently too right? Somehow I think the law would be on the original creators side though. What’s the difference? It looks and feels different, right?

IP and copyright extends to all types of media, including digital only content. If the original creator can provide proof of original concept and creation then they are entitled to have their rights enforced, regardless of any modification the second party has made. Unless granted permission by the original creator, the use of any original product as a 'starting point' is considered a form of copyright infringement and should the original creator decide to follow up on it, its legally enforceable.

A better example would be taking someone's photographs or art work from their portfolio site, modifying it, and using it in a magazine add. You simply are not leaglly allowed to do that without permission from the original artist.

So, in response to your " 'there ought to be a law', but I'm afraid there isn't" , I'm sorry to correct you, but I'm happy to tell you that there is.

Also, a thought on preventing stolen items from being sold...

Perhaps have a user created directory of registered items. A sort of SL-only copyright office. Each submission must be checked against other submissions to insure it's geniune. You could then rest more assured that you are buying an original and not funding a copy artist by buying things only registered by the directory.

I realize this would take a ton of work (specifically work i wouldn't want to do lol), but it might pay off in the end...

So basically, the only reason you are upset this time is because it happened to you.

Gotcha.




Disclaimer: I am in no way affiliated with this issue.

The one thing about the skins lost makes or the ones I make is although we use many photos from 3dsk we do not map the whole skin from the same model . It would be quite impossible to make a skin exactly the way another person did even if you do have the same photos .
Aneta is a perfect example how a thousand different people can take one set of photos and make completley different looking skins . There is no chance that this is what happened here .

[edited]

This is the problem.
Criminal suddenly becomes victim.
I urge everyone who has any intrest in keeping their work safe to message Raquel and ask her who she bought the textures from . They could be selling yours too .

She is refusing to tell anyone where she bought the textures .

if you would like to see more of the conversation between Raquel ,myself and lost message me in world , id be happy to drop you the note.


Torley Linden:
Just a reminder that it's important to stay on the right and not get muddied up, even if bad things happen to you.

Revealing chat logs without all parties's consent isn't allowed per the Community Standards, the part that says "Disclosure". I don't want to see anyone worse off by getting into further trouble.

I had a modifiable hair and enlarged a piece to get a snapshot. Using that texture, I created a flexiprim ponytail sinc eit is my preferred SL hairstyle and I found none I liked on the market. (I also found no black hair textures except in huge packs)

The original designer of the texture has a full perms copy of the hair, and permission to sell it and keep 100% of the profit from by flexibase. The only thing I asked was credit on the creation. A few of my friends will be getting the ponytail- but in a no modify, no transfer, copy only form. They will not be able to take the texture (this creator has had trouble before, I know, and I only sought a special hair for me, nothing more. I refuse to sell or allow anyone other than the original designer to sell this hair).

I feel that giving a full perms copy to the original creator of the texture, and only asking credit on the original design (inspiration for others, and it was partly drawn from one of their designs, its a basic one) is reparations enough.

What I ask here is if you had such a hair texture, or wall, on a modify product, would you feel such a usage was allowable. I would, myself.

No, that's not entirely true at all. Textures are individual files and are downloaded as such.


If I can grab a copy of your registered item by circumventing the registration process, that's not going to do much good, is it? All I have to do then is re-upload it, register it, and I've been legitimized.

Two words: Derivative Works.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derivative_work

There IS a law. It IS illegal. There was no permission granted.

Your eyesight ok? Your monitor need cleaning? Similar is NOT the same as identical! Similar does NOT prove ownership!




Oh dear... figures of speech go right past you don't they - that was along the lines of 'I couldn't possibly comment' - but I suppose you don't 'get' that either?

OK, you want me to step by step you through using GL-Intercept (*shrug* I'd rather NOT mention it, but since you insist) to snag the original texture?
Load into PS. Curves, Levels, Clone Stamp, Healing brush, Add layers, Duplicate layers, Merging, various Image Adjustments settings/ possibly even playing with channels? And for skins Painter is quite good too...

Nope, I haven't created a skin from scratch, though I have modded several and created a lot of other textures.
And from the looks of the latest lighting effects I'm going to have to mod quite a lot more stuff too, that or throw it away...

WHY is it though that so many 'know-it-alls' in SL seems to assume that everyone else, regardless of their time in SL is a witless know-nothing idiot? Does it make them feel superior do you think?

Hee, been wondering where this fad for jewellry in belly button of SL skins comes from... turns out Aneta is to blame ^^

The point is that when you register your item it is compared against previously registered items. If the group/person doing the registration deems it to be a copy then it does NOT become registered. The registration would not be in the form of some kind of watermark or stamp on the texture, but instead a creator/creation that is registered could claim to be registered and a customer could then look them up in this directory to check the legitimacy of this claim.

Will this help if people don't give two tugs? No. Will this stop textures from being stolen? No. Does it give honest people a chance to do an honest thing? Yes.



To be clear, I'm not talking about how they are downloaded within the client. The theft we are talking about requires taking downloaded textures from the OpenGL memory and I had understood it that the textures are baked together before being processed into the OpenGL memory. I'm not saying I am right and you are wrong...just making sure we're on the same page.

Wow! When did that post become autobiographical?

"The straw that is in thy brother's eye, thou seest; but the beam that is in thine own eye, thou seest not!"

Wendel

aha..wow =/

OK, so YOU bankroll her taking the presumed offender to court

Oh, and taking artwork, modifying it and using it is NOT a clearcut black and white case Fox, there are such concepts as fair use and derivation to muddy the waters.

It does amuse me to hear people talk as though the law was balck and white - if it were we wouldn't have laywers!

Anyway, I honestly believe there were sufficent differences in the images displayed to throw reasonable doubt on there being a clearcut copying issue.

I've noticed this a lot with designers, it's always 'OMG! I've been copied!' and when you look at the 'evidence' there is similairity... but by no means is there a 'copy'...

You are wrong about this, unfortunately, Every single texture - clothing, eyeballs, hair textures, skins, etc can be ripped with full transparency information present. I do not want to go into detail about the process, but LL is quite aware of it, and unfortunately, nothing can be done about it, short of the digital watermarking process spoken about earlier.

Because in SL you can be the King or Queen that you really are that the RW doesn't seem to recognize. Unless you really are da bomb IRL like me.