Teen Grid - Is it what Linden Lab promised?

Just want to say though that I don't think anyone is calling you a bad parent, at least I hope they're not.
My daughter has watched over my shoulder a few times too. (My son isn't interested) She thinks the clothing design stuff I do is pretty cool and she likes to help me a little. I let her when I'm on my workhorse account (this one) and not the other so I don't have to deal too much with IMs popping up and distracting me because it's time with her not other people. Also because I do have a partner in SL and frankly that time is none of her business. For that same reason if I wander at all while she's watching, it's carefully, staying out of certain mature areas.
This is a safe way to let my daughter see this place.. with me. What I won't do is let her create a teen account and spend time with people I don't know where I'm the one having to stand over her shoulder every minute she's there. Frankly if my daughter tells me she really really wants to play in the teen grid, then I would be creating an account in that grid too to stay with her on our computers side by side in both RL and SL and to hell with whether it's against the rules or not. I don't want LL babysitting my kid, I want to do it myself.
But I also don't want her in the adult grid on a regular basis because honestly thats MY time, MY space and I enjoy it.

As for the walking to school.. Good Mom! Stick to that.

I've tried to just ignore your posts in this thread to avoid conflict... but you seriously make me want to spit in your face!

Concerning the Teen Grid, I have to first say that I don't really care what it is or what they do with it.

Well, we're really not all that different, after all. I agree about the problems with the teen grid.

What would you think of allowing parents to buy a private island (on the main grid), get accounts for their children, and have the childrens' avatars restricted to not be able to leave that island? I think that the capability to do this exists in SL already.

It would address all of my issues (and would get LL some additional revenue!). My daughter only wants to build a fairy-castle and play dress-up, anyway.

I guess sex will come later, but I can enjoy the innocence of youth while it lasts!

I'm guessing Kyrah is still very young, doesn't have any children and therefore doesn't understand the feeling of protectiveness a parent naturally has and clearly seems to still resent her own parents "walling her up" to keep her safe.

That I would go along with. Leave it up to the owner of the island whether they are willing to allow children or not. I will be honest and say that on one of my partner's islands we most certainly would not. But that island is built for a D/s community and it would be completely innappropriate. But on another island he has reserved for shopping, sure why not. Might even mean a whole new customer base.... or a reason to build an amusement park, whatever.

If LL said... ok you can let your underage children join you on the teen grid but we will verify that you are in fact a parent and child. And if your child is under ... let's say 13, that account can not be accessed unless your own is already logged in. (to prevent 5 yr olds from logging in while mommy is napping lol... something my sneaky little darling would have done at that age)

Take it a step further and link the two accounts in the same manner people can have a "partner" in their profile. Underage profiles will have a "parent" ... a name people can IM if said teenager is being a turd. Think of small towns where everyone knows who your parents are and will call them if they see you ditching school or swiping candy bars.

I still really like being able to put the mom side of me aside and just be in SL with no kids around me but under your idea, I still have that option while giving you the option to take your child on a virtual ferris wheel..... could work.

I really don't understand how seeing a woman's breasts will harm a 15 year old boy. How will this hurt him? Seriously, I don't see how this can possibly be damaging to anyone. They are just breasts, we all have them. Is there anyone here who can give me a serious explanation as to how this would harm him?

Is he suddenly going to snap and turn into a rapist is he sees breasts?

Will he be up in a bell tower with a rifle shooting people?

And don't tell me that it will “give him thoughts of sex”. He's 15! That's all he thinks about already, so you have to do better than that.

It's prefectly normal for a boy to want to look at breasts! The only way it will be harmful to him is if you make him feel "dirty" for doing it.

its harmful for the exact same reasons that a 15 year old cant run into the porno store and buy a Playboy. When I was 15 I looked at all the breasts I could find....hell i still do. That however isnt the question here. The question was if LL delivered on what they promised with the teen grid, and thats a resounding NO.

This is the question here because the examples used where pics of an avatar topless.

And your explanation of why it's harmful made no sense at all. Can you please elaborate on what you meant?

"It's the parents job!"

Many parents can't be bothered to raise there children.

Nothing here is taking rights away from parents.

Clearly a majority of you don't care what happens to children because only the parents should care, and if they don't care let the pedophiles have them.

This additude of 'not my problem not your problem' is why there are school shootings. (I didn't bring the topic up). Not because of breast but because 'only parents should take care and protect children.'

If you watch your own children good for you, but what about the lazy parents that don't care what there child does? From what you people are saying, no one should step in and try to protect them.

I am not going to look the other way just because you can't be bothered to care about making sure all children are taken care of not just the ones that have parents that do take care of them.

The only intent I'm assuming is that you are contradicting my post, otherwise why would you quote it?

I'm sorry if this is a sensitive topic for you, but try not to take it so personally.


I'm pretty sure I didn't say anything about them guaranteeing that they would keep out adults, and I really have no idea how they could possibly do that. Do you?


Yes, please provide that proof. The proof that there adult predators on the grid. Not proof that it is possible for an adult to get on the teen grid, that there are real predators and that the Lindens are not booting them and/or reporting them to the authorities.


Again, try not to be so sensitive, I never made an accusation. The word "if" is in my statement for a reason and it still stands:

if your teenager is going to be traumatized by the occasional boob or sexual slang then you should probably not let them on the teen grid. Or the web. Or in a movie theatre. Or a bookstore. Or in front of a TV. Oh just lock them in a closet until they're 18 and magically become adult.


It is understandable when parents freak out over the safety of their kids. Just please don't expect everyone else to freak out with you.

Well that is true. but if thy see their parents playing adult game they will too........

Parents ( being one my self of a 11month myself.........) I would not want my childeren in the adult grid even if it was old enough to understand.

Thousands of children die every year in auto accidents. Don't you think something should be done about that? How many more have to die in swimming pools before someone takes action and enacts a national ban on those death traps?

Won't somebody think of the children?

Seriously? I really need to rethink my stance on having conversations with people on these forums.

I agree with Vares. I don't have any moral or ethical problem with teenagers seeing the occasional female breast and don't think it will traumatize them.

Further, your reasoning that it's wrong for the same reason we don't let them look at Playboy was totally vacuous.

You can't raise your children as you see fit and make us responsible for them.

If you want us to pitch in, let us join in the decision making. My decision is that boobies are not bad for your kids. I'd rather them see that than have them exposed to a bunch of asshats who are calling their build "gay".

I haven't involved myself in the bare breast part of this for a reason, I might add.

While I do think running around nude should be an option, just like it isn't okay for someone to walk down the street without clothes on.

My issues are:
LL has opened up the teen grid to adults and the adult grid to the teens. Removing any 'protection' that might have taken place on the teen grid.

That a majority of people don't care about the fact these changes are harmful and want people to just shut up and do thing.

Everyone should be involved in protecting kids. If they where we wouldn't have half the problems we have right now.

In posting the link I wasn't so much pointing out "ooh no boobies!" I was saying the assurances we were given about the security on the teen grid were untrue. And I was more pointing to the references in the thread to proof of actual adults playing in the teen grid, further proof of LL's lack of security measures.

Seeing breasts isn't going to hurt a kid *laughs*. Hell I found a playboy under my son's bed when he was 12, yelled at him about it, only to find out he stole it from his dad. It's what they do. The danger is in allowing the wrong types of adults access to these kids in an environment where they are already sexually charged up and then denying access to the parents who are supposed to protect them.

It is unbelievably easy to gain access to the teen grid by breaking the rules (no security measures whatsoever) and at the same time LL is telling parents they're not allowed to create accounts there legitamitely (sp?).

I understand the concern, although I think it is oft overstated.

What I don't see are any serious proposals that solve the problem. Every theoretical solution seems to cause more difficulty or ruin the experience for someone else. I also don't see that LL has been gone back on any reasonable promise that they've made.

Actually it isn't and I haven't. I've simply taken a position.




No thats my point. They claimed it and can't keep the promise. Clearly (in my mind) it was a bad idea.




I did. You didn't look closely enough. If any adult can gain access (and I showed that they have)... someone among them WILL be there for predatory reasons. Anyone who says that isn't happening has their heads in the sand.




I'm not sensitive, I'm stating a position. You're reading emotion into my words that just isn't there.

I don't "freak out" I just protect. I don't protect my child from the existence of sex, of course not. I protect her from those who would take advantage of her. Fully grown aware adults are taken advantage of all the time. It would be irresponsible of me to assume my teenage daughter is any more savy at this point in her life.

Well the teen grid is there, whats done is done. I will grant that it would be pretty harsh to take it away from them now. As a parent my child won't be playing there with the lack of security measures in place. As a parent and a consumer my recomendation to LL would be higher security measures. Yes it is possible. No immediate registration. Demand a credit card, a phone number, the name of a parent. Guarantee that within a certain time frame upon registering an LL employee will be calling the phone number given and speaking to both the child and the parent and verifying that A) there is an actual teen wishing to play and B) that teen has parental consent.
My second recomendation would be that LL go back to insisting on an actual CC for age verification to gain access to the main grid. It's not a great inconvenience and is a commonly used method online.
So there's your serious proposals.

The reason I think you've taken it personally is that you took my general observation about overprotective parents and turned it into a personal attack.


Look, you started off quoting my post:

A reasonable person would assume that they police the teen grid more diligently, that they respond to complaints much quicker, that they pull questionable material when it becomes known, and that they close accounts that are obvious abusers.

Is there any evidence that they don't do this?

And you didn't offer any evidence to contradict me. That's where the confusion seemed to start.


But that's not what you said. You stated "Adult predators are getting in to the teen grid as easily as anyone gets into the adult grid."

That is an alarmist statement, IMO. I don't deny that it's possible for adults to get in the grid, but to state that you have proven that there are preditors on the grid is a big stretch. To be frank, the term "predator" is so broadly used that it is meaningless anyway. While there no doubt will be some adults who log on for prurient interests, that is a far stretch from implying that there will be any real physical interaction.

For clarity, can you post the original claims that LL made about the teen grid? I didn't see anything in the OP that differs greatly from the reports of current activity.

Here are the obvious problems with your teen grid proposal:

1) it would severely limit the number of new users
2) it would be very expensive
3) it wouldn't keep out serious predators anyway

LL is a business and I, for one, don't believe them to be complete idiots. I'm sure they've evaluated variations on your proposal and I think they've concluded that your proposal is not practical. I don't work for them and I can't say for sure, but I imagine one of the primary reasons for the teen grid is to keep kids off the main grid. I don't think they're planning on making a lot of money off of it, and if the cost is prohibitive to maintain it they will probably drop it altogether.


As for removing CC authorization, that is another business decision. I don't have as much info as they do, but it seems like it could be a reasonable way to grow their userbase quickly.

I was going to answer some of the questions tossed up about my post but Lana.. you did a much better job than I could have thank you. so to those people and the questions.. what she said!