Openspace Announcement Discussion with Jack Linden

These larmoyant announcement of encreasing the tiers makes me sick. You wanted busines with Openspace sims, You got busines and now you want cash more from the sim owners. That´s all. I cant remember that i had to subscribe some "fair use" or watherver regulation. fact is, You Linden just want raise the profit without return service. Thats not the first time i see this but this time its impertinent !

Most of the SL economy is represented in those so called free accounts.

They make stuff, people buy it, the "free people" pay tier to all the land barons screaming about the price increases. Well everyone is screaming about the price increases. I find it odd that some of the worst ad farmers in SL seem to be spending a lot of time getting people to abuse the TOS/CS by denial of service attacks in welcome centers. I guess the ad farmers want the open spacers forced back to the mainland so they can be subject to land extortion which is not even possible on islands. (well other than LL's)

There is a whole lot of funny business going on with this deal. It is like someone said GO and everyone started taking it out on everyone else.

Anyway, I went premium mainly to have technical support. I eventually grabbed some land next to a welcome center so now I need to be premium. But let's assume I did not have the land and dropped premium (as many many totally legit residents have and moved to islands). During the month of October I plied $740 US back into the SL economy. There are thousands like me out there and many ply a lot more back into the economy. A whole lot of them used to be premium and dropped premium to move to islands to get away from idiocracyland. So you are saying all those people should be banned from SL now.

Eliminating the free accounts would kill the economy permanently.

I think what would be much better is for people running bots to have to pay LL $1000 US a month per bot account. Be it traffic falsification, Texture stealing bots, land theft bots, whatever type of bots, a hefty license fee of $1000 a month for each bot. Since there appears to be around 40,000 bots in sl 24*7 now that adds up to $40,000,000 USD per month income. Of course most would be killed off but hey the problem with free accounts sucking up resources is caused by people that can afford to pay LL $1000 a month per bot. I think LL needs to look into that potential revenue stream pronto.

Please stop saying free accounts are worthless. It is ignorant to do so.

Please stop saying free accounts are worthless. It is ignorant to do so.[/QUOTE]


free accounts keep the number of members high, neglecting the open door for almost unlimited number of avas for one single RL person. and of course its a lure to get fresh RL people in and maybe get them as premium member some day.

the financial potential of 90 % of free account holders is around zero, free account opens abuse for griefer, and: never forget the word, that things which are free arent worth much in the opinion of the consumer. at least a small summe of payment should be the general standard for taking part in SL.

Free account holders spend a lot of money in SL. I dropped my premium account because there is no value in having it. I still drop a LOT of money into SL. Instead of giving it to the Lindens I give it to the businesses in SL. If there was some value received for the fee then I would have kept the premium account. But all it allows me to do is own land - but I can't afford the outrageous setup costs for a private island and the mainland is useless. But if you really want to eliminate the source of funds for the businesses in SL, go ahead and kick everyone out. Seems stupid to me.

Sorry, but why do you think Linden Labs is more then a Company what tried to maximise profit ? So its a proven tool to let customers hyperventilate in pseudo conversations with the company, till they get tired. As you can recognise, the only ones who communicate are we, the customers. Linden Labs have special keyboards with a very bid DELETE key.
Sorry to take away your dreams.

free accounts keep the number of members high, neglecting the open door for almost unlimited number of avas for one single RL person. and of course its a lure to get fresh RL people in and maybe get them as premium member some day.

the financial potential of 90 % of free account holders is around zero, free account opens abuse for griefer, and: never forget the word, that things which are free arent worth much in the opinion of the consumer. at least a small summe of payment should be the general standard for taking part in SL.[/QUOTE]

i have a lot of people with free accounts on needles, they all pay tier, lots are alts for shop owners, sim owners, land barons(lol i have a few), and anyone else wishing a break from im,s, so not all are worthless, the ones that are the problem are the ones used for pushing up traffic. its hard to see how linden labs can define an unwanted free account, so this one might get forgotten

May i ask if you would have dropped the account and left SL if there was no free account ?
I am happy to find someone out of the 10 % free avas who spend money.
The problem of free griefing is to neglect ? as owner of 13 sims i tell you i change free accounts for keeping griefers away.

ban bots, less load, fair traffic search and happy login server

but that would ofcourse pop your outworld "70,000 concurrent users!" bubble for the outside world and grow rate is reduced to 1 new resident a day compared to 100 bots a day...

you just want more money, no matter what
discussion is pointless as it`s just to keep people busy untill they`re thrown a bone like a new sculpty or what ever

i hope the ones that are in the position to make it hurt where you hurt us, will succedd

on the note that Mos was NOT a void but a mis-configured full sim, LOL...

No, if there were only paid accounts I never would have come to SL. Been ripped off by pay-to-play trash too often.

Sorry snowflake, i cant follow. "Intentions" are no part of any contact by buing an OS, cant remember that i got any regulations to accept. Linden took my RL money and not my intended money. And i become sick to listen to the whining reasons they present to cover up the greed and the neglection of busines partnership.

In any honest business, with a price increase this big, they would allow customers to opt out paying for the high price because it was not in the terms of condition when they bought the land.

There is no way to opt out of this, except either abandon your land (which would make Linden very happy - they shoot two birds with one stone) or sell your land at a loss if there is any buyers left.

If Linden is any decent business, you would expect them to offer a buy back the land for those who opt out of paying the higher tier, but that would totally defeat they game plan of ripping you off as much as they can.

Now, who is really the scum landlord?

Ahhh, doesn't this sound familiar to the recent financial crisis of raising the interest rate and then foreclose the home on people?

So how about havin free accounts for a limited time ? everyone can check whats up and is free to leave or to pay after lats say one month ?

nothing more or better to say

There would be some value in that. But I know of people who cannot afford to be members. THey use the camping (small amounts - they have limited net access) to get L$ that they then put back into the world.

I know of paid account holders that never put a dime back into SL. They collect rents and almost never even log in - they just convert the L$ to RL money.
Sure, they aren't using the same resources as a freebie, but they aren't contributing to the community in ideas or anything else.

....and came somehow to free accounts. thats ok but maybe a side issue. ty for conversation, but i turn back to the most vital OS topic.

That is exactly right. You just got suckered in, and swallowed the sink and hook altogether when they throw you that freebie bait. Now you are paying for it.

If you think that this price increase only hurt the OS owner, think again. This is trickle down theory.

When someone is paying more for rent (or tier), they have to absorb the cost somewhere else, when the cost of doing business goes up, it spreads around, and you will see a price increase in the things you buy in SL, and you will see people start charging you for going into their sim. You will pay for this one way or another.

If everybody left in protest or out of desperation, Linden would be left without any income stream (that they thought they would by jacking up the price), the next thing they will be forced to do is to jack up the price for mainland and private island, and start charging all residents for monthly fee.

Linden is shooting themselves in the foot thinking that this is only limited to OS owners, but as you know, greed is very short-sighted. If greed is any far-sighted, we would not have the financial meltdown in Wall Street.

Linden has not learned this lesson yet, I don't think they will. How do you expect a greedy mind to think that far?

I do have a premium membership.... but after seeing how LL treats its residents, I'm not sure I will continue come next billing period (which is mid next year btw). I believed in the dream that SL was promising, only for that dream to be shattered with LL proving they are just another company out to make a buck from its captive audience. Oh, how naive of me!!!

I don't mind paying for something I like doing. But as someone said, if there is no benefit, whats the point? I've already lost faith and trust in the dream.

Now there are so many alternatives out there, they maybe not as polished as SL, but they are there, and with the potential exodus of talent from here, the other places could benefit from disgruntled SL dreamers, and in the process making them into something SL was and could have been. Way to go LL.

In the worst case scenario, I can just download one of many FREE opensim simulator packages and run a simulator on my own PC. then I can do what the hell I want with MY sim on MY terms and on MY gear, tier free.

So, if things keep going the way they seem to be (and at the moment its not up) then I will have to need some serious convincing of the benefits of a premium account in the future.


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and on free accounts, not everyone has access to ready methods of payment to LL. I used to launder money for a friend (with a free account) in eastern Europe, they would wire me the cash via Western Union, I'd cash it in, put onto my CC, buy the lindens, and give it to them in world, as they had no other method of getting cash into the game. And we are not talking about a paltry $10 either here. So just because someone has a free account, doesn't mean they don't "invest" money into the game (sadly, thats what SL is turning into - just another game)

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And all this infighting that seems to be appearing between some residents.. now wasn't their a saying for that?

Divide and Conquer!!

this is not a fair way of doing business.
This way there will never be a sc win-win situation. Instead, a permanent win-loose relation is in fact institutionalized.

We, the residents, should get organized, dammit !
Star a group representing a large majority of residents and have a representation that discusses major changes (like pricing, usage, etc) in negotiations.

That would be a democratic way of solving things and a fair way of doing business.
Not a dictate.

Best regards.

it seems to me that more is going on, looking at things that led up to this,

"large corporates well set up in sl", would they prefer there own grid on there own servers than pay tier.
"sl is closed and will fail" i CEO of a large corprate said this, is this a hint they want an open grid.
"google will have a open grid soon", ah, and sl is a closed grid at mo, now the clouds are clearing

question, if an open grid as good as sl was to appear would extates and corporates set up in that, if so what would sl be left with.

answer mainland.

question, why put up the private estate prices

answer, they will go soon and we really need to develop mainland so that when it joins the open grid its the leader in this and most tp for us to the corporates earning us extra income

mmm just a thought

This is capitalism at work. Raise the price as high as the consumers can bear. That is how capitalism works.

Democracy? That's what they want you to think. That's why they open this thread so you can rant and rave, and believe that you have some say to it.

The reality? If you think Linden will change their mind on this, good luck.

Fool me once, shame on them. Fool me twice, shame on me.

LOL, and we see how good capitalism is going at the moment.... Privatise the profits when things are going great and socialise the losses when things go sour. Can anyone say bailout?.

Bailout: When taxpayers get conned into footing the bill for the mistakes of greedy companies.

LL made a mistake. This price hike sounds like a bailout to me

We all must recognise, SL is a fake world with fake rules and fake moral. This is called virtual in IT language. The real thing is our money and thats all they want. Take it or leave it. Maybe this time I leave it........

can you deliver some links for this ? would apreciate.

I am not a very technical or a computer savvy person, so I do not understand all of the technical discussions about the price increases for open space sims. Perhaps they were underpriced when first introduced or they are not being used as intended. But I do understand human nature and know most people who see their rent (tier payment) increase 2/3rds in one day will find another place to rent. An increase that huge in a single day taste too much like price gouging. Second Life is a great chat program and I love coming in world to chat. But it is NOT the only chat program on the internet. If this price increase goes into effect as planned I will do as many others will do and simply walk away from Second Life forever.

I posted this under the thread "Openspace" but wanted it here too in case LL actually read some of these .....

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Tried Openlife

I joined up and tried Openlife for a while today. It is worth doing - kinda fun to be reminded how it was way back when you were a total noob. It won't take long for them to catch up with LL, although if they are smart, they will go different direction. I think the future will be with a program like Nurien which will come along seemingly out of no where and make mincemeat of Second Life. Their demo on YouTube boggles the mind.

LL has blown the tremendous advantage of being groundbreakers and the first in a new world of entertainment and business. They have squandered years of good will. Even the boring, loyal types like me will leave when a good option comes along.

Tick tick tick tick ... what is that sound Linden? Even if you don't care - your banker will.