Please help fight camping

However you conveniently ignore other real facts in your rationalizations.

Therefore Excuses is accurate.

On WoW you can have 10 on each of 100 odd servers characters but only log on in at a time. Unless you PAY $16 per month for another account which they don't mind at all, but the goldfarmers still earn more than that anyways even there. They pay rooms full of kids a bowl of rice to play the game for 10 hours to sell the items and gold.
I guess if we paid and had unlimited alts that you could only run 2 at a time and perhaps could transfer even non transfer stuff between alts
Griefing wouldn't be a problem because LL link everything back to the main account.
Trouble is like it or not free accounts are always going to be here, so we just need to restrict them somehow so they can't take money out to RL for example. But this then ruins the idea of islands where free accounts can own a sim if they like. And people would just transfer money through alts to one that could withdraw the cash.
One account per email would be fine IF we were allowed to change our displayed name, and just had a main account ID that applied to all our transactions and creations.
Or Just maybe they should send a verify email to all free accounts once every 3 months and delete them if they don't reply within 3 months so these farmers don't just create emails and delete them after they are registered.
And lets just kill off search for business purposes , let the market set up 3rd party search engines and the residents decide then what to use.

So when eveyone has 39 or 99 campers per sim 24/7 what next?
If LL didn't want all sims full of campers they'd say so, but it seems they do

What other facts?

If you mean resources, I think you know my views on that, and that I ensure that what I do doesn't affect other people's use of the sim that I'm in.

Yep and if you want more than one you pay for extra ones. Problem with this is being free they just allow bottrunners more bots per account.

I mean the reasons for the traffic metric you keep brushing that aside like its a minor thing.

I get that you are a realist and not an idealist.

But its not necessary to dismiss all idealism out of hand.

I suppose I have brushed it aside, although I did say (in the long thread) that I don't mind at all if the Places search is scrapped.

Yes, I'm a realist - I have to be since I'm making a living from SL. I'm competing in the ways that exist at this time, but I'm intentionally doing it with little or no impact on anyone else (resources, lag), as you probably remember.

In SL, ideallism and business don't go together, unfortunately, for the simple reason that the listings at the top of the search results get the most traffic. As long as the results are displayed in ranking order, and nn per page, then idealism and business can't be united. It's exactly the same with Web search engines, and it's a big problem with them that they'll have to sort out sooner or later.

(I'm talking about serious business - not fun business)

It would be possible to say what you just did without dismissing the intention behind the idealistic reasons for the Traffic metric.

That is why I have said you sound like you are making a lot of excuses.

Truth is traffic wasn't supposed to be bought in paid for.

Truth is it became bought and paid for, and even the Lindens are complicit, lets be honest - they got greedy. Its understandable. But it did happen.

Thus I see why you do it. But I see no value in keeping Traffic around, because it was never supposed to be what it is now.

What it is now is ugly.

Do Lindens camp? Its not against the ToS.. and they do shop and stuff..so...camp?

Second Life became one big camping zone.

They removed some of the numbers involved off the front page ..

But they have/ or still do boast about

Number of accounts -

Number of people online-

USD spent in world (which includes camping)

LindenX activity



Its all been a big bloated numbers fest after 6/06/06 in an attempt to use their INFLATED TRAFFIC numbers to lure business.

I may have sounded dismissive of the original intent, Colette. If I did, I apologise. I wasn't intending to sound dismissive; I was pointing out that what was intended doesn't actually exist these days, and it's these days that we live in and deal with.

That is true.

And in the current climate, I certainly see why you have traffic bots.

I said in the other thread the problem isn't you, its the system.

Everyone boasts about that though, really

MMORPGS boast about accounts created, how many are for PL services and gold/plat farmers?

MMORPGS boast about # of people online, again.. how many are actually playing it to play it?

USD spent in world.. anything with a RL economy turnover would boast about it most likely. Well.. as long as it was enough to boast. And yet again, every day, people buy money in every world and such. In leaderboards for things like Everquest 2, there is a 'wealthiest player' bit.. I suspect, based on the player name, that the wealthiest is actually a plat-farming service account.

You boast about what you can, in everything. Its part of advertising.
"I've done 50 builds!"

OK, well, how many of them were rebuilding the first one until the customer was satisfied?

The amount the numbers were inflated were quite substantially higher than other MMOs

The USD spent inworld is a false number since they get passed around many times. It isn't wealth.

The numbers that matters is how much LindenX activity there is. And how much is being spent on land.

For the most part they don't in RL either. Phil has unashamedly stated he is a serious SL businessman. He is using strategies that if applied in RL might get him on the cover of a magazine, or maybe even a TV show where he can tell people , "Your fired" There are a lot of parralels to RL here save the fact that most people don't run a RL business for fun That's where the disconnect is. Phil's stance may be aggravating, arrogant, unfair,and sleazy. But it isn't at all surprising given his objective. Until things change all you can do as a consumer is take your business elsehwere when a merchant has objectionable practices, as I do in RL with WalMart for example, and tell anyone who may be interested why.

So we're not playing ping pong between two threads, I hope I'm forgiven for bringing a quote over from the other Camping thread. In it, Colette, you stated regarding Phil:



Is he making excuses or just stating his opinion?

I'm sorry Colette, I'm not being argumentative, but I really don't understand at this point what you are trying to accomplish via this discussion.

Are you trying to get people to stop using camping?

Are you just trying to get them to admit it's wrong?

I wouldn't even let the fact Phil uses Traffic bots stop me from shopping at his store.

I have basically been arguing a principle, not the fact that hes a bad person for using them.

I don't think he is.

The name Phil annoys me, but thats another matter has nothing to do with him.

That reminds me, does Phil have sculpty realistic sized beds?

Brenda doesn't shop at Wal Mart? Bradley who hasn't stepped foot in one in over 15 years gives Brenda a big loving hug.

There are also more real accounts than most MMOs, because of what it is, and because you cant have multiple characters on one, as MMOs do. I think the inflation is proportionate to the actual amount.. the more there are, the bigger the inflation.


The numbers here arent the same as my example of wealth in EQ2, however, in anything with a Real world economy structure, you're going to have the same essential results. They can't really differentiate between buying and just passing around, since there is really no difference when you get right down to it. On of em you just get something more in return.

I'm trying to get them to stop trying to claim its right.

Thats all.

Thats untrue, since they include the numbers of people who have left, which is around 90%

How about my belief:

The current traffic system is wrong.

Taking advantage of the current system as it stands is perfectly ok.

I'll stand by that.

/me takes the opportunity to pinch Bradley's cheeks. I've never set foot in one. My Mom insists on going, I let her out and I wait in the car,

I agree that it's the system. But as long as search is done the way it, both in SL and on the Web, it will continue.

An aside:
Do you remember me saying that the place at the top of certain rankings doesn't sell what the land title and description says it sells, and that I decided to take that top spot? During that thread, the owner of that place removed all but one of the campers, and is now low down on the first results page. I wonder why he removed them. Now I don't need the amount of traffic to keep the #1 ranking for that phrase, so I don't keep as many in 24/7 as I did before.

The accounts do still exist, unless I'm mistaken, they are just flagged inactive. Because most people dont delete accunts (I'm not sure if you truly can), they still are counted because they are in the system.

With most MMOs, you have to pay or you cant play, so its easy to differentiate. Simply "If this person isnt paying, take them out of this database"

In SL it owuld have to be "If this person isnt paying, and has been inactive for X amount of days, and likely has no intention of coming back, remove from this database". Since many people are still paying, because they might come back, theres part of it. Since many people are not paying but sign i occasionally to try it again since they can, theres more.

Since SL cant differentiate between truly dead and just gone for a while, its harder to do, I'd think.