My wife and I both work in the financial sector and although my company is doing fine so far I do feel like my company could explode at any time. I know it's a pretty flimsy hope but if it does ever come to that I'm really hoping SL can tide me by until I get another real job. As a result I've been working harder in SL, consolidating my position, trying to increase profitability any way I can think of. It does mean I'm avoiding putting on too many new risky positions, like buying new sims and it means I'm ditching old projects that are just costing money.
As some others have said I also think SL will see growth during "tough economic times" because people can come here and buy new shoes for US$0.50 instead of US$500 and have fun for a very cheap price, even free. Since I'm in the business of taking all those tiny amounts of money people spend for fun and putting them into one big pot that adds up to a more useful sum I can see good growth potential here.
On the other hand, it's an absurd place to risk financial solvency on. LL could sell out to Google, or go bankrupt, or change some crazy thing that puts me out of business. There's gotta be a 1 in 5 chance that LL will do something ridiculous that will bankrupt me in the next year. As a result, sadly, SL will never be a place I can rely on for my main income but it's sure going to help if my wife or I lose our jobs.
edit: Jesus Christ Jig, it makes me angry just reading your crap. Fix your deliberate typos it takes, like, 1 second.
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Elanthius Flagstaff
Registered User
Join date: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 1,534
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03-01-2009 10:27
_____________________
Visit http://ninjaland.net for mainland and covenant rentals or visit our amazing land store at Steamboat (199, 56).
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Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
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03-01-2009 10:43
I'm in the Brann Fann Club as well on this. We all know the Drive By Media will spin everything towards the most negative, as will the politicians. The system was long overdue for collapse, i see it as a big correction. Unfortunately the people most responsible are not getting hurt by it, and in a sense are now the very ones who tell us they have the plan to fix it, which I do not believe, personally.
In any event, the situation hasn't affected my SL spending, which is just a small portion of my entertainment budget. I think there is a growth potential for SL, but as we have seen, growth has to also take into account stability. LL has shown in the past a tendency for unchecked growth to almost unmanageable proportions. I'm not the type that would risk any huge amount on virtual worlds, at least not right now, but if I were, I would not take a risk on SL as currently run by LL. They don't instill enough confidence in me. _____________________
Don't you ever try to look behind my eyes. You don't want to know what they have seen.
http://brenda-connolly.blogspot.com |
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CarlCorey Colman
Fnord
Join date: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 177
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03-01-2009 11:43
Well I'm glad all you people who are saying things like like "crisis? what crisis?", "media spin" and "mass hysteria" are so well insulated that you can afford that affectation. After 26 years of constant employment, the last 11 at the same company, I find myself suddenly out of my high paying, white collar job due to a workforce reduction action along with about 1000 others (and this was the third of three (so far) such actions). I for one would love to say that since I was laid off from my job I find myself with much more time for SL but that just ain't the case. I'm spending all my time sending out resumes, searching job postings and working my network hoping to find something before my severance pay runs out and they cut me off the medical plan.
I have been building and scripting a little more in what spare time I have though. Perhaps because that's something I can actually control, unlike pretty much all of RL right now. _____________________
Reality leaves a lot to the imagination.
John Lennon |
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Jig Chippewa
Fine Young Cannibal
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,150
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03-01-2009 12:51
edit: Jesus Christ Jig, it makes me angry just reading your crap. Fix your deliberate typos it takes, like, 1 second. Sincerest apologs Elanthius. But hang on, I just read my posts - there are no "deliberate typos" - it looks fine to me. Just typed and posted and serious posts at that. And your punctuation leaves much to be desired. And "gotta"? - tut tut. _____________________
Fine Young Cannibal
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Desmond Shang
Guvnah of Caledon
Join date: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 5,250
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03-01-2009 13:05
I've seen the economic effect both ways.
Both some people leaving land parcels due to RL troubles, and others investing more of their precious entertainment time and dollar here because of how far money can go here. I've also seen merchants dig in and get more involved, as they do make money here still. Some, *very* good money. So it's win and lose at the same time. If you stand still in any economy, you lose. If you change as best you can with the times, you win. If anything, there is more opportunity here than there ever has been, if you work out how things are going to go. _____________________
 Steampunk Victorian, Well-Mannered Caledon! |
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Jig Chippewa
Fine Young Cannibal
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,150
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03-01-2009 13:40
I've seen the economic effect both ways. Both some people leaving land parcels due to RL troubles, and others investing more of their precious entertainment time and dollar here because of how far money can go here. I've also seen merchants dig in and get more involved, as they do make money here still. Some, *very* good money. So it's win and lose at the same time. If you stand still in any economy, you lose. If you change as best you can with the times, you win. If anything, there is more opportunity here than there ever has been, if you work out how things are going to go. I think the REAL problem for sl will be when the people making "very good money" here are made to pay "very good" taxes by the real countries in which they reside. I have to pay taxes on everything I earn in real - why shouldn't business people making income here pay taxes also? This isnt an official tax haven, is it? _____________________
Fine Young Cannibal
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Elanthius Flagstaff
Registered User
Join date: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 1,534
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03-01-2009 13:43
I think the REAL problem for sl will be when the people making "very good money" here are made to pay "very good" taxes by the real countries in which they reside. I have to pay taxes on everything I earn in real - why shouldn't business people making income here pay taxes also? This isnt an official tax haven, is it? I don't have evidence but I imagine that the majority of serious sized businesses in SL do pay taxes on their earnings. I know Desmond does and we do too. _____________________
Visit http://ninjaland.net for mainland and covenant rentals or visit our amazing land store at Steamboat (199, 56).
Also, we pay L$0.15/sqm/week for tier donated to our group and we rent pure tier to your group for L$0.25/sqm/week. Free L$ for Everyone - http://ninjaland.net/tools/search-scumming/ |
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Jig Chippewa
Fine Young Cannibal
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,150
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03-01-2009 13:55
I don't have evidence but I imagine that the majority of serious sized businesses in SL do pay taxes on their earnings. I know Desmond does and we do too. I am sure you do; I didnt say anything about anyone concerning tax payments. I can see that it could hamper growth of sl as more and more countries in teh world see potential tax revenues from business persons in sl and other computer generated "virtual" businesses. It's a potential goldmine for taxes, don't you agree? How many people setting up shop here expect to have teh tax man come knocking? Look at how VAT caused many businesses to shift out of sl. To my knowledge, several art galleries simply disappeared overnight - well, in a blink of an eye, even. But by "potential" I recognize that it is prolly small potatoes at this juncture of teh century but in 50 years this could be a mainstay of revenues for many countries. Imagine how India and China will be able to gain benefits as worlds like SL blossom and businesses become more sophisticated. _____________________
Fine Young Cannibal
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Jezebella Desmoulins
Registered User
Join date: 4 Nov 2005
Posts: 561
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03-01-2009 14:05
I am sure you do; I didnt say anything about anyone concerning tax payments. I can see that it could hamper growth of sl as more and more countries in teh world see potential tax revenues from business persons in sl and other computer generated "virtual" businesses. It's a potential goldmine for taxes, don't you agree? And by "potential" I recognize that it is prolly small potatoes at this juncture of teh century but in 50 years this could be a mainstay of revenues for many countries. Imagine how India and China will be able to gain benefits as worlds like SL blossom and businesses become more sophisticated. Not sure what you're getting at. The only people India and China can impose an income tax on to get part of the SL pie (mmm, pie) are those people who are RL residents of India and China, respectively. Any US resident who is making RL money from SL business had better be paying taxes on it already. In the eyes of the IRS, money made from an online business is no different than money made from brick and mortar business. |
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Latrans Renard
Registered User
Join date: 13 Nov 2007
Posts: 7
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03-01-2009 14:09
As an estate owner (2 sims), I pretty much agree with what Desmond said.
However, if it were not for the fact that my RL income for 2008 was much higher than expected, I would be looking to cut back on my SL expenses, or would have already done so. Even though in the past 2 weeks I have gained 4 tenants on my estate and only lost 1, my rents still only reimburse me for about 1/3 of what I have to pay LL each month. I think there are 2 categories of residents who have or will be reducing the money they spend on SL: a) Owners of small estates where finding enough renters to cover expenses is difficult at best. b) Those who have lost a considerable amount of the income they used to receive from employment and/or investments. If enough estate owners decide to cut back by dropping sims, LL could get into a very shaky financial situation. |
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Jig Chippewa
Fine Young Cannibal
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,150
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03-01-2009 14:14
Not sure what you're getting at. The only people India and China can impose an income tax on to get part of the SL pie (mmm, pie) are those people who are RL residents of India and China, respectively. Any US resident who is making RL money from SL business had better be paying taxes on it already. In the eyes of the IRS, money made from an online business is no different than money made from brick and mortar business. Okay, well I agree. But growing market that will eventualy prolly outstrip US in next 50 years in the technology-growth potential markets of India and Asia as a whole. I dont see sl as really lasting fifty years BUT I do see advanced equivalents. THOSE citizens from THOSE countries will be expected to pay taxes by THEIR countries. I dont live in USA either. Rigth now I guess most businesses are rooted in USA but that will change - and as global economy shifts in customer-base - many more businesses (even in sl) will be based OUTSIDE of USA. That is all I meant. And let's not forget Africa and Arab world. The continental potential is beyond our scope to imagine. Taking this a bit further, I well appreciate the strength of American influence within sl - as a non-American it is obvious to me. But as more an more countries become technologically capable of entertaining teh idea of consistent presence in such worlds, US influence will be subjected to a more global viewpoint economically and culturally. _____________________
Fine Young Cannibal
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Nina Stepford
was lied to by LL
Join date: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 3,373
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03-01-2009 17:45
what has really hit me is the crash of the exchange rate.
$1aud used to by .93usd. now it is buying .63usd, meaning my estate tier has increased by nearly 30%  _____________________
SLU - ban em then bash em!
~~GREATEST HITS~~ pro-life? gtfo! slu- banning opposing opinions one at a time http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/zomgwtfbbqgtfololcats/15428-disingenuous.html learn to shut up and nod in agreement... or be banned! http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/off-topic/1239-americans-not-stupid.html |
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eku Zhong
Apocalips = low prims
Join date: 27 May 2008
Posts: 752
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03-01-2009 19:13
Japan the 'crisis' has hit hard with many businesses cutting back to 4 and even 3 day work weeks. Japanese ppl are not good at managing their leisure time, because, up until now, it was regimented and sparce. But one thing Japanese like to do in their free time is shop.
I have seen Japanese ppl spending more money in SL than ever before. Ppl need their 'feelgood' and if it is too dear in RL, then SL is a pretty good alternative. _____________________
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Ralektra Breda
Template Painter
Join date: 7 Apr 2008
Posts: 1,875
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03-01-2009 19:35
<snip> edit: Jesus Christ Jig, it makes me angry just reading your crap. Fix your deliberate typos it takes, like, 1 second. sometimes I read almost like a few lines by accident, hit a 'teh' and remember to skip that post _____________________
 Mainstore: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Phantasm/51/164/501 http://rbzdesign.blogspot.com/ I'm not a designer IRL, but I RP one on SL! |
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Darkness Anubis
Registered User
Join date: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,628
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03-01-2009 19:44
sometimes I read almost like a few lines by accident, hit a 'teh' and remember to skip that post You know I make the "teh" mistake fair often and don't always catch it. Has to do with being a lousy typist not a deliberate piss off. So I do apologize in advance.  _____________________
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Stephen Artful
Registered User
Join date: 23 Feb 2009
Posts: 24
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03-01-2009 20:15
sometimes I read almost like a few lines by accident, hit a 'teh' and remember to skip that post At the risk of derailing my own thread, I've got to ask what the big deal is about 'teh' ? Unless you're in a situation where you want to prove a certain level of education or ability in the english language, who really cares except for anally retentive people with far too much to prove and even more time on their hands? The sign of a really talented communicator anyway, is the ability to tailor their vocabulary and message so that the target audience understands them. SL and the SL forums are a places of recreation (for the most part) and a place where we can be who we want to be. Marianne is free and welcome to simulate baby speech in order to support the image she portrays and if someone chooses to type "teh" instead of "the" who really cares? As long as what they are trying to say is of interest and I can understand the message then I'm happy. To be honest what's the big deal about "teh" anyway, it's not as if it can be confused with many other words. I'd rather read an interesting and entertaining post written in an eccentric but understandable way, than some anally retentive diatribe on the grammatical shortcomings of the world today. Although maybe I'm being a bit dim, I've noticed the "teh" issue derailing a few threads now. Is this the new and similarly sophisticated version of "pie" spam which was bothering the forums last time I was here? |
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Nina Stepford
was lied to by LL
Join date: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 3,373
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03-01-2009 20:28
i agree.
At the risk of derailing my own thread, I've got to ask what the big deal is about 'teh' ? _____________________
SLU - ban em then bash em!
~~GREATEST HITS~~ pro-life? gtfo! slu- banning opposing opinions one at a time http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/zomgwtfbbqgtfololcats/15428-disingenuous.html learn to shut up and nod in agreement... or be banned! http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/off-topic/1239-americans-not-stupid.html |
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Locke Renfort
Registered User
Join date: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 7
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03-01-2009 21:01
I wish people would stop throwing around terms like "credit crunch" and "these tough economic times" like some sort of demented mantra. Ben Bernanke goes on record to say that he THINKS that the year isn't going to be as bad as predicted and suddenly stock markets go up. How about we ALL say things aren't so bad and maybe the folks creating stock market mayhem will be lulled into thinking all is well, the market will go back up and we'll just agree to call an end to the recession. I was taught to manage my money responsibly and the only effect these "tough economic times" have had is that some things can be had a lot cheaper because everyone is trying to sell stuff. Not so for some items. All the doom and gloom in the news and a democratic majority has many firearms afficionados freaking out. The price of some guns have as much as tripled and ammunition is flying off the shelves as fast as retailers can stock it. If you go to the guns and ammo counter in most WalMarts and sporting goods stores and ask for any popular caliber you just get blank looks and are told to try again after their next truck delivery. Applications for carry permits are at record numbers right now. There was even an article over at MSNBC last week advising that now's a good time to invest in gun manufacturers and gold. |
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Jig Chippewa
Fine Young Cannibal
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,150
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03-01-2009 21:29
sometimes I read almost like a few lines by accident, hit a 'teh' and remember to skip that post Lol, Rale, you didnt skip wasting a moment or two posting d'ja? _____________________
Fine Young Cannibal
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Peggy Paperdoll
A Brat
Join date: 15 Apr 2006
Posts: 4,383
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03-01-2009 21:50
Not so for some items. All the doom and gloom in the news and a democratic majority has many firearms afficionados freaking out. The price of some guns have as much as tripled and ammunition is flying off the shelves as fast as retailers can stock it. If you go to the guns and ammo counter in most WalMarts and sporting goods stores and ask for any popular caliber you just get blank looks and are told to try again after their next truck delivery. Applications for carry permits are at record numbers right now. There was even an article over at MSNBC last week advising that now's a good time to invest in gun manufacturers and gold. Well things like that happen when the Congressional majority allows less than 8 hours for an 1,100 page bill to be read and debated before a vote. People see that as anything but the democratic process.....it alarms them. It's scarey in that it sort of makes one think that a revolution may in the making. Lord knows there's a ton of extremely unhappy people in this country. Almost makes me wonder why I haven't made the trip to the gun/ammo store myself. |
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Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
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03-02-2009 03:43
I wish people would stop throwing around terms like "credit crunch" and "these tough economic times" like some sort of demented mantra. Ben Bernanke goes on record to say that he THINKS that the year isn't going to be as bad as predicted and suddenly stock markets go up. How about we ALL say things aren't so bad and maybe the folks creating stock market mayhem will be lulled into thinking all is well, the market will go back up and we'll just agree to call an end to the recession. I was taught to manage my money responsibly and the only effect these "tough economic times" have had is that some things can be had a lot cheaper because everyone is trying to sell stuff. When a friend said she was worried about buying a new fridge in these tough economic times I asked her if she was losing her job. She looked at me in surprise and said: "No, of course not." What did she think was going to happen to her new fridge? I realize that people who have/had manufacturing jobs or those who let their debt go beyond what they can afford are suffering right now, but that doesn't mean we have to perpetuate this mess by sitting on our piggy banks. I'm not about to stop spending my weekly five bucks in SL because someone else decides that there is a credit crunch. "Can people really come to SL and build a viable online business which is more than a hobby? " For most SL entrepreneurs that wasn't happening before this "credit crunch". It's not about to become a viable business model now.  Oh, and that is the sarcastic emoticon in case you are so misguided that you think I am agreeing with you.Pep (If you don't understand what is happening, then you might at least have the sense to avoid making yourself look stupid by commenting on it) _____________________
Hypocrite lecteur, — mon semblable, — mon frère!
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Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
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03-02-2009 03:47
I think the REAL problem for sl will be when the people making "very good money" here are made to pay "very good" taxes by the real countries in which they reside. I have to pay taxes on everything I earn in real - why shouldn't business people making income here pay taxes also? This isnt an official tax haven, is it? Pep (educating even those that don't want to be educated) _____________________
Hypocrite lecteur, — mon semblable, — mon frère!
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Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
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03-02-2009 03:52
Might I suggest that posters to this thread stop demonstrating their lack of comprehension of the global economic situation and focus on the effect it is having on sl, which is the question posed?
Pep (That way, your opinions might have some credibility) _____________________
Hypocrite lecteur, — mon semblable, — mon frère!
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Neptune Shelman
Registered User
Join date: 1 Aug 2008
Posts: 329
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03-02-2009 07:35
I wish people would stop throwing around terms like "credit crunch" and "these tough economic times" like some sort of demented mantra. Ben Bernanke goes on record to say that he THINKS that the year isn't going to be as bad as predicted and suddenly stock markets go up. How about we ALL say things aren't so bad and maybe the folks creating stock market mayhem will be lulled into thinking all is well, the market will go back up and we'll just agree to call an end to the recession. Many people are suffering from the affects of these tough economic times, indications are that the economic situation will continue to worsen for the next few months at least, your statement is rather belittling to people who may have a genuine concern about their current financial situation. I was taught to manage my money responsibly and the only effect these "tough economic times" have had is that some things can be had a lot cheaper because everyone is trying to sell stuff. When a friend said she was worried about buying a new fridge in these tough economic times I asked her if she was losing her job. She looked at me in surprise and said: "No, of course not." What did she think was going to happen to her new fridge? Yes I was taught to manage my money responsibly, and must say am benifiting also from the current financial situation, however I still have enough compassion and thought to realise, people who's jobs are affected will need more than simple money management to help them get through very real crisis in their lives. I realize that people who have/had manufacturing jobs or those who let their debt go beyond what they can afford are suffering right now, but that doesn't mean we have to perpetuate this mess by sitting on our piggy banks. I'm not about to stop spending my weekly five bucks in SL because someone else decides that there is a credit crunch. No you are right and I aggree, You shouldn't sit on your piggy bank as you call it. If you are fortunate enough to be financially safe, then do continue to spend, if people with money also stop spending then the affects do become worse. "Can people really come to SL and build a viable online business which is more than a hobby? " For most SL entrepreneurs that wasn't happening before this "credit crunch". It's not about to become a viable business model now. I tend to agree here also, SL does seem to attract many users who's goal is to just make money from any business they create on the platform and most of these users must make little or no income, possibly they may even struggle to cover tier costs. Personally I would be happier that someone wanted to purchase any of my creations than with the income they would generate. |
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Brann Georgia
Spits infinitives
Join date: 12 Dec 2007
Posts: 1,441
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03-02-2009 09:54
Pep (If you don't understand what is happening, then you might at least have the sense to avoid making yourself look stupid by commenting on it) I notice that you don't call Lil or Amaranthim stupid for agreeing with me, choosing to mete out your spitefulness to people whom you dislike. Nice going, Dippy. I didn't say the present situation is a figment of anyone's imagination. I object to tossing catchphrases around until they become meaningless and of mass hysteria making matters worse. Glad I could give you another opportunity to exercise your somewhat creepy impulses to put others down. Get therapy already. _____________________
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