just ignore and let this one die

Maybe you should change your forum title...

And who the hell decides what "more than their fair share of the wealth" is? If someone works his or her ass off to provide a decent living for their families should a government decide that it is too much and it should go to someone else that chooses not to work as hard? Unlike Commrades Obama and Biden, many of us give thousands a year to valid charities. And if the wealth is redistributed as you seem to want, where is more wealth and jobs going to come from?

Heh, you I like. Nothing to fear from me. (Even if it were possible!)



Nooooooo!! Then I guess your stick comment is well-founded.

A while back I was doing some research on the term 'democracy' and found the following to be quite interesting:



Since World War II, democracy has gained widespread acceptance. This map displays the official self identification made by world governments with regard to democracy, as of March 2008. It shows the 'de jure' status of democracy in the world.

BLUE Governments self identified as democratic
RED Governments not self identified as democratic.

They must not be looking at the same definition as you Lil

That fascist Vatican City eh?

Pep (Nothing against Catholics per se . . .)

Except wealth isn't necessarily a reflection of how hard you work. My mother worked two - sometimes three - jobs almost the the entire time I was growing up and we still ended up on food stamps at one point and, at another, virtually homeless for a few months. And there are plenty of stories like that out there.

And I work two jobs now. And at one time I lived in my car and had to get food boxes to survive. But I kept working and now I can provide an adequately for my family. Until the government decides to take it away.

It's really a combination of working hard, working smart, and good opportunity. Miss one of those three, and you struggle.

Hey folks.

Hows everyone doing?

oh, and btw...

ITS FRIDAY!!!!!!

Not necessarily aimed at you Damien, but I just get tired of the whole, "The government wants to take my money and give it to those lazy asses" attitude that seems so prevalent. Yes, there are those who manipulate the system, but there are also many, many people who are doing the best they can and still need help. And, often enough, government programs are the only way they can get that help.

I thought it was a given that we were talking about human beings although I wd hazard to say certain degrees of elitism and greed and hierarchy is inherent in primates at least as well as in other species. I would say such behaviour is in fact an evolutionary trait and not only in humans. Don't get me started on natural selection . Here is a random article on dominance and hierarchy amongst chimps that you may enjoy: http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/klu/10329/2004/00000045/00000002/art00001

To expect humans in general to behave with constant altruism is not realistic. Though the majority of us wd like to believe we are helping, giving souls, I personally do not find a saint in myself, and I am really the only one I am qualified to judge.

Quick Claire! Post one of your really awesome pics!

This thread is turning....*whispers* political....

*ears quiver with nervous worry*

It doesn't hurt being born into the right family either...

[Dang-it! just don't reply....just don't reply....just don't reply...learn mousie! learn!]

Don't worry Claire, it's only American politics, not the real thing.

Pep (Capitalism is when man exploits man, socialism is the other way around)

Oh absolutely. I was thinking more of the lower/middle classes.

Good opportunity and/or good education. Some have the means to education and that will make a lot of difference. For others, they either need the opportunity at the education or a good opportunity within a job/company.

In my case, I grew up like Ann, with mom always working two jobs and sometimes three, and us quite often on food stamps and/or other general aid programs. I got lucky and stumbled on to a good college opportunity - came out of college making more than my mother at the time. I constantly help my mother out and I give lots of my money, items, and time to charity - but I do not want the government trying to take it and decide where it should go. Hell, they cannot even properly manage what they already take.

LOL

Yep, I was also brought up dirt poor and forced to eat government cheese and powdered milk.

Without going to college, I taught myself to use one of the first word processing machines that sat unused at the clerical (read: minimum wage) job I had, and that got me a job in a law firm. I've worked hard my entire life, and brought myself to a level of pay that most two-wage earner families don't see.

I give heavily throughout the year to various local charities, and double up at Christmas. When Katrinia hit, my husband and I spent a large amount of our own money on supplies and went down to pass it out. We give to soldiers away from home at Christmas. We choose where we want to spend our money and how it may best be utilized.

But I do not want a government that makes more money when it runs out to tell me how to spend that money I work so hard to get.

And I get tired of the let's keep throwing money, OUR money at a problem instead of actually fixing it.

And those programs consistently fail, are ineeficient and wasteful, often times corrupt. The people who need help never get it, or get just enough to stay dependant on the Government and never getting back on their own feet. That is the idea of course, create a permanent class of people who will continually feed the cycle, ensuring those in power stay in power. The waste, mismangement, ineeficiency and plain theft I saw in the years I woked in the public sector are horrifying. I has to stop.

They aren't even letting us do that. They want to take more and more of it and spend it themselves.

It's good that you help the people and charities which move you, but not everyone does. And, just in terms of accessibility, the government has a far greater ability to reach and distribute funds to those in need. Plus, there tax breaks for qualified personal donations...get an accountant who knows what he or she is doing and they can be significant.

Yes, because you guys have found the perfect social utopia.