What are Ginko Bonds worth?

I think it is also quite ironic that one of the things Ponzi wanted to do to "pay back his depositors" was to invest their money into buying a decommissioned warship and turn it into a floating shopping mall...

..and what do we see in the Von Mises sim? An aircraft carrier that has stalls for vendors! (OK, so I don't know for a fact that it actually has vendor spots on it, but...)

Irony; it is what is for breakfast.. and lunch.. and dinner.. and..

I have a question..... and what leads me to this question is the stated illiquidity of Ginko's "investments".......

Q. If you invest in a SL stock exchange, such as WSE or Avix, and say you buy ALL the shares in one of the listed companies, do you actually become the owner of that company's assets?

Cos if you don't get the assets, then isn't the stock exchange just a sort of bank, where shares may or may not pay interest in the form of dividends, but where your deposit can go down based on the market, and has no actual value at all?

Just asking.....

The name of the sim is also of some interest ... Ludwig Heinrich von Mises.

Reguardless of how dumb investing in Ginko may have been - it does not diminish the fact that Nick P is a crook.

I guess that's Scenario A then.

Colette, please stop it with these pointless remarks. It does not help us. If anything, you just called all investors dumb. Because of that, I'm more suspicious about your taunts and the intent behind them may cause more harm than how business has been run.

You are not the only one. It is obvious there was a revolt from the ban on wagers. Many people were affected. The hype of it was and still is no doubt the killer of it all.

End the hype. Let's get on with business and make good of the investments. If anything, the hype is costing us our money even more than the revolt. Yes, you and others are now being held responsible for the continued delays.

The decision now is either to allow immediate returns or force Ginko to establish a complete pay-back to investors.

Colette, please stop it with these pointless remarks. It does not help us. If anything, you just called all investors dumb. Because of that, I'm more suspicious about your taunts and the intent behind them may cause more harm than how business has been run.

You are not the only one. It is obvious there was a revolt from the ban on wagers. Many people were affected. The hype of it was and still is no doubt the killer of it all.

End the hype. Let's get on with business and make good of the investments. If anything, the hype is costing us our money even more than the revolt. Yes, you and others are now being held responsible for the continued delays.

Whether or not it investing in Ginko was dumb, It doesnt change the fact Nick P. is a crook.

I can't see how you can force Ginko to redeem the bonds until they themselves want to.

Until the owner of Ginko can sit down and lay out a real (and transparent) plan of how he's gonna make everything good and happy again, there's little incentive to let people believe that everything is gonna be "alright" when so much has gone horribly, horribly wrong.

Until the owner of Ginko can sit down and lay out a real (and transparent) plan of how he's gonna make everything good and happy again, there's little incentive to let people believe that everything is gonna be "alright" when so much has gone horribly, horribly wrong.

OMG WOW - PLEASE tell me this is just a freak coincidence !

There is no fact here like that. That is your suspicion. You stated it many times. Any more attempts like this can be easily considered spam and against TOS. That would be why threads get closed.

I would apprieciate your potential solution to this situation. What I have seen by your attempts does not help me, as an investor, and other investors to get their investment back in business. =(

The business itself of Ginko has not been as obvious, but there is no doubt that it is easy to see as right under your nose. Better transparency here would be nice, but once you look you'll notice that it would not be a wise investment for competitors to see it so transparently.

There is a lot of competition here. There are many factors. Any attempt to just point out one fact (or attempts to presuade a said fact) of why the bank run happened is just plain futile.

To call Ginko a ponzi scheme is also to call SL a ponzi scheme. Let's not start with these kinds of pointless conjectures that affect this economy and ruin it -- waste of time.

Regarding what we invest in:

A variety of things. Most of the money is used in a currency exchange operation (not L$ based, though we do we have a L$ trader we invest with from time to time). We have a sizable amount in the development of gambling related websites (being developed, can't provide any links at the time). We have a real estate development, South Paris, which is a private sim with shops and homes for rent, a casino, and a plot which is being rented to create a museum/art store based on the louvre. The casino is going to be managed by a third party on a profit share deal, but we had a couple of games made for it, which we have full resell rights to. We have smaller investments in less lucrative places, in particular we own some shares (not a whole lot, since they are just a side investment for some of the excess capital) in thegoldcasino.com, wontongold.com, and pecunix.com.



Regarding our interest rate:

At the moment we can afford this rate with the profits of the currency exchange operation. As we diversify into other businesses and grow our capital in this one, we will lower the rate. Our long term (18 months) goal for it is 3% a month, and our really long term (36 months) goal is 1% a month. We would love being able to provide 0.2% a day forever, but it's just not possible. We will keep the rate a bit high for a while though. Unless investors demand we lower it, in which case we will just pocket more of the profit, which is fine by us really.



Regarding our financial situation:

We have about L$3346442.87 in deposits, not counting pending withdrawals. We have significantly more in assets, but I don't think I can give you an exact number. We have considered doing a public statement countless times, but the accounting is more complicated than you might think and it would just confuse or mislead people. I don't want to do either. Bottom line is, either you trust us or you don't. If you don't trust us, you wouldn't trust any financial statement we provided. If you do, our "statement" that we are in good health should be enough.

The business itself of Ginko has not been as obvious, but there is no doubt that it is easy to see as right under your nose. Better transparency here would be nice, but once you look you'll notice that it would not be a wise investment for competitors to see it so transparently.

There is a lot of competition here. There are many factors. Any attempt to just point out one fact (or attempts to presuade a said fact) of why the bank run happened is just plain futile.

To call Ginko a ponzi scheme is also to call SL a ponzi scheme. Let's not start with these kinds of pointless conjectures that affect this economy and ruin it -- waste of time.

The way a Ponzi Scheme works -

I ask that you make it worthwhile and advertise your better low-risk solution.

*sigh* You described an investment-pyramid scheme, which can be legally done but is highly frowned upon. The Ponzi Scheme extends that scheme with a stated guaranty of returns with the scheme's first come first serve on return (usually, or at least famously, by exchange tunnels).

A pyramid scheme is a form of fraud similar in some ways to a Ponzi scheme, relying as it does on a disbelief in financial reality, including the hope of an extremely high rate of return. However, several characteristics distinguish pyramid schemes from Ponzi schemes:

* In a Ponzi scheme, the schemer acts as a “hub” for the victims, interacting with all of them directly. In a pyramid scheme, those who recruit additional participants benefit directly (in fact, failure to recruit typically means no investment return).

* A Ponzi scheme relies on some esoteric investment approach, insider connections, etc., and often attracts well-to-do investors; pyramid schemes explicitly claim that new money will be the source of payout for the initial investments.

* A pyramid scheme is bound to collapse a lot faster, simply because of the demand for exponential increases in participants to sustain it (Ponzi schemes can survive simply by getting most participants to "reinvest" their money, with a relatively small number of new participants).

Being there is lack of laws being carried over from real-world jurisdictions, you are right that you can't force any business in SL to redeem on anything, currently.

The business itself of Ginko has not been as obvious, but there is no doubt that it is easy to see as right under your nose. Better transparency here would be nice, but once you look you'll notice that it would not be a wise investment for competitors to see it so transparently.

There is a lot of competition here. There are many factors. Any attempt to just point out one fact (or attempts to presuade a said fact) of why the bank run happened is just plain futile.

To call Ginko a ponzi scheme is also to call SL a ponzi scheme. Let's not start with these kinds of pointless conjectures that affect this economy and ruin it -- waste of time.

Sure - Invest money in the Real World

Where laws and regulations arent arbitrally ignored.

1) Other SL banks are offering high transparency in an effort to win trust, and seem to be doing OK, all things considered. Why would it be so awful for Ginko to follow suit?



Q.E.D.