New Avatar Script Limitations???

I got a notecard from a group where the woman said that due to LL's new policies on scripts she'd be sending out new re-sizer scripts for her skirts........and a friend told me there was going to limitations set on I guess the number your avatar registers for how scripted you are - but I can't find any official page about this anywhere, does anyone know about this? Supposedly - according to my friend - if you're overly scripted you'll be charged or something BLAH!!!

There's been talk of this for quite some time and the last official blog post about script limits is here: https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2009/01/04/about-the-homestead-launch-and-script-limits

Script Limits
* We will need to implement script limits to prevent a heavily overloaded region from negatively affecting the performance of another region.

Timing for Script Limits:
* In Q1, we will be gathering data on script load, and sharing this usage data with the community before deciding what the most appropriate limits are.
* In Q2, we expect there to be Viewer changes to allow you to monitor your script usage against those limits.
* In Q3 we will begin enforcing script limits.

There's also a bit more technical stuff here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Babbage_Linden/Office_Hours/2009_12_09?

My understanding is each parcel will have its own memory pool, similar to how each parcel can support X number of prims, and individual avatars will also have their own memory pool for things like huds you're wearing and craptastic resizing scripts in attachments. I believe in the new year, changes will be made to the viewer such that you can view how much you are using on a parcel you own, as well as for your avatar. Later on in 2010 LL will actually start enforcing these limit.

There's nothing official yet outside of some blog posts and office hour sessions, things are still getting firmed up. Before they impose the limits they've started working on getting out some new functionality that will (1) allow users to monitor their script performance, and (2) some new LSL functions that will eliminate the most commonly abused workarounds for structural limitations (such as having to put a script in *every*single*prim* when you want to resize something by script). Hair resizer scripts have been cited as being among the most abusive, both because of the number of scripts required and because of how common they are in new hair. Of course, the only reason designers are resorting to those scripts is so they can make the hair nocopy in an attempt to defeat the blatent content theft that is going on, but that's another story...

Look into Babbage Linden's blog posts and office hour transcripts for more.

If LL would add additional functionality to the current set of ll-functions, that would help to reduce the number of scripts necessary in an object. For example, to privately talk to an avatar near a scripted object...if you are the owner, you can easily use llOwnerSay...but there is no equivalent function to talk to a nearby avatar that isn't the owner without having to resort to llInstantMessage, which works world-wide and has a 2 second delay. If they could add in a similar function to llOwnerSay, but allow you to specify a key...then you could talk to nearby avatars, privately...and not leave the simulator, and remove the need to have extra scripts to get around this issue.

Same thing with email or http. If you are trying to talk with some other script on the SL grid, there shouldn't be the anti-spam, anti-DDoS delays for those functions if they aren't leaving the SL grid. People have to use multiple scripts to get around this when they aren't spamming, but just trying to communicate with other scripts.

By providing more functions, you can reduce the number of scripts to a handful or even sometimes just one.

I heard llGetLinkPrimitiveParams and llSetLinkPrimitiveParamsNoDelay are in the works to address resizing of linked prims.

From Babbage Lindens's office hours:

ETA Which leads me to think that the creator who made the announcement about sending out new resizer scripts is being a bit premature. I'm planning on revising several of my scripts once I can use llGetLinkPP and llSetLinkPPND, but I can't until the functions are actually available.

Ask the designer nicely not to replace a script with a script when all that is needed is to be able to mod the skirt the good old fashioned way so we can get them to fit MUCH better!

Bah to resizer scripts in clothes

Seconded, thirded, actually let me write a loop for that and send the script to everyone such that it will automatically IM the creators that put this junk in

I look forward to the script limits. It will be a huge entertaining lesson to all the creators that have this junk where it is implemented for the wrong or unnecessary reasons. The updates, the support requests.

How will they handle the problems when people can't wear their hair or shoes but can't remove the scripts because they've sent them out no mod, no copy. Even with a delete feature, what if you want to change your shape at some point or transfer to an alternate av where transfer is permitted?

I can see a lot of people who won't have transaction history past 30 days and even if they do and the creator doesn't (as many don't seem to want to bother with) then will they help?

Many products have no auto update, it's sometimes hard enough getting responses from creators as it is.

"Sorry customer, you're screwed but thanks for your money?" Probably!

Yes I can't wait, I really look forward to this wake up call.

To be fair, auto-update is a pretty complex bit of code, and many builders only know enough scripting just to get by, with their primary effort being on the creation of clothes, hair, etc, and running the business. Asking someone to be an expert scripter, an expert builder, and an expert businessperson with fantastic customer support is a bit of a stretch, especially for a hobby.

Also, the only reason content creators went with no-mod was because of SL's cavilier attitude to content theft.

That's why they can buy products for auto update. They didn't have to write the resizers either and as we know "no mod" doesn't stop it being copied although some still foolishly believe so. As one creator said to me the other day "I feel safer with no modify".

That's like putting a balloon on the steering wheel thinking it's an airbag.

There is also a discussion on the Blogrums on this issue as well

https://blogs.secondlife.com/thread/5939?tstart=0

Maybe LL hopes to kill three birds with one stone, when we have to throw away all of the stuff that we have in inventory and buy new versions.

Or better still, they allow mod, but the blasted thing screams bloody murder about copybotting if you rez it on the ground to mod it. THAT is the most useless anti-copybot script ever! Even the !quit at least worked once upon a time..

That may indeed be the motivation for many designers, but there are certainly many customers who prefer the scripted approach, and I'm sure that some designers are aware that some of their customers want these scripts.

Personally, I prefer the scripted approach so much that I use a resizer product, purchased in-world, to help with unscripted but modify products. And yes, I'll delete the scripts when done - since I can always add them back.

FIX LSL LINDENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have had multiple projects grind to a halt after running into one LSL bug on another. Usually the result I am told is to have multiple exra prims each with their own script and communicating with a root item's script via link messages. Then extra processing in the main script to collate the results.

Sorry, I flatly refuse to make my code ineffient (and cause lag) purely due to LL's ineptness.

Why? I'm fascinated by this every time I see it.

These scripts are only any use for linkset bigger/smaller and that's trivial by grabbing a sizing handle and doing the same. Certainly faster than having to rez object, add resizer, take to inventory, rez object again, select object, set scripts to running in selection, take to inventory, wear object, click... fiddle with bigger/smaller buttons, click again, delete scripts.

Right click, edit, drag resize handle, done.

The one use the resize stuff *can* have is when you have a hard to reach smallest size prim and need to shrink the whole linkset smaller but even then there are other scripts that will perform just this task.

All sorts of problems come from this. What do you do if someone who has a lot of scripted bling walks onto your land? Is your stuff unable to start until they leave? There are instances where someone drops an object on a plot and you can not return it to them for some reason so is not a hypothetical.

Resize scripts in stuff. Ugh. When I encounter those scripts I do not wear the item and then stop shopping at the store that sold it.

There may be room for improvement in these operations, but anti-spam, anti-DDoS tactics are just as necessary in-world as externally. I don't think this is an issue for http requests because of the way URLs are assigned. For email, I'm not sure off the top of my head but I think it's easy (for a moderately skilled griefer) to figure out the target address. For private, non-owner IMs, I expect appropriate anti-DDoS/spam tactics could be implemented in the viewer.

Of course, any operation that involves communicating beyond the current script will be relatively expensive compared to operations that are entirely within the script or between the script and the current sim.

The reason is that "Right click, edit, drag resize handle, done" is false.

First, neither bigger nor smaller is the goal. Sizing it correctly is the goal, and that's never one step.

That means the real set of operations is: right click, edit, drag one handle, drag it back because you overshot, leave edit mode to get rid of highlighting, go back into edit mode, decide that you really just need to shrink in one dimension but don't know how to get the resize handles for individual dimensions, decide that the hair, which is asymmetric, might look better if you decrease it side to side and then reposition it, try it, change your mind, but now you can't increase it back to excatly where it was because you didn't (or couldn't) save a copy before trying out this tweak. Then you try decreasing it over all just a smidgin, but after looking all around to see the entire hair, it's too small, so you have to increase it back, but your hand slips and now it's too big so you have to start over again. Then you wonder what about just changing the head shape, so you do that, then tweak the hair some more, then decide you don't like the new head so go back again, but forgot to save a copy so you have to figure out how to get back to where you were before you fiddled with the shape.

Get the picture? With a resize script, I:
a) don't get highlighting interference
b) don't get a single tiny prim preventing other decreases
c) can easily deal with one dimension at a time
d) can trivially revert to my starting point
e) can easily remember and undo/redo 1-3 steps
f) can undo or redo an unlimited number of steps just by tracking on scratch paper
g) never worry about the mouse slipping
h) can make much tinier adjustments than my hand and mouse/touchpad can reliably manage.

I'm happy just right click and edit, other than the smallest prim in the linkset issue which I accept but said can be handled otherwise is never a problem.

Still seems a lot of effort and clicking, I know i'd be faster with edit controls than click, all prims, x/y/z -1%, -1%, -1% etc. but each to their own.

Anyway, the important part isn't the building, it's that probably most users never take them out, it's going to be fun!

You get all this functionality from the Edit option as well, except that for returning to the starting point you would ideally need a copy (or write down the original values). And the problem with the tiny prim requires a bit of tweaking. However, with the Edit menu you get *all* the options you need for a perfect fit, not just resize.

Personally I think that especially with items that have two of the same thing (boots, ears..) going through the resize menu is a total pita because then you have to memorize the steps (scale +6% for the lower part, -15% for the upper..) while with the Edit menu you just copy the correct values from the part you fitted correctly, just once. Or maybe there's a function in resize scripts I haven't noticed that allows for "copy settings".

Resizing scripts are evil and a pain in the ass.

Here's an aspect to the script limits debate that's just occurred to me.

Where does it leave vehicles? At the moment, vehicles can continue to operate when they enter no-script areas, for the very good reason LL don't want fliers suddenly falling out of the skies, so any script that takes PERMISSION_TAKE_CONTROLS that's running when it enters an area carries on working, and so do all the other scripts in the same prim.

Makers of AOs, collars, HUDs and the like know this, of course, and use it to make sure your AO or other scripted attachment doesn't suddenly pack up when you enter a no-script parcel.

Well, what happens if a vehicle tries to enter -- fly through -- a parcel that's up to its script limit? There's been talk about stopping avatars with too many scripts from TP-ing in, which is fair enough, but what about vehicles? Do they just bounce off the equivalent of a ban-line running all the way up to the sky?

One solution, I guess, would be to exempt only vehicles from the limits, though that would leave -- and affect a far greater number of people, I suspect -- folks using flight enhancers either bouncing off invisible barriers or dropping several hundred metres down to a level where they can fly anyway.

But if you leave it as is, then script limits for attachments will be optional, just as is complying with a "no script" flag at the moment.

Where are the increase and decrease 1% buttons using Edit? Is there a "disable highlighting" check box? Where is the button that will let me undo the last three changes (based only on having to remember no more than the last 3 button pushes)?

Why would I have to edit two copies of the same thing just to get the same size? (That brings up recoloring scripts - a different but related subject.) But assuming I did, it's much easier to remember +6 and -15 then to have to write down and type in three separate, 3 or 4 digit numbers.

Briefly. For a matter of hours.