What about the poor people with no talent?

This thread must be the one I've agreed with more of the people ever

Anshe - yes, thanks to your recent interviews and many posts, I've read and understood your background. It comes to me as no surprise. I have yet to encounter someone who did not succeed because of hard work and commitment. That's the reason why I believe that anybody may succeed in SL, if they take a similar path.

However, Herald makes a very good devil's advocate. What should new players do while they learn the necessary skills to survive? How can SL be "entertaining" to them if they don't make enough money to allow them to remain here while they understand how this "new world" works? I guess that it will be much harder now for them.

On the other hand, I did manage pretty well to "be entertained" for 4 or 5 months, without earning a single L$ at contests (either by competing or hosting) and with pretty low weekly ratings (since I never went to rating parties). As a below-average scripter, a zero-quality clothes designer, and an amateur animator, I guess I'm pretty much average in everything, and I surely had a tremendous amount of fun before I started earning a fair amount of L$ from my own sales...

Of course, every one of us is unique, and I understand that it will be hard to design a mechanism that will allow new residents to earn L$ without skills and putting much effort into it - while being fair at the same time. I'm at a loss to propose anything since I'm really the typem of person which does not believe in "free lunches". I can understand that this will put off many potential residents, and it should be addressed by Linden Lab - the only question is, how.

In the mean time, I can only encourage the new residents which I meet in-world (often after a Mentor session) by telling them what sort of "jobs" are available and the kind of effort that is expected to put into them to make a successful "living" in SL...

As a side note, I'm happy to see that shops are starting to hire people, not using machines. I've always defended that concept. Hmm.

Well, Chip, interesting that you should ask: my answer to both questions is YES! hehe. The Corporate sponsorship quest has already begun. I asked a loyal contributor last week to give me a copyable file (just one unique copyable file) that I could give to prizewinners. I did not get that file, but Did get a lovely sex slave that I gave to the first winner! (though, granted, the first winner may not have been as enthused as the audience was, lol.) Those interested in putting advertising on the Sizzlin Sceners Competition programs should contact Cherry Took in game. Also we calculated the cost of doing a sulp ccessful event and making up for lindens and some of the prize money through a door charge. The difficulty here is how to get that paid to the events host when the club is owned by a group that widely varies among its membership in terms of how many are in game and how often. We need a script that will help us charge at the door. I have asked one scripter I know to work on it and he says he is trying to come up with something, but we needed one made, like, yesterday. It is too much to do for one person to host my event and to also play bodyguard and kick people out if they don't pay (an unpleasant task for one as nice as me) So, tonight we will experiment with the free market economy and see how many people are willing to A) show up when we ask them to contribute $20 in exchange for a program of events from the events host (half to go to prizes and half to go to the host) and B) actually pay the money without resentment.

Again, if we want events in SL, the audience will have to make a fundamental paradigm shift. I have contributed so much not because it is my personal income at stake, but because, as a person with an MFA in arts administration and time spent working for an ArtsAction research firm, as well as an off-broadway theatre alliance program, I have seen how funding cuts to arts and culture affect not only community structures but also economies. I am willing to give it my all to keep stuff happening, but just like any vendor, it will depend on the systems I have for making things work (i.e. the equivalent of a vendor machine for events tickets maybe) and also the degree to which there is demand AND a willingness and ability for the public to meet that demand. If the people who go to events are the ones hit hardest by economic changes (i.e. social players) then I suspect that we may not have enough financial wherewithal to support events without some form of independent funding / granting agency. Which I have ALSO investigated with the formation of the F.U. fund (hehe one great way to tell me F.U. without me minding one bit!) named after the founding donor. SO, you wanna see SL arts and culture survive? Come to Club Erotica tonight and pay $20 at the door for a great 2.5 hours of entertainment. OR donate to the FU fund OR talk to Cherry Took about program sponsorship with advertising for your product or service. THANKS!

As a side note to that side note, I'd like to give a BIG THUMBS-UP to Ameshin Yossarian and Sythia Veil of Curious Kitties, located at Mooaleo (120, 213)

Not only are they nice people who make cool stuff, but when they're around, they actually STAND BY THE DOOR AND GREET PEOPLE. SO OLD-FASHIONED, YET SO PROGRESSIVE!

Awesome, glad to hear that you're trying some new things. Best of luck and if I can be of any help don't hesitate to ask

You can be of help, Chip, by supporting events! Come to the competition tonight and have some fun! Or contact me to advertise what you make in my program. **is asking**

Can't make it to the event but I'll try and get in touch soon

But by haveing something for free, is the way to get people wanting to pay for the extra services, if the free customers couldnt do nothing why would they want to make LL rich so they can actualy particapate in activites, if they cut Linden Support from event except for educational events that will kill most the fun right there, and who the hell wants to learn while playing water polo come on its a sport not a class...you have to understand not everyone has the skill to do something in SL but still enjoy hosting events and such, but no Linden Support guess what no event prize sure we could play for fun, but come on people will stop playing its called gambleing people get addictied to it like crack they want it and your takeing it away, its uncalled for you cant take crack from a crackhead without them saying something to you about it....Linden Labs is at fault i dont care what no one says, ive logged on twice since the day the lindens were at the welcomeing center and they showed no concern about those who actually did pay and still do pay everymonth they still showed no consideration towards these indivuals, and i think it is wrong we pay to have a voice heard in the community and the only people hearing us is the community not the lindens, they are only thinking about thier selfs in the conceited act. and they know it, but they choose to use the term fixin the economy to hide the fact that they are money hungry, but its okay cos they all will go bankrupt when SL falls and everyone leaves, there is close to 600 signatures on the petition to stop the changes but the Lindens have failed to take this into consideration, they still choose to go over our heads and still proceed to take actions that they choose to take. I will not come into SL until they have changed and if they dont then i will not come back and i know a few otehrs the same way this is my first time posting in the forums but it wont be the last.

Hmmm, well you've been getting something for free, and now you don't want to pay. Kinda blows a hole in your logic eh?

The trouble with all this phsycho-babble is that its total drivel. You have people here saying 'get a job' - 'YOUR LAZY' 'spongers' blah blah blah, well I'm sorry to tell you this BUT - Second Life has no employment for the unskilled.

Where are the jobs for 'unskilled labour' in Second Life? The guys who dig holes,waitresses,Taxi Drivers etc etc? You people who do scripting/designing et al' forget one tiny detail - they are CYBER skills!! This is FAR FAR from a real world with a real economy and you people with your 'cyber skills' have your heads up your own arses if you think this is akin to real life - its NOT - because in real life EVERYONE begins with the chance to make a living, in Second life if your shite with scripting/photoshop/design then your shafted because you CANT get a job filling ditches in so that you can afford lifes little luxuries.

FACT - In real Life Jenna Fairplay would be roling in $ because she would own THE most popular entertainment spot in the world

FACT - In Second Life the money Jenna Fairplay makes from the most popular Club in the world wouldnt take her to the toilet and back.

Entertainment/leisure is THE most popular passtime in Second life and anyone tells you different is talking themselves up big,the stipend was a wage for the unskilled the same way that event support was, but short of selling yourself for sex or wriggling your hips as a dancer the unskilled now get what they are given - like it or lump it.

Some of you people make me CRINGE - you come into these forums talking about 'business' and whats your business? your business is extortion! You charge $5000 for an item that cost you how much to manufacture? took you how much time?

Even Dick Turpin wore a mask!!!! Maybe its time you did the same.

Why do you feel that you are owed something by SL?

I'm not saying you have no valid points, Sox, but if you think makin' this stuff is easy, I urge you to give it a shot sometime. Some projects take a considerable amount of personal time to bring about.

20-40 hours, plus 1-2 hours per buyer. Don't like it? Don't buy it. If you love Jenna Fairplay's club so much, pay her. I'm sure she'd appreciate it for all the hard work she puts in.

I can't do acrobatics, juggle, walk a tightrope, or ride in a clown car. Does that mean I should demand to get into the circus for free?

I'll make this REAL simple for you Lance then I dont have to waste another 10 minutes on your 'business sense'.

Second Life is an entertainment medium which I pay to play.
Second Life IS a game.

If Linden Labs keep listening to misguided souls like you then Second Life is going to stop being entertainment and it will become a job - I'm not paying Linden Labs so that I can log on and go to work - and neither will the vast majority of this playerbase.

I have a job - in the REAL world Lance - I do this for fun and for relaxation and the very second I cant log into second life to socialise with friends from around the world then Linden Labs will no longer be getting my $'s.

And before you start making assumptions about 'what I think SL owes me' maybe you should actually check out what I do in SL hmmmm?

And Mr Midnight - I dont buy your extortion rate goods - I buy from people who dont pretend they're doing me a favour by ripping me off.

Sorry Mike I didnt see this - I do know how hard it is - Every single vendor on my land is given rent free to people just starting out in SL.

speaking of Dicks.........

Good for you. Thanks for making my point for me. I'd be ripping you off if I put a gun to your head and demanded you buy my product for $5000. As you've demonstrated you're under no obligation to do so, ergo you're not being ripped off. See how that works? Wow, freedom of choice. What an amazing concept.

I love Munches skins and hey Ryn designs Male skins. Im in love, even that wonderful Cherrybomb.

Munch's skins are beautiful Definitely some of my favorites!

Just like in real life your not being forced to buy anything.. and if you want an expensive item, yes, you gotta make cash urself.. just like in real life...

If you cant do anthing in real life, you cant buy anything...
So lots of similarities i'd say..

though:

Employers like myself pay for being friendly to customers while im offline.. so im buying not ones skills but ones time..

If one cant even see a way to be friendly in second life.....

well... you finish it urself...

Sophos

That is not a fact.
IRL just like in SL she would have to make it profitable to be "rolling in $".
The most popular clubs IRL go out of business all the time.

IRL...set up a money ball in your front yard, coupled w/ a sexy thong contest.
Your house will be the most popular place in your county.
You will not be rich.

Not at all true, it has many more! And it's not like RL work, because you don't need to do it to survive.

Has everyone complaining about the welfare reduction been to Yadni's Junkyard yet? Look it up.

Also, Prokofy, Gwyn, Anshe, et al, you have written some of the best stuff I've read on these forums, on this page:
/130/1c/32665/4.html#post348075

Very insightful.

Also:



Where will they go? Yeah at first the fees might drive some away, but information eventually spreads. If the only thing to do is TRINGO or a Laggy SuperClub, or your for-fee event, at least a healthy section of the population will go to your event. Think small at first, charge 5.
Bump it up as you get more AVs in the door, as the weeks go by.

If an events host (who is going to be paid by door and nothing else) hopes to supply cash gifts to winners from a draw, I suggest a $20 door as this means that half the cost can go to cash prizes. Even without cash prizes, it takes a $20 doorcharge to cover event hosts salaries at the small rate the Lindens paid. Think about it: the average roleplayer event pulls in 13-18 paying customers (out of 30 who attend, as I have no way to FORCE people to pay at present without some kind of security script to bounce freeloading attendees). So if 15 people pay $20 each, it is $300. My events are 2.5 to 3 hours, or $100 linden per hour. Not much in compensation and that's for what the public SEES of my time (doesn't include time spent shopping for props or textures to set the stage, time making a program, or time IMing people or posting the event: adding up to another 3-4 hours). In all, Events are the most poorly compensated content addition one can take on. Unfortunately, it is also my chief skill. At $5 a head, I would make only, what, $65 for 7 hours work?

It's not like that. People like me and many other that come in Sl to RELAX and take a break from RL, love also to buy things, clothes, scripted object and whatever. That is part of the fun and social side of Sl. It is not freedom of choice, unless one would like to go around dressed with standars Linden clothing, the one you make fro free under appearance, just to be clear.
But what we buy are VIRTUAL things, not real goods ! I suggest that those that want to make real money do that in real life, not in Vl. Maybe it is easier to exploit player (particularly newbies), but surely not fair.
I sell a script that took me some time to write. Whether is good or not is up to other to judge. What i am sure off, I would NEVER want people to spend real money to buy it. I made it for fun and if people in SL enjoy it, great! I'd rather give it for free to everyone than have someone spend their money to buy it. Real money is had enough to earn, to throw it away on a virtual object.
If people think that their creations are really worth some good USD, then they should sell it via paypal or something like that, just outside Sl. Linden $ are just a worthless currency and should remain like that, a virtual currency good only to play in Sl.

What is astonishing (not talking about you Chip, just a general remark) is reading the greed of people between the lines of some posts. Can almost see the $ sign blinking in their eyes, lol