What about the poor people with no talent?

I don't post much on the forums, but I thought this was interesting enough to post about.

The economical changes have me puzzled.. Although I don't fully agree or disagree yet because I never fully understand something until I have seen it with my own eyes over a long period of time.. I am wondering what will become of people who log on to SL primarily to socialize with their friends?

Let me explain. I know of some people who, with these changes, will NOT be able to afford a fun experience on SL. Myself included because honestly I don't have the kind of talent that's needed for these changes to draw in much income. In fact I am currently depending on the stipend bonuses to make any kind of 'living'. And that bonus is already very low as I don't get many ratings or have many visitors to my land. (maybe L$200 total income a week?)

Now if ratings are going to cost people L$25 a rate, how many people do you think are going to rate a stranger at that price? Yeah I agree the rating prices should be higher than L$1, but L$25 is a little overkill. So down goes my stipend bonus even more. Catch my drift?

So okay these changes are fabulous for people who have the talent to create amazing content they can sell and use for events, but there is a lot of us who don't have the skills.

Is SL really all about building and competition of content? What about the people who just come to hang out with friends and goof off and laugh over their dumb deformed builds and avatars? People who like to shop for gadgets made by others? Surely not everyone depends on building for fun in SL.

Now for the rant!

If the economy for SL is clubs and junky content then I'm sorry, that's the way the players apparently want it. You can't just force people to change the way they do things. If you want better content then people have to find it in themselves to make the change. Education and better documentation of the tools would be a start, because quite honestly, the current documentation sucks.

I'm more puzzled by this than anything.

There's nothing wrong with socializing with your friends. In fact, that's still free.

LL has created a world where you have the tools to create anything you want. This was the real draw for me, and I'm sure a lot of other users.

From what I've seen, user-created content is the big flashing neon sign that LL uses to promote SL. So I'm thinking that people that want to take advantage of this creative freedom are their primary focus.

To me, its like enrolling at MIT and then complaining that there's not enough emphasis on sports. If 5,000 people suddenly purchased an MIT tuition package and then complained there isn't enough sports, should MIT change their curriculum or stated purpose to appease them?

There's no reason you can't just be social and hang out in SL. The amount people get paid for just hanging out and socializing seems to be what's at issue. There are plenty of virtual communities out there that seem to put a higher emphasis on socialization with higher rewards - SL does not seem to be one of them.

The ones hardest hit by this are going to be the Basic account holders - those that paid $10 for lifetime access. This is an absolute loss leader for LL. I don't think anyone can blame them for trying to push people to sign up for monthly membership (higher weekly base stipend). Why should they continue to encourage the current system that makes it easy for a Basic member to float along in SL without contributing RL money or talent to the mix?


For the record - I COMPLETELY agree with you on the documentation issue. LL's documentation SUCKS and when I did go back and look through the introductory PDF files they offer for download, they seemed to be out of date in certain aspects and not nearly as thorough as they could be. Perhaps LL support going to educational events only is their way of increasing socialization PLUS educating people who want to learn how to use the tools given.

As for this grossly mis-guided "what about poor me, I can't push a single pixel" sort of WHINING, get over it already. What about someone in RL who doesn't have a single employable skill? They starve, or they mooch off of their parents/significant other/whomever. You can't expect to get something for nothing - there's no free ride (to combine two of my favorite cliches).

Find other ways to enjoy yourself - socializing is still free you know. Or, try to actually LEARN something - there's a novel idea! Get out MS Paint (or the new, quite powerful, Paint.NET) and try to make a texture! There are a TON of ways to have fun without relying on subsistence welfare.

Fafnir, keep talking. Keep reiterating these points. Don't give up. Don't let yourself be bullied by older or wiser players who are scornful of what you are saying. Keep talking, keep talking. You're definitely on to something. And the Lindens, if they care about their bottom line, have to listen to you because you represent the new class of players that they claim to want to attract.

In TSO, you could make money in an easily accessible, democratic fashion by skilling up and chalk-boarding or preserving or doing pizzas. It was monotonous but some forms of the jobbing left you free to socialize and it became a more social game, but that led to more drama and boredom for many ultimately because there wasn't much to do there.

In SL, it's really hard to get going -- the only walk-in job is sex escort or maybe event-planner or sales rep for mall space which is really hard for newbies to do. You're right about the documentation and frankly, the much-touted workshops are also often occasions when insiders provide tips to other insiders already heavily conversant in computer and graphic programs so the non-computer type is really lost. And like I said elsewhere, why do you have to learn the theory of internal combustion and construct an electrical circuit just to drive a car? Normally you just turn the key in the ignition and steer!

Rather than subsidize only mentors for educational events, I think it makes sense to find other ways (continue the existing stipends that won't be cut) for people to vote with their feet for gadgets, events, instruction, whatever. It's a bit like the school vouchers idea. If you pay for instruction, it might improve a lot and meet your needs.

this is the fundamental social problem with having play money. i'd just as soon sell my seasonal tree to you for fifty cents each rather than a hundred lindens (yes i realize that i'm rounding up a bit ha ha). you can shop til you drop and, once a month, ll can bill your card and credit my account.

i'm suprised that people aren't selling more real life items inworld, or should i say throughworld, with outside paypal arrangements and such like they do with websites. i've even tried to encourage a few. but they see the monoploy money, think cutesy video game and thank me for my time.

the real killer though is that people have to at least sign up for a trial account and commit some time to a learning curve. that'll pan out over time though. people will learn to function in 3d environments just like today's first graders program spreadsheets. and browsable accounts will be free once the client code is standardized and opened.

what was i talking about? oh, for now, wait. poor, noncreative people will just have to muddle through and wait for further changes to come down the road. the creative professionals have waited over a year for ll to get serious about producing something that the real world can use. i will beg the point that you're probably a lot more creative than you realize. i had never worked with 3d graphics when i came to sl. i've learned every bit of it since.

this

is

a

game.


Stop comparing it to real life.

There are TONS of valid reasons why one couldn't afford top create and run his own business in second life. One of wich is time, not everyone here can afford spending 5 or 6 (or even many more if they are perfectionists) hours a day to create clothes or whatever content plus more hours to research and study the ways of making it.
That is why many recur to hired jobs, and clubs and events are the primary source of hired jobs in second life.
Do you really think that a creative job (and this comes from a "so called" creative) has more dignity than an hired one?

For some folks that see r/l people behind the avatars, exchange $L for r/l US$, and invest more than nontrivial amounts of real effort and cash into SL, this isn't a game by any measure. As long as there's an overlap with r/l topics, it's going to be compared to r/l.

Then they are misguided. And implying that everyone should "get a job" in their off time while they are not at work, is silly. A lot of people are tired at the end of their day and don't feel like learning the equivalent of what is rather sophisticated graphics program.

ingrid, this is a great point. i will take it one step further. this is a game we are all playing in RL. SL is a game, it's not an alternate existence.

when i spend my RL time in any specific enterprise, if someone values my service or product, they should be willing to pay the price for them. that price is in L$=USD. players are always offered a choice for various qualities of products, and should not expect things under valued.

LL is maintaining the value for the L$ so that high quality content creators remain motivated to push the boundaries of SL and that new players feel inspired and interested in doing the same.

I'm not arguing with that. But what I am rather tired of hearing is "get a job" in Second Life. Why should they? This is a service that a consumer pays for and as such is they want to sit on their lazy asses and do nothing then they should be able to.

And if everyone did know how to script, build and master photoshop, then the content creators wouldn't be needed anymore, (as i stated in another thread, sorry for the redundancy)

right! and i am also confident you agree with me that people who want to sit on their lazy asses are entitled to as long as they are not expecting free handouts from people who don't want to give them out. ie - they should buy L$ on GOM if they want the goods with USD they worked hard to earn, just like content creaters worked hard to make content.

i think the response "get a job," which is not very helpful at all, is directed to players who want to socialize, but still get high quality content for nothing.

yup i do agree with that




They're paying tier fees, they're paying subscription fees... that's not nothing.

By the way, tonight if I see you in world I'm going to beat you up for arguing with me. I could so take you.

you


just


made


me


cry!!!

yes i agree. they are paying these fees.

subscription fees guarantees a stipend. it guarantees a minimal income that is counter balanced by content creators uploads (and photo taking) as well as by growth - ie addition of land. if growth slowed down, stipends would have to be cut, or devaluation would occur even if decline in per capita consumerism did not change. (perhaps growth has slowed down?)

tier fees guarantee server resource allocation. there will always be a set amount of land and prims available to a player in world and that land and it's content will remain persistent for other users as well. it is a playing/publishing space for players.

what pays a content creator or service provider? the L$ is not a USD but it's exchangeability is the incentive of many of the best content creators. in a value for value exchange, the L$ must maintain USD value to be useful to providers and to consumers. it is not oppressive to have to buy L$ to consume in SL.

As for this grossly mis-guided "what about poor me, I can't push a single pixel" sort of WHINING, get over it already. What about someone in RL who doesn't have a single employable skill? They starve, or they mooch off of their parents/significant other/whomever. You can't expect to get something for nothing - there's no free ride (to combine two of my favorite cliches).

Find other ways to enjoy yourself - socializing is still free you know. Or, try to actually LEARN something - there's a novel idea! Get out MS Paint (or the new, quite powerful, Paint.NET) and try to make a texture! There are a TON of ways to have fun without relying on subsistence welfare.
________________________________________________________________________

Sheesh - arrogant much??

Thank you, come again.

edit to add: This is LL's policy. This is what they offer consumers when they sign up and pay LL to play Second Life. So why people whine about players not having an "SL job" is completely beyond me.

Well, my problem with this "get a job" attitude from the feted inner content-creating elite is that there isn't any way to GET a job.

Do you want customers? Then shut up. Be in favor of at least SOME starter fluid in the economy as Phil Linden put it.

How else can your customers buy your created content?

Or the content free are just supposed to fly around the land and ooh and ah at you as you do fabulous builds in the sandbox looking fabulous in your prim boots?

Don't they want to be fabulous, too? Or did you want them to stay in their white and blue striped newbie shirts forever?

How can they GET to be fabulous *when they have no normal way of making a job*?

Geez, at least in TSO you could go on the pizza machine or the jam preserver. I remember the ignomy of my early newb days when I had to go to dress-up contests and try to win prizes. Hard work!

And I was will to do a job! Any job! Hey, I even offered to sweep up prims at etc.... just so I could get the cool orange tekkie jump suit that you all have there but my application was rejected.

that was a stygian edit, ingrid!

content creator uploads, photos, and growth.

btw, that minimum stipend is 500 L$, the bonus is a bonus, nothing to demand or expect.

furthermore, it should be evident that even the minimal stipend is not sustainable without growth or occassional adjustments in the economy.

i formally accuse you of cozying up to your consumer market!

if you can't find an SL job, it's ok. RL jobs are more lucrative.


Geez, this is not TSO.

if i see a kool object in sl i dont waste my cash, i try to build it 1st, saves alota cash if i can make it

And they get 2000L$ each month in exchange for their subscription USD$
How is 2000L$ no money ?

You can look at it the other way: before, lots of player went to the club's event to earn money through prizes and rating ; now it's not viable anymore so they don't have that work to do.

You had to rate/be rated , now it doesn't make a difference: in fact you worked before, and now linden removes that necessity from you.

You'll say "but my bonus is screwed, I earn half as much money as before" ; to this I'd say that prices will go down (or else creator's sale will drop...) and you'll still have a good buying power ; without the hassle of hunting rates.

What are people complaining about exactly?
Lesser need to hunt rates = more time to socialise.
Lesser need to hunt rates = less incentive to only visit the crowded clubs = more time to explore the world.
Lesser need to hunt rates = good.


All this assuming you pay LL each month for a subscription, which is the case of Fafnir Fauna since she mention owning land.

Yeah, maybe I should just get more RL jobs instead of playing a frustrating game?

Geez, I thought SL was supposed to be different than RL and offer suspension of disbelief and dimensions for creativity.

I understand your point very well, since I created an alt for a friend who just like to socialize, exchange ratings and doesn't build. But when it comes down to it, SL is just losing money on that alt. There aren't any online games out there other than SL which allow you to play for free for a one time fee of ten bucks. Maybe LL is encouraging you to spend 10 bucks a month, which is no more than any other game. Then you get L500 a week which is more than double the L200 you get now.

geez, i didn't realize that other peoples work could cost me money!