Lying, betraying ethics, and practicing smut

Well since we're on the subject of religion. I just have to say one thing, don't have the god, hate its followers. I lost a lot of faith through time and trials dealing with so called religious types.

Christianity is the most popular of this, though I'm sure it happens in every religion. Just like a country suffers for something, it probably does in another somewhere.

Maybe I'm just rambling.

I didn't witness what happened. Maybe it was a missunderstanding, maybe s/he was messing with your head.
Even though most players are nice people, they're still strangers, as someone mentioned on an earlier post, and there's always the chance that they're not being straight with you.
There's no foolproof way to tell if someone is being honest with you, but here's some things that apply both in Real Life and Second Life.

Beware of anyone you meet who, right away,

Is overly friendly or forward
Prematurly discloses personal stuff
Flatters you excessivly
Claims to have a glamerous/exciting job
Claims to like everything you like and dislike everything you dislike and agrees with you on every issue
Seems to force intamacy (here I mean acting like your best buddy when you barely know the guy).
Has a personal ancectdote about a every subject you bring up, For exampe, you mention alligators and says he got attacked by one. Then you mention you have to take your collie to the vet and he says "really? I used to breed collies..." and so on.
Talks about how stupid/lame everyone else is.

Don't know what your friend was up to. Maybe she claimed she wasn't into x-rated stuff because she didn't want to offend you. Maybe she's actually an 45 year old guy that lives in his parents garage. As I said before, most players are friendly and not out to hurt you, but there are a few troublemakers. so be careful.

You didn't sound arrogant.
I am an atheist of sorts, I was raised according to the strict scientific version of the world, but as someone who thirsts for knowledge I have sought to inform myself about the various religions.
It is a topic I find very interesting and that can lead to stimulating debate when both parties involved can behave with restraint
I liked your reply because it seemed like a fairly neutral explanation of things. So basically, born-again christians believe the ONLY path to enlightenment is devotion to christ, and since buddhists believe that enlightenment can also be achieved by following the teachings of buddha, you see that this violates the "exclusitivy" precept of your religion.
I think I understand - it's like it says in the bible, you shall have no gods other than me.

I KNOW I'm not the only one who read this:



Am I going to be the one to respond to this? Usually I let other people catch these things and let them say it for me.

I dunno, to the point, I don't think you'll last another week, regardless of reasons/motivations for leaving.

I would have responded, but I've already been burned once today, and my eloquence hasn't been buffed and polished lately.

A word to Jon: Assume that homosexual people are everywhere. Just because people don't "seem" gay doesn't mean that they aren't. There is no way to tell without direct contact with the person in question, contrary to the views of the media.

I would just like to know when the Amish got discounts to Second Life, because I find it hard to believe you could live in modern day society and still be that naive and closed minded.

Just out of curiousity Jon, would you have followed her in real life? If so thats very telling of your character. If not, why would you in an online setting? Might that not be viewed as an abandonment of your own ethics in that case?

On the subject of her apparent sharing of your views and morals:
Having many co-workers and friends that are born again, and having witnessed a good deal of their verbalized ideaology first hand many times, it is quite possible you came on so strong that and with such conviction that she may have realized you might be easily offended if she didn't treat you with kid gloves. (In my opinion the nature of your posts here seem to hint at that). Not stating its right to do so, simply that I have seen it happen first hand on several occasions.

As far as not knowing there would be mature content here, gays, etc. I don't buy it. This game is clearly aimed at adults and you cannot play unless you are 18+. As I stated above, I know many born again people and most of them are very aware about the nature of Internet content in general and warn against exactly what you are distressed over.

Lastly about the *MUCH easier said than done* comment in reference to my remark that you should avoid Mature sims...
Here is a copy of the SL world map with green asterisks denoting PG sims. its quite easy to see that there are several PG only paths (most certainly the Lindens planned it this way) from the top of the world to the bottom. As a matter of fact i count 82 contiguous PG sims. The only set of PG sims not contiguous are accesible from a telehub contained within them, so no crossing Mature regions there either...

ideeted fir gramaw, she downt laik eet wen eye rait rawng

So you immediately start following someone who you -just- met to spy on them?? Like I said, creepy creepy.



I carefully read the whole thing, thank you very much, and it was both creepy and desperate. And I still fail to see what you being a christian has to do with making such a dramatic point out of Buddhist picteures ... unless it was some sort of denouncement ... "She said she was christian, and she went somewhere that had Buddhist pictures"

Once again .. creepy. Seriously, just drop this thing like a hot potato, there are lots of other people to stalk quitely, in the privacy of their homes.

As a Buddhist, I can tell you that the vast majority of Buddhist sects believe in one, and one only, path for enlightment, and if you can't reach that, you can't be a buddha. I don't see the difference. Of course, I could be wrong.

And, on the general topic of identity, the golden rule is to simply assume no one is who they say they are.

I never said you were spying. I said *followed*. Maybe when she flew off without telling you where she was going you should've talken that as a sign... Maybe you could have IMed her and asked her why rather than following her to a place you yourself said wasnt the easiest to reach.



Ahh, the pulpit descends...I can contradict that quote with a plethora of others from the bible. Thats what so "great" about holy books, they can be easily used to promote a million different viewpoints.



Is that so? Perhaps you can whitewash these quotes away?






I for one do not hate you. I simply disagree. As far as flaming goes, this thread is relatively mild. You did post this in the rant section. What did you expect? An ice cream social?




Umm...what? Your self contradiction is starting to become a pattern..



Ah, so you want a pre-existing community to change to your liking and to cater to your wants. Without any effort from you. In life, one has to make a constant effort to avoid that which they dont like. Some examples: Choosing your cable channels, deciding where to to surf and where not to surf on the web, what school(s) to send one's kids to, whether or not to hang out in the seedy part of town, etc. When you start expecting the powers that be to sanitize things for you without knowledge of your morals and religious persuasion, you are putting your self importance WAY above the rest of society. The goal for this virtual world is for it to become an immersive, 3d web. So be prepared for content you may not care for just as on the internet.



*not thinking* or *being unprepared* are shortcomings which need to be owned by the person(s) involved. Especially those who are easily offended and who are so fragile that these situations shake the very foundations of one's faith in fellow man. This comment is in reference to this quote form your initial post:



How would you have it Jon? That we all have to disclose private., personal info to assuage your fears? Again I really don't think this is your element, not while you harbor this angst about whether or not people should, could or would be 100% honest with you.



Self discipline tool...hmm. I can only presume you are implying you need to have someone hold your hand and tell you not to venture out to the bad side of the tracks. The word "self" in that phrase says it all for me. If you need tools to help maintain your "self-discipline" then you may need to re-evaluate whether or not you can exist in this community without it causing you undue stress and/or becoming a mechanism which precipitates a fall from grace.

Nolan, I don't think I've read a more well-thought out post in the Rants forum. Cheers to you.

i hardly beleive a person has to be religious to have morals and values. i am also a hardlien conservative and beleive we need to return to semi-traditional values. coupling is important for the proper development of children and its easier for two people to show a child the right path rather than just one. sometimes it is understood that this isnt possible but i beleive in some situations people dont even try to make things work cause they dont find it "convinent".

Death backing up Jon. I love it!

No point? No point in addressing any of the issues I raised supported by direct quotes from you? Not even a clever dodge? Just an outright refusal to address you own witticisms. I usually adhere to a rule about people to whom normal discourse has become to evangelize and then accuse others of being non-debaters.

I think I will reinvoke that rule.

No point afterall.. NN

The place in the sky is mine. You do have to use a maglev to get there. Or fly if you are so equipped - See profile, pics.

Yes she came to talk to me in my workshop and at the time of your arrival we had been sitting there chatting about the days events, new users.. etc.

When you arrived unannounced I made the tongue in cheek comment "So, shall we get naked and fornicate on the table like slippery dogs?". I admit it, it was for your benefit or at least the benefit of your obvious arrival. And it was funny! Anyone who knows me knows this would be a sarcastic comment.

If we had been up to anything involving certain primitive attachments ... the building would have been locked and you would have been ejected if you chose to stick around and climb in through the walls. There is nothing wrong with using the "stalker post" but it is up to you to moderate your own self as to where you follow it.

And so on... after my smut tainted comment, she did ask me about avatar genitalia. Before I rezed a vending machine for her to see, I asked you "Jon, are you offended by nudity?" at which point you TPed elsewhere and bailed. Poof, just like that. You were there probably three minutes.

I think I understand but I did not see the "story" so I am guessing here - you are upset because: You met someone and after a short time formed some associations, expectations and an image of what they were in your mind. "She" left the area to go do something/whatever. You followed this person to a Mature sim. You showed up where she was meeting with someone else - without asking or knowing what was up, who they were, what they were doing. And now you have a mind to be offended by some things you read in chat and artwork you saw there... having no clue to the context or relationship of the people or place involved. You interpreted this as lies, smut, deceit, and that she is ugly and probably some dude. !!And it was worthy of troll bait material.(oh no.. *gets out the fishhook pliers to free himself*)

Alas, here we have a whole steaming pile of needless suffering, which is a choice; a whole pile of choices leading up and into this end; misrepresentation, broken expectations and bitching on the forums. My god and goddess what am I even doing typoing this.

Should we even get into the whole labyrinth of looking at one's own motivations, thoughts, desires and actions to find the truth in the situation?

<MinorRantingSoapBoxMoment magnitude="2.5">
And who really cares what the heck is on the other side of the machine? For some it is escape, for others it is an extension. All of our avatars have a life of their own, the character becomes tangible and an entity of their own.Most with little reference to the physical world. Relationships are formed and bonds are made in that context. Are we so insecure in sexual identification that it matters? "Oh no! I blew a kiss to Tiffany last night and this morning I found out she is really Tom! These feelings I am having... am I gay?! I think I might be turning GAY!". [ for the humor impaired reader: The previous situation was totally sarcastic and fictitious and in no way represents real persons, places or avatars ]

And all your ideals about beauty and ugly are your own personal associations and value Judgments.

<this concludes whatever blabbering/tirade above>

<oh god but here is another one>
What is smutty about avatar genitals anyway? Whats so wrong with people who desire each other to get together visually online? How is that offensive? Should they not have the appropriate equipment to facilitate the SIMULATION? I am guessing that most of you have genitalia of some sort on your physical body. What makes it offensive elsewhere?

I understand that there are degrees of activity that even the most hardened (not a pun) of us may blanch at. But outside of religious interpretation, can you really define right and wrong in this context? It is really up to the individuals own values.

Will exposure to the extremes of situation in SL,and the usual lack of consequence sway ones decision making in the physical world and their day to day life? I tend to feel that all exposure to everything and anything does and would say a safe "probably". I have even chosen to not create or work on some things because of the - however remote - possibility that one's exposure to 2nd life content and choices may influence (in my opinion)a really bad physical world choice.

I try not to use the abbreviation RL. As mentioned above in the tread, we are people here at the ends of the connection. How we effect each other, what we decide to create for the purpose of interacting on the grid with others is really all there is. Does anyone think that Second Life would be as popular a thing if it were solitary and without other players? As with our outer world, that is all there truly is - our choices and how we affect other living creatures. Everything else is food or fire - bits that never were. If that is not "real" ...

It is totally up to you, the individual, what you do and don't do in and with your second life. Just like your outer life... funny that.
<will it ever end>

Take responsibility for what you walk your avatar into.

"although I have noticed that the prettier a person is, the easier it is for him/her to make his/her flesh look very beautiful (because he/she sees him/herself in the mirror every day). "

This sentence, and what it says about the way you feel about women/men in general, really made me sad.
I just can't get past this. Glad you deleted the rest of the post. Thanks.

BleedingHeart~Minyon Monde

Gay people? On the internet? No!

Seriously Jon, if that's going to be a problem, you might want to consider whether or not SL is worth it. There's a far higher proportion of gay people here than the usual 10%, and you may find that upsetting.

Also, many straight people will find the use of the word "gay" as a pejorative to be offensive as well. Just as someone could be offended by a racial slur even if they themselves were not a of the ethnicity the slur was aimed at, one needn't be gay to be offended by the inconsiderate use of "gay" either.

I'm willing to consider your excuse that you actually think gay men look like women, but it sounds a little iffy to be honest. You might find others to be even more skeptical.

but blaming other people is so much easier.

my ignorance is never up for discussion.

well i understand were he is comeing from. conservatives for the most part are the only people holding back this country from anarchy.

nobody tell him that it's gay pride this week in SL

the funny thing about that is that we should have heterosexual week were we throw our sexuality in everyones face. or maybe s&m week or slave week. oh of course not cause this is a rediculious idea and i know im going to get an ear ful about saying this is because if you stand up and say that this is rediculious then someone is going to scream HOMOSEXUAL HATER. instead of the fact people like me or atleast like me on thsi issue dont really care how people act however it gets annoying puting titles on everything and throwing it up in my face. your here your queer im over it. relax fredrick its fruit you can buy a bag of apples for 53 cents.............

You mean like the anarchy in Iraq?

the current administration isnt conservative. the president has been spending money like a drunken sailor. and this extends to the lies and the betrayal of the country by our president in this war in iraq. cause i personally beleive that once we eventually leave it will decay to its present form. it is a waste of us soldiers their precious lives. and our supplies. i wouldnt be surprised if the gas prices arent going up in part to the huge ammount of oil the government s buying to keep tanks, humvees, helos ect. going. conservatives for the msot part mean just that conserving our countries resources and makeing government smaller instead of doing liek the current administrator and creating more beurocracy.

*ponders idea* *giggles* *starts list of events*

Hooray for "smut"!!

We had D/s WEEK, where were you?!?!