Mac OS X Leopard -- Introducing Vista 2.0

The WWDC is on Monday! Here's some news from Apple Insider:



http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1942

For those who want to follow the WWDC announcements live via text tomorrow starting at 10:00 PDT, check out this site for a list of hosts:

http://community.livejournal.com/macintosh/2449585.html

~Ulrika~

Poor apple folk.. But at least they got intel hardware now

I can only hope that their "hasta la vista, vista" comments mean that they're finally going to try to be direct competition to Microsoft by opening up their OS to non-apple hardware. Naw, that's probably just a pipe dream.

I would buy their OS in a heartbeat if they released it for non-apple hardware. Their decision to try to keep their OS linked to their hardware is a double-edged sword for them. Their hardware costs more, and they're the only ones making it, so they get all the profits from the sales of their hardware, but because their hardware costs more, they lose out to Windows because a lot of people who aren't rich aren't willing to buy computers you can't upgrade. As they do offer computers that aren't as expensive, those computers can not be upgraded. Their only truly upgradeable machines generally cost in excess of $2000. I like being able to upgrade my video card, and I like being able to upgrade my motherboard, processor, and faster memory when it becomes available without spending the high cost of a whole new machine, which is the primary reason why I use Windows.

Ditto to what Fmeh said.

But at the same time, this is what keeps OSX running as it does. They dont have to try to get it to work with all versions of a CPU, RAM, or motherboard. Just theirs.

Rumor has it that the next iteration of workstations will have CPUs that aren't soldered to the motherboard. This means that they'll be just as upgradeable as a PC, the only caveat being that one must select hardware (chipsets) that is supported. For instance instead of purchasing one of Apple's internal bluetooth modules for a G5, one can buy a D-Link USB bluetooth key. They use the same chips so the drivers are maintained by Apple.

~Ulrika~

WWDC keynote speech is wrapping up.

You can see details with pictures here:

http://www.engadget.com/2006/08/07/live-from-wwdc-2006-steve-jobs-keynote/

Apple announced new quad-core Xeon Macs Pro at US$1000 less than comperable Dell machines.

The next version of MacOS will have integrated virtual desktops (Spaces), integrated automatic incremental backups (Time Machine), improved universal access, and numerous interesting improvements to Mail, iChat, Photobooth, Front Row.

Check it out.

~Ulrika~

wewt. the new Mac Pros should kick some serious @$$. Great bang for the buck too.

...and I got a preview release of Leopard now.

I was undecided before, but I am now ditching all plans I had previously to upgrade my Opteron box (new graphics card, more RAM, etc.). Not going to waste the money now. I'm selling the Opteron machine and my G4 and getting a Mac Pro ASAP. With Boot Camp and parallels, there's no point in running two machines any more just so I can play an occasional game on the PC.

...and hooray for dual optical drive bays and quad internal HDD bays!

I just purchased my new Mac Pro a few minutes ago. Now I just have to wait for Leopard.

~Ulrika~

...so I take it you aren't at WWDC then?

I'll trade you my Leopard preview disk for your Mac Pro

I was so hoping that there'd be native Windows API support. *crosses fingers*

I'm not at the WWDC but I live close to where it's held. Does that count?

No trade but let us all know what you think of the new OS. Details were few on the improvements to iCal and Spotlight, despite big improvements. Even their website omits any real details (and has no movies).

~Ulrika~

Over priced intel hardware at that.
AMD: twice the computer, half the cost.

The Mac Pro is now one of the fastest desktops money can buy with four 64-bit Xeon cores. Additionally, the basic Mac Pro configuration costs $2500 in contrast to the comperable Dell configuration which costs $3600.

Myth busted on both fronts. See for yourself:

http://blog.dealnews.com/?p=45

~Ulrika~

I just got done talking to Apple (the Apple store) on the phone. Unfortunately, they do not offer a bare bones version of the Mac Pro. I was hoping I could get the tower itself, the 2ghz version of the processor, with no memory, no hard drive (I hate Maxtor drives, I much prefer Seagate), no optical drives, and no video card so I could get those things myself separately--it would probably bring the price down closer to something more reasonable, like $1,100-$1,300. They don't offer anything like that--just like with Dell, you have to purchase a package, but at least their packages aren't as much of a ripoff as Dell's packages, but they still cost A LOT more than if I was to get them separately by doing shopping for the lowest priced components.

Apple does not seem interested in getting in the part of the computer market that has made Windows based machines so popular to the general public (the part of the public that makes less than $18,000 a year). $2,100 is their lowest priced Mac Pro. The everyday Joe is not going to be able to afford that, and many people, including myself, think it is foolish to purchase a machine that can not be upgraded, with the exception of laptops.

Apple still seems to have their head in the sand when it comes to this. They will NEVER become viable competition to Windows as long as they continue these kinds of patterns.

One can build a windows based mid grade machine for $500 to $800 (minus the cost of the OS itself), and a high-end machine for $1,400 to $1,600.

I just don't understand Apple. They definitely have a different business model than Microsoft, and I don't think they're any less greedy--they just put their greed into different things.

Once they offer a tower that's close to $1,000 instead of being "$1,000 less than a comparable Dell", then I'll be impressed.

And, if you decide to customize the Mac Pro system to be maxed out, you can spend a "measly" $13,833, and that's not even including a monitor. What a savings! The "low" end is $2,100, and the high end is $13,833.

Once Apple actually starts to care about people that aren't at least somewhat wealthy, maybe they'll be able to compete with Microsoft. Their new slogan, "Haste La Vista, Vista" doesn't have a chance of becoming a reality until they do.

EDIT: I also called them again just a few minutes ago to find out if they have any plans on releasing a low end tower, since their entire history of tower releases (new anyway) have always been over $2,000. The answer is no. But one never knows what Steve Jobs may have up his sleeve--he's a pretty secretive guy.

I had the same problem! I called up Mercedes and asked them if they'd sell me a car without the engine but they said no. The greedy bastards apparently only sell the car as a whole unit. Mercedes does not seem interested in getting into the parts market that's made the Yugo automobile so popular. $21,000 is their lowest price C-class.

I also called them again just a few minutes ago to see if they have plans on releasing a low-end car, since in their entire history of four-door releases (new anyway) have always been above $20k.

They won't last long.

~Ulrika~

Yay Ulrika.
You tell 'em like it is

Apple sells Mac Minis from $599, MacBooks from $1099, and iMacs from $1299. The MacPro line is for professionals. It is the high end line of Apple products. Why would you think that somebody who makes less than $350 a week would expect to be able to buy a business machine? The MacPro line is targeted at the high end of the market.



No, the problem isn't with Apple, the problem is with your idea that Apple views Microsoft as its competition. It doesn't. Apple is a computer maker, Microsoft is a software maker. One of the features of an Apple computer is its proprietary operating system. Apple doesn't sell the OS, it uses the OS to sell Macs. Apple really isn't in direct competition with Windows. It is really in competition with Dell, Gateway and other computer makers. And if you look at Microsoft, they do a lot of business selling software for Macs. The two companies aren't really direct competitors.




I'm hardly wealthy and I own Macs. They aren't competing with Microsoft, they're using their own OS as a way to sell their hardware. And it works. Apple is one of the largest computer makers in the world.

Um, true. But isnt a Mercedes a Luxury vehicle? A Computer is a tool. But if you got the bucks to buy one, then you dont need the brains to build one.

And yes, you CAN buy & build your car part-by-part. Dealerships are for those who have no clue how to deal with cars (or fix 'em).

And Fmeh? High-End PCs are even cheaper to build now. Within a few weeks I'm ordering a Dual-Core AMD. They're really really dropping prices on this stuff to keep folks away from Conroe. Ok, Video cards are still a bit high priced. Plus, AMD is supposedly working on more than just 2 cores on one die, planning on either the release or announcement in 2007.

And yea, Maxtor hard drives? LOL! I've replaced more dead Maxtor drives than anything. Hopefully Seagate will turn that around.

I read about the highpoints of the new Mac OS on CNet (Geez, I hate that site but I keep going back). Not bad. From what I gathered, the speech recognition is improved, and it understands Braille (say what??). The whole "Virtualization" thing is, eh. Already have it myself. Its free. It works. And by Golly! there's an improved "search" feature? Just how dumb are people anymore?? Can't remember file names or extentions? Shit! I have 4 hard drives running & can tell you whats on each one, plus the other PC's on my network. The Backup stuff is no biggy. It looks Ok, though. But just like Vista, I wont be convinced till its out.

And Ulrika? two Quad-core Xeon Processors? Bleh! 3 Ghz? Is that all? What are you gonna do with it anyways? Thats a server, not a workstation. But if you were really really nice, maybe you can donate one to LL as an asset server??

BTW- please tell me CNet had a typo when they said it comes with "up to 16 MB of RAM". I hope they meant "Gigabyte". Or I'm really really gonna laugh at ya.

640 kB is enough for anyone.

~Ulrika~

Your analogy is stupid. It conveys a lack of insight or research for the expediency of producing the analogy. Not only does Mercedes sell individual parts (as do all major car manufacturers), they also have a vast, vast variety of custom parts, options and such. You can even acquire the frame to a c-class if you want. Heck your mechanic could hook you up with that pretty easily.

Here's a few examples of the G class. (just because they look cool.)
http://www.rubicon-trail.com/G-Class/wheels/armored.html

You could also very probably buy wholesale parts from DaimlerChrysler (the owners of the Mercedes brand) and create your own brand based on their platforms. It certainly wouldn't be the first time automakers have done that. (Geo Metro/Suzuki Swift/Chevy Sprint/Pontiac Firefly/Suzuki Cutlus is a good example).

Don't be an asshat. We were all having a perfectly good time until you popped into the thread and started slinging mud. It's just a thread about some new computer. So, get your priorities straight, please.

~Ulrika~

Agreed. The Start button IS stupid. Does that mean Apple is trying to compare it's upcoming OS to something that contains something so blatently stupid? Not really sure myself.




Would you prefer 'unmotivated', 'irrelevant', 'offtopic', 'lacking', 'silly', 'incorrect' or some other adverb? Stupid seemed pretty darn accurate. Don't get me wrong, I love it when software and hardware engineers come together to make a really decent product. Even when that product is mostly purposeless to my interests. But seriously, Apple's comparison of it's new OS to Vista is pretty stupid in the first place (whichever way you tend to lean on the subject). Oh well.

Ah. You're being an asshat because you're an MS fanboi who popped in to give grief to people who are excited about Apple's new hardware and software. At least we're on the same page now.

~Ulrika~

I'm not an MS Fanboi. The last few MS operating systems have not duely impressed me by any stretch. They seem to be going down the road of "Our users are clueless". It simply begins and ends with competitive analogies between the two between the two being purposeless. The last thread we had on mac vs pc (or the pc vs mac vs linux vs unix vs pie one) boiled down to whatever suits your needs best, use. I don't think Leopard and Vista will change that.