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Stopping Developers Incentive?

Usagi Musashi
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Join date: 24 Oct 2004
Posts: 6,083
12-19-2005 21:55
From: Gladius Luchador
If that is the case: Why do the money chairs keep paying out endlessly. Wouldn't the more financially profitable thing to do would be get people on the chairs for that first 6 minutes, pay 'em, then kick them off/out to make room for the new avie who hasn't been in the sim yet and contributed their 'daily dwell allowance'?


Have you noticed a few of the largers locations either reducing their chairs money or reducing chairs?! I say YEAAAAAAAAAAAA if they do a fix with dwelling this chair chair thing is getting way out of hand.
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Travis Lambert
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Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,819
12-19-2005 22:01
From: Gladius Luchador
I was under the impression there already was a maximum amount of dwell an avatar could give out. Wasn't there some six minute rule or something. Where if you spent 6 mins (or whatever) on any one property, the amount of time you spent beyond that time period was pretty much useless (meaning: didn't add any more dwell than you had already given).

:confused:

If that is the case: Why do the money chairs keep paying out endlessly. Wouldn't the more financially profitable thing to do would be get people on the chairs for that first 6 minutes, pay 'em, then kick them off/out to make room for the new avie who hasn't been in the sim yet and contributed their 'daily dwell allowance'?


Not exactly.

You'd be correct if everyone spent their 6 minutes in the camping chair, then logged out and went absolutely nowhere else.

However, since most folks move around from place to place, it is in the camping-chair operators' best interest to keep the person in the same spot for as long as possible: thus watering down the proportional amount of time spent in other locations, and giving the camping chair owner a proportionally larger slice of that avatar's daily dwell-point contribution.
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Magnum Serpentine
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Join date: 20 Nov 2003
Posts: 1,811
12-19-2005 22:08
From: Chip Midnight
I wonder how much this decision has to do with camping chairs.



Wonder what part did the FIC and Starchamber play in this????????
Gladius Luchador
Secutor
Join date: 8 Feb 2005
Posts: 95
12-19-2005 22:13
From: Travis Lambert
Not exactly.

You'd be correct if everyone spent their 6 minutes in the camping chair, then logged out and went absolutely nowhere else.

However, since most folks move around from place to place, it is in the camping-chair operators' best interest to keep the person in the same spot for as long as possible: thus watering down the proportional amount of time spent in other locations, and giving the camping chair owner a proportionally larger slice of that avatar's daily dwell-point contribution.


Ahh. Well that makes perfect sense then, with regards to keeping them as long as they can keep them. Thanks for clearing that up for me.
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Magnum Serpentine
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Join date: 20 Nov 2003
Posts: 1,811
12-19-2005 22:14
From: Persephone Phoenix
My sense of the thing is that camping chairs were driving the thing into the dust (though moneyballs were the same thing, the camping chairs were guaranteed so people were happy to leave their avies there overnight). We were already affected by the camping chairs: for the first time in almost a year the spa didn't make the Dwell list in November, though we run 3-5 well attended events per week, have residences, plaza, etc. We've always been mid-list since February of last year. Last month, we were knocked off altogether, so the camping chairs already eliminated the biggest help of Dwell for us.

Clearly, the intent of the developers incentives were being missed but I do hope something that actually rewards content (in the manner of the FFRC maybe, but larger scale and linden financed?) is put in their place. I wrote in to suggest that perhaps they could consider grants for projects or teir relief for those who choose to continue actually providing content in the form of interesting interactive builds, events, etc.

What do you guys think could be done instead of Dwell to reward development? Also, do you think this will mean a lot of people off-loading tier?



I see it this way...

A very small elite group did not like the fact people were earning money and earning it in a matter not approved by them

A bit of complaining, a bit of screaming

And now all suffer.....
Magnum Serpentine
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Join date: 20 Nov 2003
Posts: 1,811
12-19-2005 22:16
From: Ingrid Ingersoll
I'm hoping for a new system that isn't as easily gamed.




The System was never gamed.

Its just a group who does not like seeing people earn money... Yes they earned it by sitting in those chairs, but they earned it.
Usagi Musashi
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Join date: 24 Oct 2004
Posts: 6,083
12-19-2005 22:23
Chairs is just another way to make dwelling. Ok maybe in some ways it causes a boom in dweling but at these short term growths or long term . I bet without the money chairs you see a decline.
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Siggy Romulus
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12-19-2005 22:35
From: Magnum Serpentine
Wonder what part did the FIC and Starchamber play in this????????


I'd hazard a guess the same as the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus... hate to be the one to break the news...
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From: Jesse Linden
I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread
Hiro Pendragon
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Join date: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,905
12-19-2005 22:41
Thank god... us scripters and builders have been begging for developer incentives to be fixed for years now.

The only people who really benefitted from dwelloper awards were club owners and malls.
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Magnum Serpentine
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Join date: 20 Nov 2003
Posts: 1,811
12-19-2005 22:43
From: Chip Midnight
They weren't working. If it was intended merely as a reward for where people spent time they'd have been called dwell awards, not developer incentives. They were meant to be a catalyst for development of richer, more interactive attractions and destinations. They were not intended as a refund for people who buy their way onto the list with money chairs.



I don't see how the Camping Chairs effected anyone... The only thing I see is that the FIC just doesn't want people earning Lindens unless they actually make a product to sell and we have all screamed at the FIC and told them not everyone is cut out to make things to sell.
Magnum Serpentine
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Join date: 20 Nov 2003
Posts: 1,811
12-19-2005 22:52
From: Chip Midnight
They do it for the same reason people file share instead of paying for music... because they can, and because they want a free ride. If file sharing didn't exist all those people wouldn't stop listening to music. Most of them would buy it. There's plenty of entertainment content in SL already that people would be willing to pay for. The only reason they don't is because the expectation has been created that they shouldn't have to. Welcome back to reality.



Are you saying earning money any way but the approved way is wrong?????
Pham Neutra
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Join date: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 478
12-19-2005 23:25
From: Magnum Serpentine
Are you saying earning money any way but the approved way is wrong?????
It's not "wrong" in a moral meaning. It just doesn't make much sense for the business goals of Linden Lab.

And they are paying the DI. They are doing this not for charity but intented it to have some effect - in the long run an effect with favourable consequences for the bottom line of LL. They saw that the intended effect is not there (anymore). So the cancelled the program. It was "wrong" for them you could say.
Cristiano Midnight
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Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
12-19-2005 23:31
From: Magnum Serpentine
Are you saying earning money any way but the approved way is wrong?????


A bunch of basic accounts sitting afk in a club artificially boosting its dwell so that Linden Lab can pay money to them is of zero benefit to Linden Lab, or to Second Life. If places want to reward people for being there, that is one thing - there is nothing wrong with that. You know full well the camping chairs are just lame, and a way to game the system. There is zero justification for them, and if anything, they just accelerated the demise of the current form of the DI. So in other words, congratulations to those who game the system to make a quick buck - as usual, you ruin it for everyone.
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Eggy Lippmann
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12-19-2005 23:35
From: Magnum Serpentine
Are you saying earning money any way but the approved way is wrong?????


Why are so many people afraid of buying linden dollars?
IMHO the buy process needs to be made more transparent. Sort of like, LL would let people have "stipend tiers" but the money would automatically come out of LINDEX instead of just being CREATED. Or, to make it even less complex and more transparent, tie this new "stipend tier" to the current land tiers. That way you can make sure that both LL and the content creators get compensated equally.
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
12-19-2005 23:40
From: Cristiano Midnight
You know full well the camping chairs are just lame, and a way to game the system.
Is that why no one ever talks to me in a club!

~Ulrika~
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Torley Linden
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Join date: 15 Sep 2004
Posts: 16,530
12-19-2005 23:44
The weird thing in clubs and the like is I often have very polar experiences... half the time no one will say anything, and the other half I get greeted right away, and often, extremely friendly. Not much room for variation inbetween, but it's one of those experiences I've long found to not be too common. Which is sad, 'cuz I wish it were..
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Ulrika Zugzwang
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12-19-2005 23:53
Darko Cellardoor had a good club. I went there once and was thrilled at how friendly he was. Wench Phaeton showed up with one of the first photographed skins and became an instant celebrity. :)

~Ulrika~
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Torley Linden
Enlightenment!
Join date: 15 Sep 2004
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12-19-2005 23:57
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
Darko Cellardoor had a good club. I went there once and was thrilled at how friendly he was. Wench Phaeton showed up with one of the first photographed skins and became an instant celebrity. :)

~Ulrika~


Wow, was that the Cannabis Carnival? What was the date of that?
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Hiro Pendragon
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Join date: 22 Jan 2004
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12-19-2005 23:58
From: Eggy Lippmann
LL would let people have "stipend tiers" but the money would automatically come out of LINDEX instead of just being CREATED.

This is an excellent idea and deserves consideration and furhter development.

I would add that people could just spend L$, and have it billed when it reaches a threshold - either a USD$ amount, or after a certain time.
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Willow Zander
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Join date: 22 May 2004
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12-20-2005 00:35
From: Hiro Pendragon
Thank god... us scripters and builders have been begging for developer incentives to be fixed for years now.

The only people who really benefitted from dwelloper awards were club owners and malls.


Yeah thank god for those of us that wanted a nice Community sim that don't have much talent, can't build, script or do stuff for fudge after having tried for over 18mths.

THANK GOD!!!!
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Usagi Musashi
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Join date: 24 Oct 2004
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12-20-2005 01:12
another topic getting off the subject matter.
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
12-20-2005 01:15
From: Usagi Musashi
another topic getting off the subject matter.


so stop posting completely irrelavent comments like that? no one forces you to participate in the thread, but if you want to, why not attempt to be constructive and on topic? All I ever see from you are snide comments about other people's posts, and very little of actual substance.
Usagi Musashi
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12-20-2005 01:18
From: Kris Ritter
so stop posting completely irrelavent comments like that? no one forces you to participate in the thread, but if you want to, why not attempt to be constructive and on topic? All I ever see from you are snide comments about other people's posts, and very little of actual substance.


Pardon me, but who made you boss? Sorry but are thread replies only for a chosen few?
gesh:/
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Kris Ritter
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Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
12-20-2005 01:20
From: Usagi Musashi
Pardon me, but who made you boss? Sorry but are thread replies only for a chosen few?
gesh:/


I was just pointing out what a complete and utter hypocrite you are is all. But that's ok, we have plenty of 'em here, so don't despair.
Usagi Musashi
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Join date: 24 Oct 2004
Posts: 6,083
12-20-2005 01:21
sorry kris since i don`t know your other personalities on sl i would not know which threads your refering to with the flaming remark.......come on its holiday season give it a break ok. geshhhhhhhhh
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