Escorts: SL Definition

I haven't passed judgement on anyone. I don't see why you or anyone else must on me.

I won't tolerate these attacks. I'm reporting each one.

...

It's clear this is a controversial topic, for sure, and it's good to be discussed. You'll notice that I have not expressed a single opinion on the matter.

Or, Nolan, can you not distinguish between opinions and questions? Can I not post an opinion poll (which is very, very straight forward about the wording) about a controversial subject and not have educated people such as yourself flame me?

Yes, except some highly regulated parts of Nevada.


Very interesting that prostitution is legal, but not pimping or soliciting.

I reiterate that this thread is not about RL prostitution. I think, at the most liberal definition of "escort" in SL, it equates to selling phone sex.

Whaaaaaa?

Report away. I hope you realize you haven't a leg to stand on. Nothing in my post constitutes an attack on you. And as far as "not tolerating.." - I think we'll leave that up to LL to decide; ok?

I find it highly ironic that you think you're allowed to ask me for my opinion, and then when you don't like said opinion, you resort to reporting me.

Can you address my points without copping out and being so damned defensive? What the heck did you expect posting nonsense like this? Did you think everyone would say "you go Hiro!"?

How is it even sex if they engage in what you are insinuating they do? How Hiro? There is no physical contact, and in the world I live in, that means it's not sex. And this is my point. I didn't say that you passed judgement. I indicated that I think it's a silly issue to be worrying about in the first place because: It's not sex. Just as me flying a plane in SL is not me flying a plane in RL. Your poll is predicated on the assumption that it IS sex. I disagree. Can I disagree without you having to feel compelled to report me?

On a side note - I think that the phrase "phone sex" is a misnomer as well. There is no human to human contact. It's more like role-playing over the phone than anything else.

Report this one too, I am sure LL needs a few more chuckles to lighten their day.

I dunno, insinuating that I'm so unintelligent that I can't differentiate dying in SL and dying in RL seems to me to be a pretty straightforward attack. No?


I didn't ask for your opinion on prostitution, or AV prostitution.

I asked for your opinion on what a word means. You've gone off topic.


Sure, sorry... next time you insult my intelligence I'll go ahead and remember not to be defensive. My bad. </sarcasm>


That is a loaded question. It's not nonsense; mine was a simple question:
"What does the word 'escort' mean to you in the context of Second Life?"


No, I expected people to be civil, and if they wanted to, vote.
You are, so far, the only one to be breaking this expectation.


Please quote where I say it's sex. Then I'll answer this question.
I think you'll find that I won't have to answer because you're the one jumping to conclusions.


No, this post of yours was a series of questions; there was nothing attacking in it.

this is funny let me frame it and put it on my wall

Why? Was my first post not clear enough?

It's a question based upon your assumptions in the thread that motivated you to post this. Do you not stand by those sentiments? For example: No wonder you didn't want that link in this thread. It reveals your motivations and position, so please spare me the insult to MY intelligence by trying to play this thread off as some innocuous data gathering attempt. I read that thread Hiro, and I have read your others dealing with how you would like to impose your belief set on other people in the past on these forums. I took exception to them then, and I take exception now. That is NOT an attack. It IS my opinion.

You did, if indirectly.

Yes, you asked my opinion on what a word means, and now for the third time, I am telling you that I think it does not mean sex, even if the people involved get on pose balls.

You're taking a question I asked in earnest as an attack on your intelligence. That's your choice.

And I told you what I think. Apparently you want to base a thread on that other thread and then expect that people wouldn't take your sentiments in that thread into account in this thread. Sorry, I will not do that, as the two are obviously related.

I was civil. I didn't name call, personally attack you or anything of the sort. If you are going to make assumptions and post about it, at least have thick enough skin to be able to field less than cuddly questions.

Again: I know, you want to bury that, even though that thread in which you posted that is the impetus behind this thread.

Finally, you see the light!

no i think you reserve passing judgement for other things such as my life...btw i lost the baby so feel free to think "she deserved it" now

What assumptions? You're the one assuming. I've stated myself very clearly.


I stated very clearly in the other thread what my intentions were:
1. I am sick of endless bad advertisements of events and jobs flooding the forums and taking away from the other events and listings that don't violate (or skirt) the TOS.
2. 25L/hr is a piss-poor salary.


Okay, this is hypocritical.

If you take exception to what you say was me trying to "impose my beliefs", wouldn't you want me to censor my own posts and omit my opinions? The only conclusion I draw is that you don't want me to post at all, and that is Draconian.


No, I didn't. I say what I mean. You inferred the other questions. I take exception to your clear misreading of my thread based on your admitted previous bias against me.


Okay, well... then. That's your opinion. I made the poll so people could express opinions, that includes ones that may agree or be contrary to my own. Why not leave it at that instead of coming out and attacking me?


Don't even.

If a person asks an insulting question to another person, then the interlocutor has no obligation to answer. For example, if someone asked another person, "Hey, are you stupid or just plain retarded?" it'd be quite insulting, no? Just because something is a question doesn't mean it has to be answered, and doesn't give it immunity from being classified as "attacking" or "insulting".


More assumptions.

This thread provides a clarification for the other thread, but the reverse is not true. There is a relationship from A -> B, but not B -> A. Your logic is flawed because implication is not reflexive.


(See explanation of attacking/insulting questions, above.)


That thread is literally over a year old.
1. Opinions are subject to change.
2. Many people were horribly taken out of context - the thread was closed for a reason.

But, that particular quote... well, take a look at this poll, Nolan. I was statistically correct.


No, I never stated that your previous thread was attacking, merely the first.

p.s. It's just the forums. I will forget all this when I log on. I hope you will to, in the interest of discussion of difficult topics.

More assumptions.

The one truth in all this is highlighted in bold text above, thanks for proving my point.

Let's just leave it at this, posted on SEVEN TWENTY NINE, TWO-THOUSAND AND FIVE (which you've now deleted):



I am not going to point by point you, because you're starting to sound like someone else who used to post here, a person who tried to used piss-poor rhetorical devices to mask his true intentions.

Have a happy.

Well. This thread sure started off productively.

I generally do not carry this stuff over, so no worries.

I have always been touchy when this kind of thing surfaces, whether it be people complaining about av sex or what have you. If it doesn't affect your "game", I just don't see the point.

Please either address my arguments or acquiesce. In English - if I'm full of crap, don't just tell me I'm full of crap, explain why.


Please refer to last comment.


Firstly, even though it's deleted, it's clearly visable in the next thread. I realized this when I deleted.

Secondly, I can take anything you say, bold the right words, and it will look bad.
For example, watch this:

See? It plays an optical trick on your brain.



or ... maybe it's because you are starting to be unable to stand up to my arguments? Said person you mention was never able to support his/her assertions. I can.

*swoon*

Exactly! Here is the scientific definition of sex for you : sex is one of two specimen categories of species that recombine their genetic material in order to reproduce in a process called genetic recombination. Gosh, do we need to invite Bill Clinton here to tell you what sex IS ?

In real life it can be argued that prostitution spreads sexually transmitted diseases, drug addiction, crime and danger to woman, therefore it's illegality can be justified beyond moral terms. None of this applies to SL. Then how is this topic different then discussing, avatars in SL should not be allowed to carry semi automatic weapons and shoot at people, because it is illegal in real world!

Let's say I created an object that looked like a powder and called cocaine and sell this in SL for 100 lindens, would this be illegal or against the TOS too?

I wonder what will be next? Perhaps we should discuss whether avatars are created by intelligent design or have evolved from more primitive organisms

People, we need open and free societies in virtual worlds. We have enough moral conundrums in real life.

Sex is what goes on between your ears, whether in RL or SL .... like Morpheus in the Matrix opined, reality is just a collection of nerve impulses....
So, in reality, sex in SL is as real as sex in RL.

As to the Linden attitude, a wise land baron once told me, "Three things really sell in SL: sex, clothes and land." So why would the Lindens want to shut down a major portion of the economy? Frankly, they won't. ... and keeping it discrete by using the word "escort," is the way to keep it so.

Beyond that, there is a feminist view that women prostitute themselves more broadly than the narrow definition of the sex trade. If you marry for money, what is that? And how many other ways do women sell out to men?

Have a great day, and this is really a good thread, although the Magnum PI photos take up too much real estate!

Please direct discussion about "what is sex in sl" to this thread:
/120/a5/56680/1.html#post596726

and let this one go back on topic, please.

... i think you're splitting hairs ....

Your question is does the word escort in SL imply sex for sale?

that does open up discussion about whether "sex" in SL is actually sex. So I think everything about your poll question is properly in your thread.

(my 2 lindens)

I disagree, this is not real sex, it is simulated sex. The same neuronal network can also be stimulated through different emulations or simulations, either through sexual organs or possibly in future by nano-probes that can trigger a pleasure of centers in the brain. While real sex invokes the same neurnal triggering, it requires a physical interaction between two individuals that may potentially lead to exchange of genetic material.

Here is a thought experiment for you. Let's imagine someone created two avatars, one female as an escort and one male the client (or vice versa). He or she then started two instances of second life and performed simulated sex between these two avatars. In SL two avatars were involved in this act but in real life same person was controlling both. What do you think this was?

.. you're being way too biological ...
This has nothing to do with biology, and "exchange of genetic material," or whatever other genetic-babble you want to throw in ....
The question about sex in SL is, does it affect the same brain pleasure centers as RL sex? Answer, yes. If it didnt, there wouldnt be so much of it in SL.

I already said it affects the same brain pleasure centers as RL sex (most likely). But the question posed in this thread did not ask about the definition of masturbation looking at porn in SL. It was a specific reference to the legality of sexual acts that involves exchange of money, which invariably has to occur between two individuals (unless you want to comment on my thought experiment). Therefore, the proper definiton of sex is highly relevant and can not be generalized by saying they all end up at the same neurons.

In fact, I am sorry to inform you that it all has to do with biology, including the activation of pleasure centers in your brain at the level of neurons or for that matter the thoughts you generated to write these arguments It's all biological one way or another, my intention with my "genetic-babble" was to point out the evolutionary reason for physical or real sex. It is that reason, which creates all these moral questions in human societies. That is a deeper discussion topic though and not for this thread.

Unable to stand up to your arguments? Arrogant much?

How telling that you have started another thread to to tackle the point I am making here!

The highlighting? I highlighted one sentence. I did not pick and choose snippets here and there, and make a personal attack out of them as you have done. Hypocrite much?

What I was doing was using your own statement to show that the point I was making, the one you denied as valid, was in fact true.

This is my bus stop. I am getting off the bus here, not because Hiro thinks he's won, but because Hiro is growing ever more disingenuous. There is no point in arguing with someone who won't even be honest about his intentions.

I would imagine it would be a wholly unique version of mutual masturbation, combined with a literal interpretation of being told to go fuck oneself. Then again, I agree with Nolan's point - sex in SL is not real sex, thus escorts are not actually having sex, even if they are talking about sex with someone (they are simply talking about sex). Even if both people are masturbating on the other end, those are individual sex acts.

The topic of SL sex being sex at all is relevant to this thread, it is hardly off topic. Since you do not own the thread, Hiro, people are free to discuss it here if they want to without being herded over to your hastily created new thread just because Nolan had a valid point.

Indeed. I don't think that it's "real sex" any more than the internet cam shows where a nude woman touches herself for a per-minute fee while people watch. It's sexual entertainment, but it's not sex.