Rentals in Land for Sale

i was perusing the land for sale in search Sunday afternoon, and was very dismayed to see LAND RENTAL all over in search. Called live help got a very nice Linden that said it really couldn't be helped, that private region owners can do this and have found a "work around" way to sell land that is really in all actuality a rental. Island owners can "sell" land that cannot be resold. But still the word rental in a for sale listing in search i think should not be allowed, they should be buying and paying for classifieds like the rest of us.

These are not parcel listings that cost $30L a week either, but rather the listing that comes for marking land for sale and listing it on the net, actually maybe with all the land shark price fixing that's going on right now, maybe everyone should be paying for these listings, but definitely a for rent listing should be in a different category.

I don't see how a Linden could call it a "work around" when it's a feature they added .

They're not about to change it either, sim owners far prefer making people believe that it's only natural that you buy in order to rent.

As each property listed has room for a title it makes sense for a code to appear at the beginning of the title of the listing letting interested persons using Search > Land Sales know that it's land for actual sale (not a rental, not convenant land). Something like:

*NC/NR*
(which would mean: non-covenant/non-rental)

As an interested person scrolled through the land sales they'd be able to look for parcels with *NC/NR* at the beginning of the title.

Better filters on the land sale search page would make more sense. That way you don't have to wait for SL to return thousands of results that you aren't going to look at. Also, if you could set it for land below certain sizes and costing more than a certain amount, it would help narrow it down. And of course, being able to specify Mainland or private estate only.

Having just had to explain to a very upset new lady that the land she 'bought', for L$80,000 is in fact still under the jurisdiction of an island owner, and even though she has being paying her tier etc, the island owner can (and indeed is) leaving SL and that is that. The new lady has asked her landlord for a refund on the land, but was told 'you paid, you lived on it, and now it is over'.

I know that lots of island renters are no doubt very reputable people. I also know friends who rent on islands and are very happy with it indeed. But when newer people to the game honestly think that paying good money for land from a search system entitled 'land for sale' means that they have the same rights over the land as someone on the mainland? Well, that is just not fair.

Please, please, can we have some clarity of what is for sale and what is for rent? Two lists? Please?

Better filters on Search > Land Sales would be el fantastico... however, that involves Linden hands (the same Linden hands that recently broke Search > Places repeatedly). Until better land sales filters are put in place it makes sense for non-convenant/non-rental parcels to have *NC/NR* placed at the front of the title so that the ownable wheat can be separated from the non-ownable chaff simply by glancing through the land titles.

I addressed this early on:
/139/d4/149483/1.html#post1337288

It's totaly unfair to mainland renters besides confusing those seeking to buy (REAL FOR SALE) land and there are probably 10 different and simple things that could be done to solve the issue. Some good solutions are mentioned here in this thread.

it so absurdly easy to know what land is what, just do a map on it You can also look for covenents, simple.
The only people REALLY affected by island land sales and mainland land sales in the same search are the barons.
anything that slows THEM down lets normal people a little time to get to the land.
Period end of story.

and YES I do own islands and NO I do not "SELL"
My Residents Get their land deeded to them or their group for 0 Ls and just pay tier. Ive been doing this for over a year now and the model works great, People Love the idea of not being tied to the land, eventually IF and when they want their own island, its just a simple cancel of the lease. No Lindens lost in a bad land sale or stuck paying tier WHILE they are attempting to sell the land.

Im not so sure I like the idea of making people buy the land even if its only 3L per M

As for advertising? rarely, I have a waiting list so long I cant get islands fast enuff.
I also dabble on the mainland but as currently am almost sold out. as soon as the super inflated prices go back down, Ill be back.

and as for a lady who bought land for 80K and lost it, personally that is probally bullshit. I know if I lost that many Ls Id be posting it all over the place.
just one more "scare" tactic Im sure.

Except that this practice borders on misrepresentation - not that LL will do anything about that - and makes it well nigh impossible to find virtual sales amidst the virtual rentals.

Please continue as you are, but you can't convince me that what you are doing is Good.

I have rentals on the mainland and it has affected me with no doubt. Those who don't know better are thinking they can BUY land cheaper then they can rent, and in effect all they are doing is getting mislead into renting an island lot! To make it worse for them, they are paying upfront non-refundable fees disguised as "the purchase price" that I don't charge.

I am no land baron.

It's plain and simple free advertising that I don't have the same access to and that by itself makes the playing field unfair.

Maybe you should read Sara's post again. She clearly points out that while others do it, she doesn't make her tenants pay for the land .

When the estate bug hit, a few of my friends complained that they weren't able to tp. Their response to "just make an in-between stop on the main and it should work" was "mainland? what's that?".

Even if someone had heard about "estates and islands" and "mainland" and they were to pull up the map it wouldn't surprise if they'd think that something like Anshe's continent is actually mainland. Unless I happen to catch a "Plush" somewhere, I can't tell either without zooming or scrolling around. It looks like one huge land mass.

As far as covenants go, they're not intuitive and certain not common knowledge. Even a lot of people on the forums who are certainly far more knowledable than most residents mistakingly point out that on the mainland, the covenant will have Govenor Linden as the owner, it's actually just blank (none) on the mainland.

Right Kitty, and I don't think all are out to misuse this feature but there are many that do. I don't blame anyone for taking advantage of it for there benifit. I would just like the same opportunity

For the first time in my two and a half years in SL, I am renting.

Why? Land prices. I am not going to get wiped out (again) when they come tumbling down like they did a year ago or so.

Renting was not an easy decision, but so far it has worked out for me.

I have the advantage of having been in SL for a long time, because I know who I am dealing with and I am pretty sure they will not be gone tomorrow. I have never met them personally before, but I know of them as reputable SL residents. I would not be so inclined to pay for 'rental' land to someone I know nothing about.

I must definitely recommend Garth and Pituca Fairchang's properties. Their covenant and pricing are very reasonable, and they have been very professional, friendly and helpful. The way they have set up their island properties is really cool.

If you are looking for peace and tranquility, no clubs, casinos, or advertising, I would definitely recommend you take a look at what they offer.

http://www.fairchang.com/

Disclaimer: I am just a satisfied customer. I believe that just as we should complain about bad service or products, we should also give praise when someone is providing good service or selling a good product.

Not sure what that has to do with this thread???

It doesn't slow me down particularly.

I just believe on principle that I should be allowed to search for things relevant to me rather than having a bunch of rentals mislabelled as sales in my results.

It would also mean less (but more relevant) data is being sent back as the result of searching, which would help the servers. As I'm sure you're aware, various searches have been disabled at times recently to help alleviate the load they create.

So if is remains as you wish, it doesn't hurt your target but does affect a lot of other people.

I would just like to add a vote for somnehow seperating sales and rentals. It is very frustrating to look for land to buy only to see the price as some reservation fee for high priced parcel. Let's seperate these listings.

The confusing listing don't slow down land barons. They can read between the lines and instantly know what's what. It's the new member and uninitiated that are getting confused, slowed down, and in some cases, tricked.

This has been brought up with LL over 100 times now, both formally and informally. They have no plans to put in a filter. Makes one wonder why. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that they want to keep the buyers of their most profitable enterprise happy.

I'm all for that: I'm glad they added estate listings. And they should be listed. But not when it's at the expense of others.

I agree with the quoted comment below from HooDoo - however i do NOT agree that we should all possibly be paying for listings - i think that we should all be honest! Short of that there is a technical way to address some of this gross search inconvenience by building a better search with more efficient filtering.

The real estate - land search has become a ridiculous LABOR. Residents often post mildly if not out right false info as well. ** The real issue is that land search needs more granularity - Land for sale should be separate from lease, rentals and ads -so we can get to info we really need. This would allow us to better catgorize our searches. this si also part of traditinal classified listing style = not so unusual or un-doable i believe.

** Please - searching is so slow a process already - can we get more effective searching, categories and filters in the interface?

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Hear hear. I just about gave up on using the search doodad for land for just this reason. It's scammy and disrespectful of the Lindens to allow the confusion of buy/rent - it entraps the unwary into RL dollar charges and sets a tone for the whole experience which deliberately isolates those prepared to pay real money (as distinct from the endless legions of freeloaders) - and leaves them feeling like a chump.

That's not how you keep paying customers, and the resulting population is of low appeal to corporate advertisers.

Unless you're couring, say, the Shopping Channel...

I think the reply I received from LL to my question in Linden Answers dated 10th December, say says all....

Linden Lab are not interested and nothing to say


/139/3c/154074/1.html

If you haven't yet completely given up hope, check out the following post re: a new proposal in feature voting:
/145/a7/158420/1.html
The proposal number is 2645, and you can access the "Feature Voting" tool in the menu on the left hand side of the support page under "My Second Life".

feature voting

Have you looked at how many have ever been replied to, never mind enacted. In addition LL have already said they are going to change the feature voting. The feature voting section is pure PR at it's most cynical

There was already a proposal for this, put up many months ago, with many votes. It has been acknowledged, but never acted on.

I don't normally get cynical about thngs, but this one feels like a money-grabbing tactic by the lindens. They know they would sell less land for renting if they stopped the scamming tactics of some (notice I said some) land owners.

It doesn't look like they will do anything soon.

This didn't stop me from putting all of my votes in your proposal, Annabelle! We need to get lots more people voting on this. It's just toally wrong the way it is now!

Check out Proposition 1852. The Lindens have acknowledged the advantages of being able to filter in the ways we're discussing, and the matter is "in development."