$10k R/L dollars to START at the electric sheep co?

SL are like IRL thats all.. more money more seen.. more power.. more friends at the top...and what I know no one have told us anything else..

Some work in SL as IRL - some do it for fun.. and there are a space for all of us. I hope that. And still hope its like that. And hope it will be like that in the future..

BUT what I get some mad at are that most of the story that LL love to spread around (and the company investing in marketing in SL - to of course by heavy PR) - are al about people that make money-. a lot of money. And lately the most are about real companies that make entrance in SL.

And many of that kind of company, campus, and more - sims are not open for us regular 72 dollar a year or free accounts ones..

LL should also (not only) market the small people the small business in SL the happy smiling people.. that do all this for pure fun.

/Tina - She with that small cute store in the corner of Verloren - EXAKT.-.. that sim are open for all of us.. 24/7... no invitation needed..

This thread is a very handy resource! It's good to have a list of people who are willing to allow themselves to be exploited. If you think charging real world market value for professional programming and design work is somehow wrong, great! I'll be more than happy to pay you less than minimum wage while reselling your services to corporations for what it's actually worth. You'll have to take care of your own healthcare and you'll never be able to afford to live anywhere but your parent's basement but you seem quite content with that. Corporations get rich off the backs of people like you while you feel noble for letting them do it. Then again, as the saying goes, there's one born every minute.

The world isnt so black and white as that. Fun is a grey area which has different meanings to each person. You must remember when bashing people because they arent having the same type of fun as you are that they might be enjoying what they are doing.

Gosh I wish Michelangelo wouldn't have created so much and went clubbing instead.

The problem most people have with seeing art as work is that they have this ingrained into them that work has to be a boring and terrible thing to do. Creating can be the worst thing you can think of when you are blocked, but it can also be extremly rewarding.

'Fun' for me personally is that moment when I'm creating something and everything seems to fit together. When I'm in the zone and at the peak of creativity. When the rest of the world blurs around you. It has this sort of euphoric feeling when you are putting yourself into these creations. Its a high better than any drug. And when I finally come down and see that its been hours since I've even eaten, I don't care. I have something that I've created that has a bit of my personality and style.

Granted not everyone is like that, and you can see it in their work.

I hate clubs. I see no point in them for me. I hate small talk. I hate it when people stick around because they have nothing better to do but have nothing left to say. I especially hate it when people bash you for not thinking or being just like them. When I'm in a creative block is when I go out and find interesting things to do. Which then inspires me enough to break that block.

As for the electric sheep company.. they aren't the best in SL. But they are willing to take on commercial jobs that other's probably don't want. I like creating in SL because its the time when I create purely for myself. In RL I'm creating for others. Directors, producers, the audience, ect. Creating to other's specifications is extremly stifiling. Which is why they get paid more. It's no where near like doing custom work for other residents, as they might have an idea in mind but are generally more open to suggestions then an excutive at a corporation will be.

Like in most artforms, the SLebrities are not always the best of the best. Some are there because they are liked by other SLebrities. Some are there because their 'style' meshes with whats 'hot', not because of innovation or talent. Some are there because they've been around forever. Usually the ones that don't really belong there are the ones who's chests are puffed and really believe their poo doesn't smell. While still others are there because they should be.

No one's nibbling at your RL paycheck. Unless it's Uncle Sam Artists, which I consider designers and perhaps programmers as well, after my experiences in SL, should *not* get minimum wage. But they should also be capable enough to do a certain amount of work for a certain amount of money.

Again, if they're that slow to where a certain sum divided by hours worked puts them at the poverty level, maybe they should have rethought their major. If you're telling me that the 'average' graphics designer would take so long to decorate a sim that $10k USD would amount to minimum wage for him or her, well, that doesn't say much for the 'average' graphics designer.

I've seen rl doctors and professors build and script faster and better in SL. I mean, Jefferson whipped through Tango in a few hours. So, as Yellan H. said in a previous post. 'If you're not good at what you do, get better.'

Look I know that there are people who actually earn a living from doing RL graphic design work. And their experience SHOULD give them some sort of edge here. Either in knowing a great network of business people AND/OR in doing design work in SL. So, please tell me then...

Why have so many SL hobbyists learned to do the same thing, only faster and better? Is there really that low of a threshold to master the job? This only says to me that the overall gene pool in SL is higher than that in the smaller gene pool of graphics designers.

No. That's too hard for me to entertain. It may be that the hobbyist has nothing really on the line, is more relaxed and therefore glides through a build more easily? Dunno. I leave it to you to figure out, because, after alll, if they're not nibbling at your paycheck, they are sure nipping at your heels.

BTW...love SNAPZILLA!!!

Michelangelo was an indentured servent to the Catholic church. He was essentially a prisoner while painting the Sistine Chapel. That's why he incoprorated contorted and tortured versions of his own face on the bodies of falling angels. Fortunately we now live in a world where people with that kind of talent aren't exploited - unless they volunteer to be.

Enlighten me. Michaelangelo Buonarrata is Jefferson's hero. And he..or I..wouldn't like to make life hard on his latest incarnation. But are you suggesting, price fixing, ie, 'setting an industry standard for pricing' design and scripting services in SL?

Trust me, I think the pricing for doing graphics design will only go up as demand for services and product increases, and you will be indentured no more. Or be able to afford more paint for the ceiling, at the very least, without the worry that the $10k USD base rate will fluctuate that much.

Not sure what you wish. But, yes, you are an artist, and may the wind be at your back. Fragile souls, artists. I have a hard time seeing programmers as artists, but I am trying. And I sometimes am a bit rough in argumentation. Not a true artist's forte, I suppose. But it works so well in business and science

Hey, I know the going rate for mowing lawns is about $40-50, but I was wondering if you'd do mine for 25 cents... you know, as a hobby.

Your hostility is unwarranted.

How could Jefferson saying he 'loves me be unwarranted

And as to the lamer that suggested most hobbyists throw things together, Jeff not only put him in his place, but left him there in the dust. If you're going to DO something DO it in a big way. And he tends to do that. Yes.)

Looks like you've confused the fact that the $10,000 was per single contract job, not a yearly wage.

Am I the lamer? Because I didn't suggest that hobbyists throw things together, at least, I didn't intend to, if my words were unclear. Why would I? I am a hobbyist, one who takes pride in where he throws his prims.

Oh, brother. This thread's gotten ridiculous.

And, "put him in his place"?

The only thing you've accomplished is show your true harpy colours.

is trying to master the art of the clever ad hominem

So can manners. Would you like a tutorial?

Yes - that comment was based on the original post, which was related to the other (similar) thread indicating that ESC was hiring starting at US$10K.

Since then, obviously, that has been shown to be erroneous (although I stand by my comment that it is a low annual wage)

LOOKING FOR THE MUTE BUTTON FOR COYOTE



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Seminar was interesting

Yeah, great debater she is not

If it's debate you're interested in, do let me know. As it stands, you seem to be interested in wolf-packing anyone who disagrees with you (i.e. snapping at their heels).

Coyote? hehehhe

Read all the previous posts and write a report/send it to me via notecard in world and I promise to parse it and give you your final grade for today.


Ty for your interest

Yes, it is a very good name for me.

Not quite sure but I somehow think she viewed that as a compliment

Anyway, do hope the grid attacks don't put too many dents in salaries of any of us today.
Visit the Academy for a view of my next work which will take C. Midnight's concerns into consideration in pricing.

CHEERS!

Just to clear up a misconception, there are absolutely no Linden alts on the ESC staff, never has been. When I started my own dev company Tiny Seadog late last year, we got our share of RL contracts before we were ever approached by the Sheep about joining. The Sheep started out the same way - small company, worked hard, got bigger. Forseti addressed the misconception about getting "handed" projects by LL - to summarize, we aren't.

What.
The.
Hell?



Please let me point out I wrote an article on SLDrama, and THEN wandered into this mess...

http://www.sldrama.com/index.php

To those a part of the ESC, I salute you. I hope you do well, and and succeed where other's just suc.

Now, on to the point:

How many of you buggers would have noticed if ESC created web solutions for businesses? How about software design? Any number of OTHER jobs related to digital information processing and visual arts?

You would skimmed it and walked on without a clue.

Please. For the love of whatever diety you believe in. Stop with the stupid. These people are offering a service. This service may or may not be of higher quality as some of those that posted here. But none of you are offering your services in the business sector in a manner that a large corp can understand.

You think they charge too much, then compete with them. Otherwise, you're just the wind howling through the trees. I personally would look at people like you complaining and harping about $10 being too much, and would avoid you like the plague. Any business knows that quality, support, and speed cost money. Use the cheap labor, and you're going to pay when they get bored and logoff for a month.

Then again, what do I know. I'm just a Fool...