Copyright abuse in SL

okay but its made IN SL for use on avatars IN SL this is somewhat different there are a couple of things that are kinda sucky that are in my opinion anyhow copyright violations and probably pursuable IN SL

someone makes an original outfit (not batman or anything) they make it from head to toe and sell it for use on avatars (same with SL art like a photograph taking IN SL ) this is something that you can say is 100% yours and is theft and you have every right to go after the person

next is things like those who stream DVD stuff and sell/rent the movies for us by residents in SL this is a major problem because its being used as intended hehe

if this makes sense i dunno but that is how i judge it..

anyhow as you can see its a grey line and it depends on if you care or wants your stuff to be shown in SL from the outside world if the answer is no then pursue it but in most cases it has a positive impact and not a negative one so i dunno how much theft is occuring here

anyhow its impossible to filter out what is nto a copy and what is in this case if someone "stole" her outfit she would have no cause to go to LL because it wasn't hers in the first place.

most things in this game are modelled after one real world thing or another and its very difficult to stop it we have an inner eye and we use it. I make motorcycle jackets I can't say that the jacket was never made before in real life because it was i replicated it because i wanted one that looked like it for my avatar because it was cool. Is that theft? does my avatar have to go naked? lol does everything have to be bland and boring because in most cases everything has been thought of before at least once.

Long ago now there were no bamboo wind chimes in SL so i made some I am pretty sure someone copied them lol I see them or rather hear them all over now. But bamboo windchimes exist in real life and I got the sounds from a real world item .. was it original did i think of it? No i recorded it an imported it into a game how can I go to LL and say Hey "he stole my sound" i can't lol ... its there for anyone else to think of ..

yes its "how its used" not the fact that its being used

if i took a stormtrooper and stuck it in a movie called foo wars and called it mine and aired it in a movie theatre and charged money for it then its copyright violation

if i make a costume of a stormtroooper say its from star wars and sell it like that then the line becomes fuzzy i'm not misrepresenting it or anything they can go rent/buy the move just the same i am just well making a souvenir ...

also have you seen the WOW gear in this game a dev makes it i can't remember which one but when pi the dev island was not advertised he had a bunch of WoW orc gear there hehe

it had WoW stamped all over it so its not realy misrepresenting anything just mostly a huge walking add if anyone bought it. It was made for one of the yearly shows that linden lab has (very fine line) have to read the fine print to decide if its truly a violation or not.

Modelling your SL items after KINDS of things is totally permissible, be it plasticky sci-fi armour, wind chimes, or black motorcycle jackets, provided yours is your own interpretation of the genre. (N.B. It may be the case that RL clothing -sans logos of course- is not a copyrightable sort of thing anyway though. Interesting food for thought no?) Audiovisual works certainly are, so a windchime recording IS copyrighted (you'll have to record your own).




How it's used is important, but I think you have the wrong idea. Copyright owners have among their rights the right to control the reproduction, and the distribution of their works, as well as make derivative works. In this scenario, at best, your are distributing reproductions of a derivative work. (Even if you're giving it away for free). Misrepresentation is irrelevant for copyright.

In any case, I'm satisfied in noting that there is a TON of copyright violations happening on SL and in RL as well. Whether the copyright owner does anything about it or can even prove the copyright violation is an entirely different matter though.

That's not completely true. Lucas Arts allows you to create fan art like the stormtrooper costume. You're allowed to wear it, show it to anyone, give it away as a present. You're not allowed to sell it though. As soon as you earn money on StarWars content, it goes beyond fan artwork and becomes a copyright infringement.

Same case here. If those simpson avatars, stargates and whatnot are provided as freebies, it's likely no copyright infringement (depends on the view of the creator, most companies allow fan art). If anyone makes money with it, it should indeed be removed.

"However, where does copyright stop? You dont just have to TAKE something, like an art picture and upload it. What about looking at an art picture, drawing it freehand, and uploading it. I have seen this numerous times with clothing, and yes some very well known clothing designers. Even furniture! Is this legal?"


I think someone should put together some info on copyright and what you can and can not do, in plain english. I mean, yes you can try to find it out on google but some can not understand. I think a big part of all the copyright going on in SL is because people either dont understand or just think they won`t get caught. If someone takes the time to let people know what is not allowed and alternative methods maybe we would see less and less of it. Some copyright infringement is done on accident as well. Eg- A lot of paintbrushes for photoshop are copyrighted and the person with the brushes may not know. They get distributed through sites or passed around being told "these are free to use". I was just at a site the other day and this guy had some awesome brushes you could buy/free and he was selling them/giving them away saying "Royalty free! you can use for personal and commercial" however some of the artwork used in the prushes was from a copyrighted magazine.


The public domain was brought up in here. You can use art from there. Im not too sure you can use it for commercial purposes though, can you?

Well, here's where it starts getting a bit tricky. Stormtroopers are not trademarked for the purpose of dressing up as them... but they are trademarked for the purpose of being included in a computer game, and making one on SL could count under that. Yes, I know "it's not a game, it's a platform", but a) the judge has to agree with that (you can't just make up your own definition to avoid the law after all ) b) they could argue that you've used the platform to create a game.

Well as we speak there are other forms of copywite issues occuring....
SPORT TIME NAMES. NFL NHL MLB etc with teams copy written images...............Now I feel .LAbs whould just giveup dealing with Copy Write issues because for a very long time people just continue to abuse it. And besides We don`t Really own thing on sl anyways as Llabs says........ LOL I remeber one lucky chair screwy owner once bitch about me sitting in here chair. But what did she have in her shop........all stolen copywrittrn icons on her product she sold. See some people are just so so brainless when they feel its THEIR products( with a stolen image Pepsi, hello kitty etc............). The lack of brains seems to be the order of some of these content makers.

Well if people actually start enforcing copyrights in SL one good thing might come from it, no more goreans since those presumably fall under copyright.

Some time ago, I brought a series of Egyptial Wall, and Object textures Into SL, i had sourced them from a Product made for the Poser animation program (They WERE textures for a series of 3D computer models). I Modified them to Fit my Needs, then Imported them. I do NOT Sell them, and any Item i Make from them is created so the textures are One Part of the Item, Not the whole. Now, while doing a build, I received an Irate IM from a person Telling me Off for stealing thier textures. I First determined that this person Did Not work for Curious Labs, Nor the third Party contributer, Neither did they claim the RL name of the artist who created the Textures or objects for Poser. Next i Calmly told this Perso where i Took the textures from, and that he had No more legal claim to them that i did as we Both sourced them from the same product. On Top of that at NO time did i Either Sell the textures (The complaintant Did) Nor did i Ever claim that i had created them (The complaintant did BEFORE i pointed out what Product i had sourced them from and could readily Prove it) I was threatened with an AR. It Never happened, and the Irate complaintant simply faded back into the background.

It's been my experience so far (Because i DO work with Poser, Bryce, and 3DS Maxx) that probably 99% of all the Surface textures made available in SL have First been sourced from those and similar Programs, Free On Line texture sources, or Open source Clip art collections. I Frequently run into textures i have purchased in SL while i am Gleaning textures for my work in Poser.

I should also Point out that Most of the clothing i have seen has been copied from RL sources, or various fantasy collections (But unlike textures, there is a Very large representation of original design work present as well).

The ONLY place where i see Real Innovation consistantly is in the architecture of SL

Originality Isn't a Trait Common to all People.

I Have in the Past Copied some item that i saw in SL (Only once did i measure directly off the original) and NEVER have i presented such items as my Own work, Nor have i Ever distributed them either for Sale, or for Free. they were done ONLY as learning experiments to Improve my own technique (and so far ALL of them allowed Copy as an permission). the Importand thing is, i ALWAYS bought the Item i Copied.

They say Imitation is the sincerest form of Flattery. I think Maybe it's the second sincerest. I prefer being praised on MY creations, Not on Copy's of somebody elses.

Angel.

Thats all good and said, but still does not answer the questen..........are these people using copywritten material break rules here? So so strange how the people i refered to in my remark above had such bitchy Personal Im i got from her. She stole and made money off the hello kitty, sponge bob, and anotehr of otehr copywritten material. Those sports logic and players names as i read on the sports website are protected by those sports federations.

Well yes - ish. Let's game this one out and see how it would work. Vince is in London. SL aren't, and even to knock on the door and request RL address and details for legal serving would require Vince to engage the services of a US lawyer...

Back to square one. From an international perspective, there's a long and dishonourable huistory of US businesses, big and small, abusing their isolation to perpetrate copyright theft in exactly this way.

(actually, I wonder how another scenario here would game out in reality... suppose JK Rowling - or Terry Pratchett [both UK resident authors with copyright claimed for their works] came to SL with a demand to *discover* copyright breaches, reasonably expecting this to be possible since all the in-world data is held on assets formally owned by Linden Labs...)

When it comes down to copyrights, there's a blurry line between fan appreciation, and unacceptable infringement. Unfortunately, ONLY the person (or corporate entity) that holds the rights to that content, can truly decide where that line is. (and thankfully, a court of law must agree). If you hate someone who is making huge gobs of money off Spongebob avatars.. send some screenshots to Nickelodeon. But don't get upset when Linden Labs refuses to take down the content.. because Nickelodeon decided to look the other way.

If you are the copyright holder on a trademarked chratacter, or set of imagery.. then file DMCA papers with the courts and start your lawsuit against the infringer. When the Judge issues the DMCA takedown notices, LL will gladly comply. BUt if you don't own the copyrights.. feel free to rat out everyone you see selling ripoffs.

But don't get pissed when H&K starts getting mad about all the guns that were stolen from their designs. And when Ford sues Dominus because the Shadow looks too much like a Mustang.. or when your favourite gesture using a movie quote suddenly vanishes, and no one can find a decent video or audio shoutcast stream to tie to their land. And all that cheap/free porn that's uploaded to the grid starts turning into "Image Missing". And Paramount's lawyers shut down the Star Trek groups, take away their weapons and ships and uniforms and everything. And all those lightsabres and jedi outfits dissappear... and suddenly the stargate system vanishes overnight.

Someone actually told me that "it's impossible to make lace"... so they always just scanned it or grabbed it off the web.

Imagine an SL world without infringed content. With completely original textures, and entirely original characters and themes.

Pretty empty. And pretty generic for a long time indeed.

I'm not a legal expert, but my understanding of "derivative work" is this -

If you take a stormtrooper figure and make a cast from it, and then produce more figures from that cast, it's derivative. If you sit down with a wad of modeling clay and create your own figure from scratch, it's not a derivative work.

One can make the comparison with "clean room" versions of software.

It's ludicrous to suppose that anyone can have copyright on functionality. To say that someone owns the copyright on "something you hold which fires bullets" so no-one else can ever make a gun. I know some people are trying to claim they have the copyright/patent on, e.g. a hyperlink, but such people deserve no respect. Or I will register small plywood cubes and sue the lot of you!

Trademarks are something else again. These have to be very specifically defined as a phrase or design used in a certain context.

As I recall in the design world. One can redo a image with their own means ( hands computer etc ) and call it their own. well thats not always true to the laws.Mind you not all judges rule the same. Some look at examples or other judements otehrs base it on their own persona understand etc..........
If anyone has either studied or worked in a design field. You would understand content creation rules and conduct. Taking a image of hello kitty scanning it taking off a few parts dont to fly as one OWN creation. Infact its just opposite......reverse design......Too many creators on sl thinks by taking away a few pieces to a image means its their own. It does not............OKOK people are always going to say YEA YEA its mine.But really its not the creator of such image is that real owner. Have you been to china and their BS works or recreation of copywritten logos images???????? And SL is now turning in the VR china of stolen copy images and objects....... That stupid lucky chair own really needs to learn that one can`t bitch about giving away objects that themselves are stealing from the real creator!.........



Winter really you have pointed alot of good issues out really!!!!!!

have a wonderful day

usagi

Hehe well i guess they stole my windchime recording cause i can recognize that anywhere. I recorded that for an hour and sat there and messed with clips and clips and clips to get a smooth sound without any wierd high's and lows and yes it is "my" recording that is floating around SL I still not sure its worth making a fuss about. Maybe I dont worry about that stuff.

The only stuff I consider to be "bad" would be if i drew an original picture for SL outside the game and imported it and someone copied it and started distributing it or the guys that sell/rent the movies I dont think that is kosher either its probably their home dvd they purchased and streamed onto a server and are renting out the stream to us in SL. Just a hunch hehe.

Anyhow as I said there is so much floating around I dont think there is a place to begin. I like the stargates and the star wars and the simpsons avatars and ohh the snoopy one too. Yes they sell for lindens but that is not real dollars so where would a company begin even if they trully were concerned (but I bet they aren't hehe)

anyhow such is life if anyone is truly upset they should pursue it or notify the people who have had their stuff copied and leave it in their hands. It is a huge can of worms to open though and I think no i am sure a good 75% of the content in SL is probably a copy of something or other from a magazine or whatnot that is being sold. People sell art of cartoon characters for RL money all the time its featured on TV even they are still in business. I remember watching a guy being intereviewed and praised for his work with batman mostly I think it was (it was very nice work) ..




where to start in SL
we have volkwagon buses
harley mortorcyles
stargates
stormtroopers
avatars of everyone and everything (snoopy homer marge simpson blah blah blah brad pitt.. )
food products such as coke and heineken etc
gah the place would be empty honestly hehe

/shrug..

Laughs............

Always get a laugh out of seeing on he police report about copy write image warning or bannedment. With all the objects as you said above its nowonder the system is so so screwed up.....If your on sl hit list they get you. If not they let things pass. thats how the game works these days.

I tend to think Usagi, that they Only go after those who are prolific enough to get a Complaint generated against them. IF they removed Every object, or texture that is being used, or sold by someone other than the rightful Coptright owner, SL would become a Very bare place.

There was a Place in SL Running Movies every week streamed from Outside SL. You would think, "OK, Hollywood Movie, Definately a Copyright Infringement" But No, every one of those Movies, Some that were Big Box Office in thier day, with Big Name Actors, are Copyright Free. Thier Copyrights have all expired, and the Studios that used to Own them no longer exist, OR they have been bought out by Larger ones, and these films have Fallen through the Cracks. Anyone who finds them could, For example Package, and Market them as DVDs under thier own Trademark.
Determining what Is, and what is Not Copyrighted Isn't as Easy as some people think. There are Books a Hundred years old that Still have copyrights In Force, where some a Little over Seventy Five years old are now in Public Domain, so Age alone is Not a Constant point from which to Judge. So, Unless LL has access to a Complete Library of active, and inactive Copyrights both Domestic, and International, they are probably Only dealing with the most Blatant offenders, or the ones where the Copyright Owner has made thier displeasure Known.

Angel.

at times yes, but it all depends on who is doing then god like work at the moment.....Remember they make error they are human too.....good judgement is not always the case... Either they should get everyone or just stop doing it. Either way the abuse in copywritten objects material, textures etc is still very very real.

Oh agreed, Yes, Most certainly Copywritten Material is Imported used, traded, and sold all the time. I also agree that Enforcement the Copyright violation section of TOS "Appears to be" Sporadic, and Arbitrary (I quote this as we are NOT really Privy to the details of the Violations and Bans so we can only draw conclusions based upon Outside appearances, there may very well have been compelling Need for Each of the Punishments meted out, But We, the clients shall Never Know). But there Must be some Underlying Logic to the cases they Choose to Investigate, and Ban because Lindens themselves have made use of Copywritten Images, and Literature including One Linden liason who's name, and appearance are taken from an extremely well known, and Popular Television series from the 80's/90's.
Obviously His use of Copywritten Materials, and the same uses by Thousands of Other Avatars throughout SL (No, he's NOT getting preferential treatment because of his Linden Status), though technicly Violations of Copyright are Ignored because of the Fan appreciation angle in Social settings. The Copyright Holders don't object to these uses in RL, so there isn't any reason they should On Line Either.

On the surface It all Appears arbitrary, but when you Look closer i think there IS an Underlying Logic to LL's responses.

Angel.

^^^ Yeah, that!

Krazzora's attitude pretty much sums up the attitude of so many of the people I've seen in SL blatantly disregarding copyright, and Kim sums it up perfectly with this analogy.

Sadly, people like this will not learn, because they obviously do not care about other people or their work.

I just earlier today turned down a comission to make some avatars from the 80s Thundercats cartoon, citing copyright issues, as it woudl be an obviously trademarked item. Stupid, or honest?

nods ok i understand ya. i would still have him at least persue the ToS regardign copywrite and let LL investigate(ok we can hope) to see if this vendor is selling his work w/o his permission.

but angel said it best in her post. which boils down to its easier to make a quick buck off someone elses hard work than to create your own. unfortuantely there are many who will lay claim to stuff thats not thier's. which is sad as there are a lot of artists out here who p[rolly wont put out thier work because of the very thing that started this post.

and to answer Your question usagi: the line is blurry and it depends on the artist's in question. as was stated earlier : Vallejo and the like have a team of lawyers who can sue the pants off anyone infringing on thier art for profit, as does JK rowling...however i believe its how you present it rather than how you use it.

integrity is the word

Gesh how stupid are people getting on sl these days. thinking they can steal copywritten images. ..........

Well, as people in RL appear every week almost at Comic, and Sci-Fi conventions dressed in those, and other Copyright Character clothing, And Given those Costumes are made, and sold by Other Fans at the same conventions, and the Companies owning the Copyrights not only don't do anything against it, But also actually take an active part IN such conventions where these "Copyright infringements" take place. I don't think Creating a similar costume On Line for a Mixed Fantasy Venue like this would be a huge concern.
Technicly, Yes your refusal is Honest, But i think it's Overly so, in that it is exercised in an area where Tacit approval of the copyright holder currently exists.

Are you stupid? Of course Not, Honesty is never stupid. I just think you are being More concerned than you Need to be.
If you wish, However, to play it VERY safe, you Could simply add in the Object description a Copyright disclaimer recognizing Full rights of the Copyright Holder, and specifying that you make no claim either explicit, or Implicit to ownership of the creation. It's done ALL the time in Fan work, and it usually satisfies most copyright requirements for such things.

Angel.