Don't Ask, Don't Tell?

Hence the word ANECDOTAL. Of course it's not evidence of anything in a statistical sense. And no it wasn't an event held to denounce ageplay. It was a relaxed open chat. At the time I didn't even really know what ageplay was, and many of the other attendees didn't either!

That one word makes a *lot* of difference here.

Mari

I think the problem is that splitting it up clearly can be a bit difficult.

For example, suppose you're happily skipping around in a cute lil' girl avatar, being completely innocent and cute, and doing nothing that would get anyone in trouble. Then, a griefer rezzes an enormous prim dong and has it follow you. While you're trying to shake it off, someone sees you. Whoops! They just downloaded a computer-generated sexual image of a child. Are those sirens I hear? The fact that it was created accidentally doesn't count a jot. The viewer could argue that they weren't expecting to see it, but I believe that the general legal position is that in that case, they have to leave Second Life, because it's a site that potentially delivers illegal images. The real world law doesn't get into the details of different districts and areas of Second Life.

This might seem rather paranoid, but this paranoia is real in many parts of the world, and is unfortunately justified.

Oh dear, finally the repressed right wing strictures of real-life invade second-life. Part of the reason I visit sl so often is to, for a short while, feel free from society's ignorant and hysterical reaction to a little fertile/febrile imagination.
I'm not into ageplay myself, although I tried it once at the start of my sl life, out of curiosity - but to deny this practise for consenting avatars is to give in to the prim, proper, repressed bullies who just don't like other people having fun. (I can't believe ppl are seriously discussing the dangers of cartoons having sex - the world - first and second, has gone insane)

Uh...

This is complete, utter bullshit.

I've seen you as a sexualized child avatar (You've now removed the picture from your profile) in the Ahern Welcome area (and other public places) many times. You openly advertise yourself as a sexual age player in your profile. Your profile says you're "eye candy for the open minded." You own a business in SL that promotes and profits from sexual ageplay.

You have a right to post in defense of your pedophilic fantasies, but I object, strongly, to your accusation that I'm repressed, insane, or a bully because I object to pedophilia. Your hypocrisy is paradigmatic of this whole "debate."

Its not the end, but the beginning of the end. Where does it stop? Yes it makes you feel warm and fuzzy, but what does it accomplish? Who is protected by this rule? Do you really think there are thousands of age players using SL as a basis for indoctrinating children, or a gatherinf point for child porn?

Pplease tell me the substantive difference between consenting adults engaging in age play, and consenting adults engaged in gorean sex, furry sex or what ever. This is an appeal to inverse puririent interests-its simply Judeao christian morality porn, if you will. A rulke that serves no purpose other than to allow a group of self righteous moralists to feel better that they won.

Provide me with documentted evidence of one child behing harmed in any way as a result of age play on second life, and we might have somethign to talk about. But its simply not there. This is one of those "feel good" moves, like an axssautl weapon ban, that give a bunch of people an excuse to think a problem is solved and retrun to shoving thier heads back in the sand.

"Advertisement of Age-play is banned in SL, oh goodie I can sleep better because no more kids will be harmed anywhere." Its fallacy, and the laws are fallaciuos and so is LL's policy.

Look what happedn to Yahoo chat. Or compuserve. Adults want and need places to be adults, where people are expected to behave and act like adults. The adevertisment of age play does not force it on you. It might offend you, but do you really sit ten sims away and worry about the presence of an Age Play club?

I appreciate tha laws in other countries are now taking a harsher position on age play than do the laws of the US but frankly, I live in the US because I don't want to be subjected to another countries interpretation of what free speech is. If it comes down to brass tacks, I see free speech as a more positve contribution to SL and net neutrality than the presence of duct or australian residents, or residents where ever such laws are in place.

Actually, it doesn't make me feel warm or fuzzy. I'm a little sickened by the idea that all LL can really do is ask pedophiles to be more discrete. As for the slippery slope argument, every time someone here claims that gays are next, they reinforce the false stereotype that gays are pedophiles. Who is protected by this rule? No one, really. Do I think that there are 1000s of age players trading in child porn. No, probably not. I'm guessing it's more like hundreds right now, but with enough advertising and word of mouth, those numbers could come up.

Errm...complete utter bullshit to you!

I DO NOT "openly advertise" myself as a "sexual age player" in my profile. That is a lie.

The fact that I use my avatar in sl to confront attitudes towards what is and is not considered sexually attractive does not mean that I encourage or indulge in sexual ageplay.
I have a "sexualized child avatar"?
-beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Searching the name of your business, the one you list in your profile, I find a photograph, shot from behind, of two young female avatars, approximately 8 years old, with their underwear pulled down.


What is significant and relevant about this is that this is public information in which you are advertising sexual age play, which is currently a violation of the TOS. I'm on the fence about what is more offensive, your promotion of pedophilia, or your insistence that your presence as a sexualized minor in Second Life is some sort of socio-political challenge to our opressive modern conventions, and not purely self-interested hedonism and profiteering.

I believe that there are some taboos in place in society that are intended to protect those who are unable to protect themselves. In order for this protection to be generalised throughout society the taboo must carry a kind of shock-value. I think digital depictions of taboos such as child rape blunt the impact of the societal taboo.

It's time for everyone to evolve, now. Ready? Take a deep breath and try to lift yourself - out of the slime if that's where you presently are.

Sihma Sing:

Here is my profile:

Please DON'T ASK ME MY AGE. It's none of your business and it's not relevant. I am the proud owner of the CUTE ANIME HEAVEN picture gallery in the land of Kochoomo.
I am willing to be a friend but I will not suffer fools gladly. I am eye candy for the open minded.



You see there is no mention of ageplay, never mind any promotion of it.
Please DESIST from accusing me of promoting ageplay.

I have replaced the cartoon that upset you so much.

I don't regard my current dress (a maids outfit) to be "sexualised".

Now you might want to also remove it from the "places" search, where you are using it to promote your galleries.

In a proper world there shouldn't be any crime without victim.

I am not an ageplayer myself, however i respect who is doing it, because on my side i wouldn't like someone to dictate me what i can or cannot do based on their vision of what is "acceptable".

I propose that as the "community" we simply ignore this new "rule" .

This is total bullshit to YOU TOO as well you know it Mr Singh. I visited Blank's so called 'sexual business' and to me its nothing of the kind. Its just pictures of anime that are sold for 10 lousy lindens, certainly not pedophilia and more certainly no profit either!Sure they are girls in pretty costumes showing a little more of their underwear than perhaps you would see in daily life - perhaps thats what you object to in your dull enclosed world. I did a search on her (Blanks) profile and whatever you saw - well its not there now. So I cant speak for what was there before.

I see you are fairly new - a noobie - is that March 1st 2007 I see on your profile born date? Let me tell you Second Life is not an extension of your Real Life persona, at least very few avatars ARE I would say. The whole point is to get away from Real Life.

If YOU are so upset at cartoons or images of anime showing their underwear then you are surely in a sorry state. I'm a girl and I am not bothered in the least about little Fraenkel, shes harmless I spoke a lot with her in the Welcome Areas and dont start upsetting her or im gonna complain about YOU for a change. I guess you are responsible for scaring the wits out of her innocence what with the Second Life's recent re iteration of their ruling contravention on sexual promotion.

Dont bring your Real Life exploits into Second Life.

I guess this is the signal that Blank has removed the images in question.

It's not a case of crime.

It's civilisation, society, trying to do the right thing, not being selfish, being empathetic, looking at the whole and not just the parts.

Sometimes it's necessary for people to have self-control.

Begin sarcasim

You are a teacher in RL watching over your students in the playground when a pile of real dildos are tossed into the playground. The kids pick them up....

The police come and arrest you for seeing the children with the dildos.

They also arrest the security personnel for video taping the event.

end sarcasm
Edit: Begin/end sarcasm
---
Seems silly to me too.

Then again don't use the abbreviation for "Bill Of Materials"BOM) while sitting in an airport.
You now have to use PL (Part's List).

Simha Singh, I just visited Cute Anime Heaven and while it is certainly creepy, at least to me, I don't see anything illegal... but the anime images are all of very young girls in revealing clothing and suggestive positions, intersperced with photos of RL children. Erotic in a way that would probably only appeal to people with tendencies to paedaphilia, just plain creepy to everybody else.

So, will LL ever be shutting down places like this? Should they?

If you are a teacher in RL and you see dildos tossed to the kids, you better go and take the dildos away and get the children inside. Then phone the police and give description of the people that tossed the dildos. Security camera is there to prove you are not lying.

The people tossing the dildos get arrested, not the teacher or security personel.

Doesn't seem silly to me really.

It can't be any easier for LL to address this issue than it would be for anyone else. No one wants to create censorship or curtail freedoms for others.

Perhaps it all just comes down to respecting yourself and others, which is the basis of manners.

You have a point, that many that sit happy behind their computers and do such non sence role playing on sl...They are either totally bored or hidding something they really want to do in their minds.......Like other things that LLabs has changed over the years. I think ageplay and beastlity should be banned period......Since people can`t control their inner emotions at times.

And so it begins...ageplay first...then beastiality.

Might I ask...what makes YOUR opinion so valid? And before you rush to defend yourself as "any right thinking citizen"...might I just point out that any right thinking MUSLIM or CHRISTIAN citizen will move smoothly from ageplay, to beastiality and then to homosexuality. I'm not going to stretch the envelope and push it to each one then wiping out the other...they are civilized to at least pretend in public that that is an EXTREME view...but the hatred of homosexuality extends well into those people of both faiths who would call themselves "moderates".

And if you want to play the "homosexuality isn't illegal" card...check your facts...all Linden Labs have said is that "ageplay is illegal in SOME countries". The same applied to homosexuality.

Please note...there is one poster who repeatedly insists that making this step implies some kind of link between pedophilia and homosexuality. It doesn't. The only implication I am making here, is if you ban ONE thing because someone doesn't like it, then where do you stop?

The obvious retort will be, in this age of democracy, that it is the MAJORITY in this case who support it, but this is a dangerous road to travel. Please be aware, in this, the 200th anniversary year of the abolition of slavery, that those who initially decried the slave trade were very much in the minority. Weight of numbers does not make you right.

May I ask you COUGH COUGH a person with 6 post how you YOUR opinion so valid?

Next person with more of valid YOUR opinion inline...

That would be me, I guess.

My objection to slippery slope arguments is that they sound very scary, but that's about all. Slippery slope arguments are based upon the assumption that people aren't capable of distinguishing one thing from another. We are. Societies are making these sorts of judgments all the time. Moreover, the logical conclusion of your argument is that anything should be acceptable in order to avoid everything being banned. Please consider the implications of this argument.