Do you REALLY make money here?

Seriously. I keep records. I average $186 US a month after paying tier and buying SL stuff, etc. However, I always reinvest it. Right now, I have a boatload of land, lindens, and it just gets bigger. I can't bring myself to take out more than $50 a month, most months. You never know whent he next thing you want to buy will come out and then you won't have the Lindens, so I have a few thousand in US dollars in world, and it kills me, every time I take out $40-50.

Does the time you build, create, and spend time in front of your PC playing SL also pay off? Over the year I guess it does not.

I can make $120,000 p.a. working from 8am to 5 pm, 5 days a week without SL.

Whether we like it or not, there *are* consumers out there who won`t give your product more than a half-a-look if it`s in an awful packaging.

I always say, you can sell a crap-made product in professional box-art. But you can not as easily sell a good product in crap box-art. (Unless you have a good word of mouth reputation and people are told to go check out and buy the product, but i`m not talking about that.....)

.....When it concerns people just out shopping who know nothing about the products history and whether it is good or not, its more likely they will be drawn to the more professional looking shop.

You can hide a poorly made product in an appealing case, but you can not show off your well made product in a poorly made case.

I've made about $300 in the past 3 months or so, my current tier payments are now $29.95 (with VAT, bah!), so that's a good $210 or so, about £110.

Hardly making me rich, but it's nice to have considering I would not have it otherwise =)
Plus I have a few more things I'm working on that may eventually see the light of day, and a new store which will maybe make things easier for customers, especially since this one will be on my own land instead of rental land so it won't be moving around so bloody much!

Although the extra land will of course cut my profits down to about £20 which is maybe a round of drinks for four people here at Canary Wharf (London). But hey, if i work at it maybe!

I have the advantage though that my big seller is an adult item you don't get anywhere else. A bit annoying since it was a side-project I did for my own amusement and took about 3 days, while my non-adult stuff gets months of work and no recognition. Oh well, that's SL for you =)

Well, I not only disagree, but so would my instructors, classmates, and colleagues. In the many years in school, and in the field, I'd like to think my 'opinions' aren't (as you say) "not very credible or respectful," --these aren't just my opinions, I've spend much time studying and creating to learn all these 'opinions' of mine.

If perhaps you knew that, or actually researched Glowbox Designs, my studio, and my clients, you'd realize I'm not just some chump spitting out blanket statements...I understand we all like to pick our mentors, but pissing on someone's 'opinions' before you know anything about their history is a little irresponsible.

You say that "slick looking ads lead to worse products." --and I understand where you're coming from...but you aren't quite seeing the big picture. I mentioned Second Life as being slightly separated from the real world in these aspects--why? because it's a niche market, with 'hardcore' users...these users are more cut-and-dry. They don't have massive budgets, and those that do tend to have both high quality product AND marketing. It's sort of hard to explain...I've explained it above...and I stand by my professional opinion.

I suggest you do an experiment...please...and then come back to this topic: search the classifieds, go through systematically...take note of which ads suck and how are their products, and which ads are slick and how are there products...after you've gone through the list on several different niches...come back to me and report.



Cheers.

Lets be honest, if you are good at making a quality product... you should have mastered the art of making a box? Anyway, you can buy good quality boxes.

Ever watched a movie trailer and then paid to watch the whole thing, only being left with the feeling, the trailer held the best bits? Or that juicy meal in a picture outside a restaurant looked scrummy, after you have eaten it, you are left reaching for the Alka-Seltza?

If the ads, packaging and marketing meet the same standard of the goods inside, you won't dissapoint the buyer. That only happens if you make them believe they are getting something different. You really don't get a Rolls Royce for the price of a Mini.

So...I'm an idiot now? Classy.

It's not a generalization when you've studied for years, worked in the field, and have a pretty hefty portfolio--when does one stop being just a 'voice' and start being a respected opinion? When they are successful? When you are their friend? When they are famous?...you know, even the most talented of us have people we look up to--we look up to them not just because people tell us to, we do it because they are truly 'informed' and talented...perhaps some of you can open your eyes a little bit...

I wouldn't dare look at a scripters code and say, "wow, that looks really messy, not sure I like that, and to be honest, I don't respect your opinion because...well...just because." You have to know when to listen, and when to chime in--where does your experience lie? What can you offer? (other than rude comments).

If you guys want to ignore the fact that a professional ad will increase sales--then good for you...

And if you want to deny that the majority of high quality product will be represented with style and grace...that's up to you.

And if you want to deny that a crappy ad will most likely bring you to a lower quality product...again, it's your life...

All I wanted to do was share with you what I've been getting my hands dirty with for years...if you disagree, or disrespect my opinions...well...whatever.

Of course you make money here...providing youre the EU taxman

Opinions should be able to stand on their own without having to resort to the fallacious argument from authority. Even from self-proclaimed authorities. Your history has nothing to do with the validity of your opinions, it is instead the arguments behind those opinions upon which their validity rests. Everyone has spent much time crafting their opinions, so that fact you have done so has very little with whether or not they are worthwhile.

Kevyn,

Although your argument seems well-rooted, I feel you are living in some kind of 'opinion' only void...

Yes, we have opinions, and no one can ever argue that fact. But the day you start listening to your father over Madden for football advice, is the day you need to go back to school.

Get my point?

Would that be in your opinion ?

Actually someone who has spent time becoming an expert on a subject has probably spent more time forming opinions on that subject than some one who only recently started thinking about it. And when considering the opinions of various people it helps to know what their experience is and who agrees with them.

Kaimi,

My point exactly. Thank you.

You're dragging out your resume to convince me that I'm wrong about my own personal opinion and experience, which I clearly stated is bound to be different from yours? How many of your colleages does it take to tell me that purple is clearly better than green?

I think you need to stop taking things so personally. People everywhere, some smarter than you, and some dumber than you, are all going to have opinions that differ from yours. You just need to get used to it, and let it go, Michael.

Also, take note that there is no clear right or wrong in deciding what a good or bad ad is, and what a good or bad product is. So, actually, shame on myself for even trying to participate in an argument like this. This is the type of discussion that 19 yr olds have in their dorm rooms, screaming at each other until 4 am, because they can't let go of their immense egos.

Although most people in SL don't make money(they dream of it though=P), some do. A simple successful store generally makes a few hundred $. Many people, including myself, used to make a lot of casino's (why they were banned, I still don't know). A simply 1024 plot casino could make $100+ a day. Not bad for playing poker. (~.^)

Good point, it sounds familiar...(@.@)

I am not sure of the point - but interested in your perspective. You were "born" in January of this year - but remember Mia there have been freebies in SL long before your avatar came on the scene. Why does it "not just look good"? Under-priced stuff is probably reasonably priced for what we non-builders are getting from price gougers.
I DO spend money here - a lot of money. I buy art here for my galleries BUT I am seeing prices creep up for mediocre pieces and doodles. Standards are dropping to some extent particularly since th elast influx of population since Christmas and prices are rising - BUT you dont have to buy the items if you dont want to. When I first came to SL I made money - but not by making clothes if you get my meaning.

The argument from authority, as Kevyn explained very nicely, is pretty well established to be a fallacy. If you people want to sit around and bolster it as a valid argument tactic, be my guest. You have to live with yourselves.

But as a fellow human being, please don't tell me you really rely on other people's pedigrees, resumes, and associations to decide how to form your own opinions? And let's not forget that we are talking about Big Macs, sodas, tennis shoes, and beer here, people! No offense to you personally, Kaimi, but your posting above is a laugh riot in the context of this thread.

I'm not very old, but maybe I'm in some crazy liberal generation that impressed upon me that I would be much better off forming my own opinions, no matter how stupid, than letting someone else tell me how to think.

Michael,

Calm down, buddy. I think you just need to deal with the fact that many people are going to have different opinions than you. To leap to the conclusion that they are pissing on yours is pretty defensive and dramatic. This is particularly frustrating after I specifically said that I still respect your opinion even though I disagree with it. To ignore this demonstrates that you only want to try to pick a fight with me.

You're also severely twisting my meaning. Couching your opinions in absolute terms as if they are indesputable facts is what is disrespectful and not credible. That is a very different thing than saying your opinions themselves are not reputable. If you refuse to see the distinction, or just don't care what I'm really trying to express, then I can't help you any further.

I really think that you have no interest in any kind of discourse, but only want to get riled up and turn everything into a huge, dramatic, inappropriately emotional personal conflict.



So I need to go develop new life experiences, and keep at it until my opinion lines up with yours. Let me get right on that for you.

Several other posters and myself have already given you examples of where good ads lead to bad products, and you ignore, dismiss, or weasel around the response with a lame "that doesn't count." You go and do the research yourself. I'm going to spend my time in SL on my quest for pie and hot pixel sex.

My post was not about disappointing a buyer. It was about how consumers are drawn to professional looking packaging. lol

Glad I could give you a good laugh. Actually I do think we should all form our own opinions, after doing some research. After a year with a tiny business in SL my opinion as to how easy it is to make money is still forming and I'm very interested in what people who can be considered experts think.

And my point was, that is you sell a low quality product at a value for money cost, then portraying it for what it is, is called honest marketing, the buying public can appreciate that, otherwise there would be no BeWise (UK registered company) that sells 'seconds clothing' nothing wrong with the product except maybe a very slight and almost undiscoverable mistake, that was picked up by QC and rejected, still have a legitimet market, because they are advertised exactly as that.

Making money in SL, as the OP asked, is still possible even for the long term with a low quality product, as long as you don't try and fool your public into believing it is something it is not. The fashion industry in RL is full of rip offs from the Paris Fashion Shows, which is for the most part accepted, as long as it not portrayed as an original and has an equal value, that's scamming.

I'm sorry, but if you want to make this statement, I'd be really interested in hearing WHY you think an experts opinion is no better than the average Joe who knows little about a subject.

Designers don't go to school for years, study, practice, and get their hands dirty for nothing--we do it because it greatly benefits our understanding, skill-set, output and client-base.

Would you prefer to have your next-door neighbor build you a couch, or Herman Miller? Would you rather buy a pair of shoes from Radio Shack, or Foot Locker?

It's amazing--no matter how clearly you explain something, people just will not get it.

*shrugs*

Would this pair of shoes come built in with Wi-Fi?

God, I can't stand people that patronize. I really can't. I'm perfectly calm, thank you.