Beware

I know you can't use names on this forum, but this really needs to be pointed out. There is an extremly rich person that owns a large casino in Second Life. A few minutes ago on a $10 keno machine I hit the jackpot for $L100,00k. Before I got a chance to cash it the owner came and deleted the machine not even refunding me original money I had put in it. So naturally I asked for a Linden. To my awe I was told this griefing is completely OK by them. Just beware when playing this guyes casino games. This kind of stuff really needs to be told. This guy is cheating his way to 1000's of real dollars feeding of the fact that money is next to impossible to make in this game and a totally unregulated casino industry. Although his name can't be mentioned I'm sure most will know who it is.

I don't mean to bitch and moan on the forums, but put yourself in this situation and consider how upset you'd be.

I really doubt if this guy's making thousands of real dollars. If he were, he'd pay your win rather than have you posting about him in a web forum. Like most casinos, he probably isn't even making tier. I didn't know anyone actually gambled in those SL casinos...

Shaun trust me this guy is making money. It's the only casino I've seen people in. And back when they allowed you to see top 10 richest people he was always in top 3 or 4. He's making a shitton of real money off SL I assure you.

If I had just been ripped off for L$100K and the Lindens did nothing, I'd post and smear this person's name wherever I could, posting all chat and IM's, including my conversations with the Lindens. I wouldn't let this sort of thing go until either my account or the abuser's account was terminated. This is not griefing, this is FRAUD and is grounds for termination according to the TOS. You have every right to scream, complain, whatever if nothing is done about this, in my opinion.

One thing I don't understand...doesn't the Keno machine pay out automatically and immediately, or is it that it keeps a running tab and you have to cash out before the machine actually pays into your account?

If I put the guyes name they'd simply delete my post and noone would see. He's pretty popular. Has his own casino and games throughout the world. Several of his games being in Chaso Gaming Theory.

The keno machine keeps a running tab. It gives you credits which you can then continue to play from or cash out. When you hit a big amount it counts up on the win meter really slow. It much have taked 20 minutes to count the 100,000 credits. Then when it finally stopped he had arrived and did something to prevent the cashout button from working. Then a couple seconds later the machine went poof. He didn't bother saying a word or even refund the orininal money I had paid. When I IM'd him his response was 'nice try'. Then about 30 minutes later he IM's me again saying something about me exploiting which I was not doing or even aware there was one. Boobie Madonna was there while I was playing and whitnessed the win.

Additionally I don't think it's a good idea posting the conversation with linden as that would probably result in me being banned. We all know lindens do no wrong, well at least in their own minds. I'm extremly set back by this whole situation. I'm simply in awe that lindens allow such acts and don't so much as life an eyebrow to it. That's bad business and it will be their downfall. Oh one thing the linden said that I'll share simply because it was one of the dumbest things I've been told in the last couple weeks. He told me to sue the guy. Gawd what an awesome way to help someone being cheated in your damn game huh.

I know who you are talking about. The same person tried to force me to play his machines when I was broke (I'm on basic) so I'd have money to put into the slingo pot. He was claiming I had to pay to play and the slingo game was not set up as a pay to play. Needless to say I left that place and have never been back. Nor do I play any of his machines no matter where they are located. Actually, I just don't play any of the machines no matter who they belong to. I play tringo, build and pray my work sells and they don't do away with basic stipends or any stipends for that matter. Yes, he does have alot of Ls and he does scam people out of theirs.

Shaun...you seem to ahve a habit of defending those who are not entirely honest in their dealings. I know who is being spoken of as well. I know the games are custom scripted to only pay out verrrry arely. and I know when they do pay out unless you are one of a chonsen few..you'll enver get the pay off. If linden is going ot ahve an in wolrd economy then they need to stat some enforcement of this kind of thing. So far the only enforcement I ahve seen out of them is them protecting those griefing us out of our HONESTLY earned L's. and BTW, I highly doubt anyone wants to tell me I cannot say what I ahve seen. Protection of the haves adn fleecing of the ahve nots. You know what? Move over old timers...there's a lot more of us newer folks and without us you'd go broke.

If all you say is true, I'd recommend saving all chat, record the times of the events, documenting as much as you can and as accurately as you can. I would never let something like this go. If the Lindens refused to do anything about it, I'd tell my story to online sources, like Wired, Yahoo, etc. The Lindens have a nice list of such sources right on their front page (how convenient). I'd submit my story to each source. Seek out and enlist others who have had similar experiences and join forces. If the Lindens won't back up their TOS where fraud is concerned, it's as if they are condoning it. I'd have no qualms about doing all I could to rectify this CRIME. The LL representative has all but told you to handle this on your own and if LL gets caught up in the middle of it, it's their own fault.

BTW, how are you supposed to sue somebody when you don't even know their name, sex, age, location, etc? pffft!!!

How would you know this? If this person trusted anyone with this information, I'm sure they would tell it to someone who wouldn't easily spill their guts.

You know what? As long as 'newer folks' continue to view themselves as oppressed, exploited, and limited by the actions of others, the old-timers have nothing to fear.
None of you will ever achieve anything while you're crippled by paranoia, and are defeatist in your thinking.

Instead of suing maybe you should contact the California Gambling Control Commission regardless of where this individual lives his games are running on servers based in California. An individual running a gaming scam worth over $300USD in "chips" just might interest them. $100k/L isn't pennies and a little info on exchange rate might be enough to get them to investigate. If they investigate at the least if they find his operation illegal they could probably order his service provider(LL) to take down his business.

Fade, you completely misunderstood what he meant. He and I both have been in SL for almost a year now and we are both still struggling to get recognition, etc. The problem is alot of the "old timers" don't think newbies or people who haven't been in SL for 2 years can't build. Dmi and I both were building in AW (Active Worlds) long before SL ever breathed it's first breath. That fact doesn't seem to make any difference. We are still viewed as unskilled newbies. Which is a crock. We haven't given up. We're still here and still working our butts off. And before you ask how could I know what he meant, I know him in RL. We live in the same house.

I didn't misunderstand, I just didn't agree. My statement applies generally, it was a response to many similar sentiments expressed in these forums, not just that one.
Have a look at my join date. I'm pretty new too. In fact, a lot newer than you. I've never felt limited by that, and I'm just finishing up a project working alongside far older, more experienced builders. Not once have I felt looked down upon, or 'viewed as an unskilled newbie". They complimented me on my work, even though I was more in awe of theirs, and even rated me for build. I didn't get paid like a newbie either.
My point was simply this: If you view yourself as limited, controlled by the will of others, then you will be.
Don't give up, keep working your butts off, people will notice. And remember, sometimes it's not just the quality of your work, it's also how you market it, how you conduct yourself (and I am by no means suggesting you are necessarily deficient in these areas), and the strength of your own will.
The 'old timers' I've met seem to give credit where credits due, and I think most of them are confident enough of their own abilities to be able to acknowledge the work of another, regardless of their join date.

You can't name someone, but i'm sure you can name a "virtual company" on the forum.

I'm the owner of the Vertigo Pro Gamer casino, and i never did that and i will never do that
Additionally, my machine aren't "scripted" to cheat.
Like IRL, a casino can win money without cheating.

I know a few "very well known casino".
I know it's not mine. (is mine very well known anyway ? )
I'm pretty sure it's not "chaos theory gaming", "club extreme and casino", "SL playground", "sapphire moon", and i miss a lot of them

I have a doubt on 3 casino.

Additionally,
there is a difference between the infamous "buyer beware" and "intentional griefing".
This act should be punished.

That sucks bad. Bad Capitalist.

If he didn't have 100,000 sitting in his account, it couldn't pay out. One popular scam is to have a thinly capitalized alt set up casinos. At regular intervals one empties the alt's treasury so that if anyone does hit it big, nothing is paid out.

Thats bad capitalism.

Jon that is a very interesting idea. I will look into it. Something has to be done about these SL casinos going completly unregulated and totally ripping people off. It seems to me Linden Labs is simply to lazy to enforce any regulation on casino games. It don't seem like it'd be that much work for them to review the code of any gambling type game. But for them to do that would be like hounding those that pay huge land fees, which it's apparent they're the only players Lindens give two shits about. Perhaps some heat from a government agency would force some positive change and stop this free ride. I'm really blown away that Lindens don't realize without us 'little guys' their bit land fee paying people wouldn't be paying. I highly doubt there's many real life rich people dumping 1000's a month into a damn computer game.

The California Gambling Commission has no real interest in the regulation of virtual currency in a place that doesn't technically exist in the real world.

Although it could be argued that a casino deals itself in "virtual currency", these are legally-redeemable chips with a fixed value. the Linden Dollar has no fixed value, in fact no "real" value whatsoever; there's simply a high enough demand for it that it floats its own perceived value.

If they explicitly review and approve casinos that would take them away from "4.2 Service Provider" since i doubt ANY of the casino's are licensed by the commission explicitly regulating and approving the casino's could be a risky business for LL. If the CGCC decides SL casino's fall under their jurisdiction I would NOT want to be the regulating them. Heck I wouldn't want 7 of them in my most popular list. I haven't been gambling in them but if the casino's are cheating players out of hundred's of USD it's time for someone to regulate or shut them down. SL is too, big, casino's too common, and the stakes too high to allow scams like this to continue.

So you're saying if a large B&M casino in CA applied a variable market based value to your chips they would cease to be interesting to the CGCC? You might be right but we aren't talking dime and nickle gaming on the back porch while it might take some explaining why a casino in a game in a game currency is of interest to them I think it's worth a try. LL can't and won't provide the regulation if the casino's won't play honest out of self interest it's time to try to bring someone in who can and will regulate them.

Now you will get my side of the story:

Stacey is referring to my games. Stacey is a long-time poor sport who consistently harasses other players and although I can't do anything about them, I get lots of complaints from other players about how she calls them names while they're trying to play my games.

Stacey is upset because she was unable to take advantage of an exploit that was found last night in one of my Video Keno machines. The exploit allowed someone who hit 0 numbers on a 15 number pick to win 10,000 credits (the highest amount possible). There is no question this was a flaw in my script -- I do not and have not denied this.

Another player noticed this flaw about 15 minutes before Stacey even thought about playing this game, and notified me about it. I was unable to log in immediately as I was not at home when I received the notification. I asked him to put blocks over my games so that they couldn't be played, but by that time, Stacey had already taken a keen interest in the game and was only playing 15-number picks. He warned her that it was a flaw and that I was on my way. She kept playing.

I finally got home, immediately logged in and removed the machines. Stacey was upset because she hadn't been able to cash out her exploit winnings. I sent her L$10k for her trouble and asked her for about the 10th time (she has other alts that I will name for anyone who wishes to know in-world) never to play my games again.

I have always operated this way -- I pay people lots of money in bug finder's fees when they find bugs and report them to me. I am not in the habit of paying anyone anything if they are visibly trying to use an exploit. I guess Stacey expected me to just sit back and allow her to drain my account.

I have other witnesses during this that can attest to the fact that the winnings she claims she has a right to were gotten through the exploit and not through a posted, legitimate win. I have never even thought of not paying legitimate wins.

If anyone has any further questions for me, please feel free to ask. I'm happy to answer what I can.

Do it.

You may be able to sue him in small claims court for your $350 or so as a "John Doe".

Then you can go to Linden Labs with papers to get his identity and go after him in RL.

14/50 banned at your old casino right now. Stacey is not one of them. I don't even see anyone banned on your island which if the games are created by you is where she played. If she's such a known problem why do you allow her to harrass players in your casino?

If the California Gaming Commission comes into SL the entire place will be earmarked a Casino, and anything you do will be subject to intense regulation. You're dealing in the same "chips" as this virtual casino is. The law isn't going to specify "casino in a video game" as apart from "store in a video game".

Do you want the CGCC to regulate how mcuh, what, and where you can sell your virtual goods?