SL Monetary Policy & Upcoming Changes...Discuss!

It also helps the vocal minority

Merwan, per your request, I moved this over to the Economy forum.

What....? Damn, I need some power like that,... lol Merwan U Dawg..

Well, I have already left (as of about 5 days ago) so I don't really know how much my input counts.

But LL is trying to increase the amount of new users, it seems to me that this just makes it much harder for new users to enjoy SL.

Yes, a lot of events were pretty stupid, but they did provide stuff to do, places to go, and people to meet and some of them were a lot of fun. Now, it's going to be mostly classes? Historically classes have been a place to learn, not go and meet people and socialize. To summarize, I think that new players are going to open up events and see a bunch of classes. They will go to the classes a few times, and maybe meet a few people, but it is not going to be the same atmosphere. Then you virtually eliminate rating, and with the majority of your events in a class atmosphere, it's going to be pretty boring to start out.

Rating, while yes, it was abused, made things much more social. Most new users do not come into SL and start making clothes, or start doing animations, or start scripting. It takes time for someone to want to start doing these things.

Then you make it harder for the new player to gain money. There is a point where the new player just gives up in frustration.

1. The SL interface is already complex and requires a learning curve.
2. To do many of the things in SL that are neat and sell requires third party software (Photoshop, Paint Shop Pro, Poser, etc...)
3. You virtually eliminate rating which decreases a social aspect (albiet an abused aspect) to SL
4. You decrease the enjoyment of events (although I will agree that there were a ton and this was abused as well) by turning them into mostly classes which is a completely different social atmosphere.
5. You decrease the stipend bonus (a primary means of cash income for most new players) and eliminate the possibility of it increasing for new players because noone will rate at 25 / rate.

Your going to be left with a bunch of people who can create and want to sell their goods, and noone to buy except the few estabilished players that are already here.

Your making it HARDER to START playing SL, when it was already kinda hard. Incoming people are going to get bored because some of the social aspect of the game is gone, they are going to already be confused by the overwhelming complexity of the building interface and the learning curve of the 3rd party programs, scripting, etc...

I am basing this off my own experience, it took me a month to start building and scripting. If it had not been for a lot of the social aspects of the game (rating, going to stupid events and meeting people) I would not have continued.

Just my 2 Lindens.

Jessica

"I am simply blown away after reading this post in its entirety."
/laughs

who really cares? Who is actually in this world to collect dwell, ratings, and stipends?
I mean COME ON people get real!!!
LOL Is that why we are all really here?

I don't doubt that people get ratings without earning them, but this is a very shit poor way of resolving this issue. Sure, they ratefarm. So what? What they going to pay the builders and texturers for their wares with unless they go out and use US dollars to buy the Linden dollars they need for it? I don't have a problem with them getting build ratings when they can't build. I myself and prudent about giving out such ratings. I'll rate a person's behavior and appearance if they're nice enough on sight and hold off on the building rating until I see something they've made. But you're punishing the whole here for the actions of some and that just isn't fair.

Well, at least we will have fewer bogus contests. Now we will have more bogus "classes."

Holding an event is hard work. Why would anyone bother to do it just for the dwell money, which does not come anywhere near covering land fees?

I quit There after about an hour when I saw how it's economy worked. If we are forced to pay cash for Linden dollars, I'll be out of Second Life just as fast.

Also, I can't tell from Linden posting whether the Linden's will still cover prize money. If they don't, everything will turn into a casino, in effect.

I thought everything worked better when the Linden's supported all sorts of events, not just contests and classes.

This is exactly right, and just why we at the Second Life Herald have come out against the proposed changes. Changes are in order, just not the ones being implemented now. Read more here.

Interesting read Walker - and I am starting a new thread asking the question re: the Median Balance figure you've referred to.


LL Question -Median Balance Figure?


-=-=-=-

Interesting debate. We're agitated, amused or analytical, but we're certainly not bored! The saga of the SL economy is far more rivetting than the silly or broken economies in typical online games. SL game mechanics and TOS actually seem designed to work with the currency exchanges. TOS-legal convertability into US currency makes this economy matter to the players. It's a huge improvement over games with silly economies that break due to TOS-illegal currency trading. Games with flaky economies get boring -- after a while it's why bother?



Agreed, Artillo. SL provides us with a wonderful toolset. If I'm short of $L for something I want, I can make it for myself, learn how to make it, or trade creations with friends. Yes, I think that many people will tier down in order to cut costs, but the public sandboxes are fun; nobody needs to be burdened with a big chunk of land.

I'm looking forward to seeing how the new changes play out. : )

I too am curious to see how this all plays out, but I think it might be interesting for LL to consider one change to the stipend system...namely, to grant both Basic and Premium newbies higher initial stipends.

Both would receive the same basic stipend for the first week. The difference would be that Premium members would continue week by week at a fixed $500L for their basic stipend. The Basics would see a weekly decrease in their stipend ($50L? $100L?) until their stipend basis levelled off at $50L/week.

If a Basic converted to Premium while still on the initial stipend slope, LL could simply make up the difference between that week's stipend and $500L.

Oh, and Basics would need to log in once per week to collect, just like they do now.

This could provide Basics enough ramp time to get a little momentum going...to explore, to maybe buy a nice outfit or two and a couple of gadgets...or to locate for-pay in-game tutors in the various SL arts and trades.

It could also apply gradual incentive for them to begin augmenting their dwindling "free" money supply with income of their own, as they (hopefully) developed both producer's skills and consumer's preferences on The Grid.

On the other hand, it could also paint them as "fresh meat" targets, and encourage "industries" (translation: "scams" designed to separate them from their money as quickly as possible.

Still...I think it's desirable as the economy goes through this transformation to leave at least one income source within reach of the game's most vulnerable (and, in a very specific way, LL's most important) group of players...incoming newbies.

Just a thought.

== danny d.

If the aim is to get basics to become premium account holders then they need to make it possible to pay with UK debit cards, and paypal. Currently SL's payment options are pretty inaccessible - although I appreciate that in the US with a greater take up of credit cards, and pre-pay credit cards available this may not be a problem.

Interesting post Danny... some v. good points

*sigh* What is it with virtual worlds and screwing their own economies?

I do not build, script or otherwise create in SL. I socialize. I take pictures and I decorate houses.

Sereine Bard is one of three avatars I own.

It costs me $95.00 a month for SL (2 monthly accounts and $75.00 in land fees.)
I own a place from which I generate absolutely no revenue, SL or otherwise.
This place was created for fun and built by friends with love and friendship in mind.

I barely make it week to week on my "allowence."
I use most of my SL money to take pictures. Truly. (Oh, ok, and I buy hair And gifts and furniture.)

Rest assured, I, for one will be rethinking my land ownership, as well as keeping my SL shopping trips to a complete mimium.

Beyond that I will be revisiting There, where for, um, absolutely no monthly charge I have voice & a hoverboard.

Jeez, Alby stop frothing at the mouth. You have some insight into economics, without question ... but it is hidden amongst the raving and not many people pay attention.

You are making Republicans look retarded.

While I am not a Republican (I'm Independant), I think there are many things that the 'pubs have to say that fall on deaf ears because of people like you.

-AP

Ms. Bard, if you are so comfortable with There, where you HAVE to buy Therebucks, why do you find it so heinous a concept that in Second Life you SHOULD be buying Linden bucks?

Spends my last 2kL on a nice gun..Arms my fellow peasents and heads for the Pslulf (peasents second life united liberation front) compound in the completely empty(oddly it has no events either) sim south of Ahern..Now to be renamed New Secondlife Zion and starts mobilizing a massive campain of terror and griefing on the fat, decadent, morally defunct land barons and other seemingly rich folk..Hell..Lindens are going to take all the fun out of it for us..Well make our own fun..


Hehe.mebee I'll just stay in my cave until the lease runs out then sleep on Anshe's roof. I have bought enough of her stuff to feel some kinship..i know..why don't one of you rich peeps hire me as a personal servent? Ya..A maid..Or a slave..small price to pay to be able to hang out with yall..Earn myself a lil scratch and go spend it in one of the many squatter camps i'm sure will spring up. Plenty of already "Empty" buildings about...I'll make some digital crack..Wow. this will make those play gansters in the game seem tame! Woot! Sweet! Way to go Lindens! You have sucessfully recreated Detroit Michigan! *works on my ghetto accent*..Ye boi!

Feel free to flame alby..Or whoever..Like I can afford to give a flying rats ass what yall think.

without saying. Wow! My first post! Die Elitist decadent scum! Power to the pixels!

There's your first problem. There are approximately 123,253,623,111,586 better things you could be doing if you're hard up for money.



GOOD LORD. Let's get a few things straight right now, shall we?

1. IT COSTS MONEY TO RUN A MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER GAME. Bandwidth is expensive, development costs are expensive, support costs are expensive, and so on. Right down to the worker's comp that you have to pay programmers to support the demented tort system in this country. If people don't pay these costs with RL dollars - SL EVAPORATES.

2. LINDEN LABS IS IN THIS BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY. Before I suffocate as a result of your collective gasp, stop a second and really consider this. They just got a new round of venture capital. On the order of millions of dollars. Guess what that means? At current pricing, LL is still not making money fast enough to support their growth. That means that things will get worse before they get better. And at the end of the day, they are still expecting probably a 20-to-30 point profit. Otherwise, guess what happens? LL packs up their toys and goes home. And that doesn't just ruin the game for the (supposed) "mass of people", it ruins it for everyone.

3. YOU HAVE NO GOD-GIVEN RIGHT WHATSOEVER TO SECOND LIFE. People can whine all day long about "only people with money IRL will be able to enjoy SL", but guess what? It's that way for a reason - and I for one am extremely happy about it. Hell, only people with money IRL can afford BMWs...are you saying that everyone should be entitled to luxury items (which, I obviously need to remind you, SL definitely qualifies as)? If I couldn't *EARN* the right to more goods and services than my neighbor, then I'm going to pack up and go home. And so would everyone else that actually produces value in our world. And then you know what? The world would be up a creek - because nobody would be around to tax and mooch off of anymore!


So, would everyone whining about what this means to people with less RL money please quit whining? If you don't wish to own land (which you also have no 'right' to) - you have a full-on virtual world with endless options for socialization and creation (AND I might add, full intellectual property rights to anything you create) for a *one-time-fee of $9.95*. COMPARE THAT TO ANY OF THE $50-$60 GAMES ON THE SHELF then log on, quite thankful that for the moment those VC investors are subsidizing your cybersex and virtual skydiving. Just because you need to buy ferret food and can't afford $1.83 worth of virtual bling does not mean that your experience here has to be all that bad.

Currently, as the system stands, people are subsisting on what amounts to virtual welfare, and are much less motivated to actually create content. Perhaps with less money in their pocket, we'll start to see some new/better/more varied content in addition to being able to halt the (IMO) much-worse-than-most-people-realize inflation.

As a side note, when analyzing land sale prices for signs of inflation, one also has to take into account the tremendous supply which may be masking some of the inflationary effects.

While I do so hate to state the obvious, there is ONE HUGE fundamental difference.
I *CAN* buy Therebucks from There directly. No middle man.

Thats why There has unlimited inflation with no caps on the money in circulation.