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SL Monetary Policy & Upcoming Changes...Discuss!

Malana Spencer
Registered User
Join date: 18 Sep 2003
Posts: 368
01-11-2005 05:53
From: Moleculor Satyr
I've been asking for a reduction in the event payouts for a long time now. Events are entirely too much "tossing money at random crowds" these days. Glad to see it's happening.


I agree! However I think the key word is REDUCTION not elimination. Yes they are paying for educational events which is great, however, alot of people do enjoy contests & such. So how about a reduction in contest support VS elimination. Cut current support in 1/2 it would make a dent. $125 for hosting fee $250 prize & maybe offer event support 4-5 events a week instead of 7. I think it's something to think about especially since stipend bonuses are also going to be cut.

The other thing is doing this is likely going to result in more mentoring & instructors & their events but I think more people will be doing it with the $L in mind rather then the idea of helping out new residents. Perhaps I'm naive or too idealistic but I hate thinking that L$ should be the only motivation for someone to become a mentor or instructor.
Anshe Chung
Business Girl
Join date: 22 Mar 2004
Posts: 1,615
01-11-2005 06:45
From: Malana Spencer
I agree! However I think the key word is REDUCTION not elimination.


This might have been nice Malana. But you should also consider administrative overhead for Lindens. I am certain that this must also have played major role since following up with 40+ events every day cost time. Elimination instead of reduction definitely made one or two Lindens less busy now and we can hope that their working time can benefit Second Life in some other way.
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Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-11-2005 06:52
An upopular opinion I'm sure I'm about to give again, but back in the day I even proposed that *no* money be given to event hosters at all. The exception being Mentors and Instructors being given money to give away at events they host under the "Mentor and/or Instructor Guidelines" only. My reasoning being that you would then start to see more creative events hosted by those who really wanted to host events and not do it just for the money involved. It may also encourage some to start charging for events. I know I would certainly pay to attend certain events if I felt the quality was going to be worth it. I'm certain I cannot be totally alone in this train of thought.

I have not listed an event as Linden supported for over 8 months even if there was a contest involved, and even when I still gave out money at the event for one reason or another. I stopped when I did two different events (within two weeks of each other) that qualified but that I never did get my payment for. I sent the necessary info a few times, then just chalked it up to the Lindens being swamped and not able to get the "payback" to me. It got to be a chore and the money was not the reason I was hosting the events in the first place. So I just stopped asking for assistance. It hasn't kept me from doing events thus far, and I can't see that changing for me anytime in the future.

As for prices on goods sold, I have always sold items at a lower price than most of my "competitors". I charge what I feel my items are worth, or rather what I myself would be willing to pay for them. I am not opposed to people charging more for their items at all. I think variety in prices and quality of items is a great thing for the economy and the consumer. The more the Lindens leave us (the residents and business owners of SL) to our own methods for raising money, determining prices, etc. The more realistic our economy will be.

Those are my thoughts at least. :)
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Mario Fonzarelli
farted!!!!
Join date: 26 May 2004
Posts: 83
01-11-2005 06:55
Sounds Like A There Move To Me Booooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Only Reason Ppl Are Here Is Cause Were Here From There Were They Cut Everythign Then There Doing Less Bug Work Less Patching Less This Less That Im Putting Enough Into This Dman Game!!!!! Forget About The Stupid #%@^$%# Kid Grid And Pay Us Like U Have Been!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Mass Roit Ahern Im Me Free Tshirts And Signs!!!!!!
Hiro Pendragon
bye bye f0rums!
Join date: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,905
01-11-2005 06:56
From: Lordfly Digeridoo

SIGN DE PETITION OR I QUITZOR!!!!111oneone

Lordfly, the petition states that 2 days is not sufficient time for the community to discuss a patch that will have potentially a huge impact on the SL economy. What that impact is, positive or negative, we don't know - but that's the point I'm getting at - we need time to figure that out!

Linden Lab, when rushing patches in the past, has had major problems. They promised they would give us sufficient test time. 2 Days is not.
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David Valentino
Nicely Wicked
Join date: 1 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,941
01-11-2005 07:11
This move is entirely greed based and ill-concieved. I think it's sad. I want to enjoy SL, not deal with the same corporate greed that I deal with day to day in RL.

Sure this move will cut down the huge amount of fluff events, but it will also cut out some very fun and original ones as well. Those that already have alot of money will benefit while those that are already poor will have a harder time in-world. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Gee..what a suprise.

Personally, I'm through putting alot of work, effort and money into SL. I'm selling as much tier as I can, will no longer being doing any prize-oriented events and will spend my time building and socializing.
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David Lamoreaux

Owner - Perilous Pleasures and Extreme Erotica Gallery
Bianca Baggio
Registered User
Join date: 15 Aug 2004
Posts: 4
Growing too fast, a way to slow down
01-11-2005 07:14
Perhaps this is a quick way to slow down things in 2nd life. In talking to Philip Linden today he said they want more educational classes and that 250million L are spent in world monthly and only 1 million on events, how that impacts the Lindens themselves I have no idea. Personally I think 2nd life has grown so much, so fast in just the few short months that I have been here that they are trying to find a way to slow it down. I also beleive they are trying to discourage ppl from buying the non-monthly package. Lastly, Philip pretty much said they are trying to clean 2nd life up, which with all of the SEX stuff I can understand that, but they themselves let it get this far out of hand. I think limitiing each club to 2 or 3 events per day would have been much more reasonable then what they are doing now.
Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-11-2005 07:19
From: Bianca Baggio
Perhaps this is a quick way to slow down things in 2nd life. In talking to Philip Linden today he said they want more educational classes and that 250million L are spent in world monthly and only 1 million on events, how that impacts the Lindens themselves I have no idea. Personally I think 2nd life has grown so much, so fast in just the few short months that I have been here that they are trying to find a way to slow it down. I also beleive they are trying to discourage ppl from buying the non-monthly package. Lastly, Philip pretty much said they are trying to clean 2nd life up, which with all of the SEX stuff I can understand that, but they themselves let it get this far out of hand. I think limitiing each club to 2 or 3 events per day would have been much more reasonable then what they are doing now.




I think there are some other Morale Issues that need to be addressed..

I figured it out.. The Republican Party gave SL $8/million to revamp this world of its decadence and ungodly people. lol
Anshe Chung
Business Girl
Join date: 22 Mar 2004
Posts: 1,615
01-11-2005 07:58
From: Alby Yellowknife
The Republican Party gave SL $8/million to revamp this world of its decadence and ungodly people. lol


No offense Alby. But your favorite political party better take care of decadence and ungodly people in their own leadership.
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ANSHECHUNG.COM: Buy land - Sell land - Rent land - Sell sim - Rent store - Earn L$ - Buy L$ - Sell L$

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Ramoth Darkholme
Registered User
Join date: 2 Dec 2004
Posts: 30
01-11-2005 08:00
From: Alby Yellowknife
Go buy a new machine....


After dumping $3,000 into this machine less than a year ago? I think not. I'll cancel my account before I waste money on a new video card to play sl.
Rose Karuna
Lizard Doctor
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,772
01-11-2005 08:20
From: Olympia Rebus
Same here, Kate.
I create for fun and only have a few of my things for sale.
When I hear someone's bought something of mine, I'm flattered that someone likes it as oppossed to thinking "hahaha! Money money!"

Most of my money is spent downloading textures and aquiring land (for projects, not for profit) . I make my own avitars, clothes and builds.

As much as I'm dissapointed to get a lower stippend each week, I'm way curious to see how the economy will react and how it will affect prices. Part of the fun of SL is watching society as a whole and how it evovles and changes. This should prove interesting :)


Same here - I continue to view SL as an opportunity to artistically create interesting things and meet interesting creative people. It will be interesting to see where this all goes. Less of a stipend for me may mean that I tier down but I'll just sort of wait and see what happens.

Personally, I would have set positive ratings at half the price of neg ratings. So if you want to rate someone's build or appearance it will cost you $10 L and to rate someone negative it will cost you $25L.
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Jesrad Seraph
Nonsense
Join date: 11 Dec 2004
Posts: 1,463
01-11-2005 08:23
As a panarcho-libertarian conservative but pseudo-Keynesian whacko, I approve of the changes planned to the economy.

I have a comment, though : after the 1929 economical krach, it was not deflation that saved Western economies (on the contrary it sank it a bit more) but forced circulation of currency (budget spending).
_____________________
Either Man can enjoy universal freedom, or Man cannot. If it is possible then everyone can act freely if they don't stop anyone else from doing same. If it is not possible, then conflict will arise anyway so punch those that try to stop you. In conclusion the only strategy that wins in all cases is that of doing what you want against all adversity, as long as you respect that right in others.
Merwan Marker
Booring...
Join date: 28 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,706
01-11-2005 08:25
From: Rose Karuna


---

Personally, I would have set positive ratings at half the price of neg ratings. So if you want to rate someone's build or appearance it will cost you $10 L and to rate someone negative it will cost you $25L.



Interesting idea Rose - I like!



:cool:
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Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-11-2005 08:25
From: Jesrad Seraph
As a panarcho-libertarian conservative but pseudo-Keynesian whacko, I approve of the changes planned to the economy.

I have a comment, though : after the 1929 economical krach, it was not deflation that saved Western economies (on the contrary it sank it a bit more) but forced circulation of currency (budget spending).



Jesrad, I'm very sad to hear your a Keynesian.. Come over to the Right Side and join with the Hayek Supporters.. We know how to make a dollar.

Friedrich A. Hayek, who died on March 23, 1992, at the age of 92, was probably the most prodigious classical liberal scholar of the 20th century. Though his 1974 Nobel prize was in Economic Science, his scholarly endeavors extended well beyond economics. He published 130 articles and 25 books ranging from technical economics to theoretical psychology, from political philosophy to legal anthropology, and from the philosophy of science to the history of ideas. Hayek was no mere dabbler; he was an accomplished scholar in each of these fields of inquiry. He made major contributions to our understanding in at least three different areas-government intervention, economic calculation under socialism, and development of the social structure. It is unlikely that we will see the likes of such a wide-ranging scholar of the human sciences again.
Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-11-2005 08:30
Friedrich A. Hayek is God










Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-11-2005 08:31









Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-11-2005 08:43
Hope the leftist outthere get the message..
Jesrad Seraph
Nonsense
Join date: 11 Dec 2004
Posts: 1,463
01-11-2005 08:47
The Fifth Commandment sayeth "You are forbidden to believe everything you read" ;)

I will now procede to bring you my own propaganda, after reading yours.

From: someone

A SERMON ON ETHICS AND LOVE


* * * * One day Mal-2 asked the messenger spirit Saint Gulik to approach the Goddess and request Her presence for some desperate advice. Shortly afterwards the radio came on by itself, and an ethereal female Voice said YES?


* * * * "O! Eris! Blessed Mother of Man! Queen of Chaos! Daughter of Discord! Concubine of Confusion! O! Exquisite Lady, I beseech You to lift a heavy burden from my heart!"


* * * * WHAT BOTHERS YOU, MAL? YOU DON'T SOUND WELL.


* * * * "I am filled with fear and tormented with terrible visions of pain. Everywhere people are hurting one another, the planet is rampant with injustices, whole societies plunder groups of their own people, mothers imprison sons, children perish while brothers war. O, woe."


* * * * WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH THAT, IF IT IS WHAT YOU WANT TO DO?


* * * * "But nobody wants it! Everybody hates it."


* * * * OH. WELL, THEN STOP.


* * * * At which moment She turned herself into an aspirin commercial and left The Polyfather stranded alone with his species.
_____________________
Either Man can enjoy universal freedom, or Man cannot. If it is possible then everyone can act freely if they don't stop anyone else from doing same. If it is not possible, then conflict will arise anyway so punch those that try to stop you. In conclusion the only strategy that wins in all cases is that of doing what you want against all adversity, as long as you respect that right in others.
David Valentino
Nicely Wicked
Join date: 1 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,941
01-11-2005 08:48
From: Alby Yellowknife
Hope the leftist outthere get the message..


If the message was that you are rude, repetitive, callous and not even amusing, then we get it loud and clear.
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David Lamoreaux

Owner - Perilous Pleasures and Extreme Erotica Gallery
Siggy Romulus
DILLIGAF
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,711
01-11-2005 08:48
HAIL ERIS!

Her apple corps is strong!
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The Second Life forums are living proof as to why it's illegal for people to have sex with farm animals.

From: Jesse Linden
I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread
Siggy Romulus
DILLIGAF
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,711
01-11-2005 08:49
From: David Valentino
If the message was that you are rude, repetitive, callous and not even amusing, then we get it loud and clear.


(edited)

Yeah I got that message.

Siggy.
_____________________
The Second Life forums are living proof as to why it's illegal for people to have sex with farm animals.

From: Jesse Linden
I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread
Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
01-11-2005 08:52
From: Malana Spencer
Chip you know I love you but I have to say, I Strongly disagree with this. IMO if you're paying the same monthly fee we should all be getting the same stipend period.

IMHO get rid of ratings bonuses all together & give everyone on the same account type(newbs & old timers alike) the same stipend bonus each week. What someone has or doesn't have for L$ makes or doesn't make shouldn't affect your stipend.


It would definitely have its drawbacks. I think what bothers me the most about the reaction to these changes is the undercurrent of class warfare and the casting of successful long time players as some kind of greedy overlords. The vast majority aren't that way at all... if they were they'd never have gotten successful in the first place. That's why I suggested what I did.
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David Valentino
Nicely Wicked
Join date: 1 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,941
01-11-2005 08:58
From: Chip Midnight
It would definitely have its drawbacks. I think what bothers me the most about the reaction to these changes is the undercurrent of class warfare and the casting of successful long time players as some kind of greedy overlords. The vast majority aren't that way at all... if they were they'd never have gotten successful in the first place. That's why I suggested what I did.


Unfortunately, this latest Linden move definitely favors the rich and definitely penalizes the poor. I'm not blaming anyone but LL, but I do think this really goes a long ways toward creating a class division.
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David Lamoreaux

Owner - Perilous Pleasures and Extreme Erotica Gallery
Ananda Sandgrain
+0-
Join date: 16 May 2003
Posts: 1,951
01-11-2005 09:10
From: David Valentino
Unfortunately, this latest Linden move definitely favors the rich and definitely penalizes the poor. I'm not blaming anyone but LL, but I do think this really goes a long ways toward creating a class division.


No surprise here. Every move Linden Lab has made since 1.2 had been geared towards rewarding people for owning large amounts of land, and towards reducing their direct management responsibilities. Is this a bad thing? We'll see. Perhaps the economy will thrive now that IGE and Anshe Chung own it. :p

Every move also seems aimed towards making the virtual economy more realistic. Another fine thing, if it is your goal to tie this virtual world into the real one. Funny though, with each move that makes this follow the same patterns as the real one - reward the owners rather than the producers, reward salesmen rather than creators, flow money from the general population into the hands of a powerful few - I wonder more and more why we even bother to have a separate space at all. The real world has all this to offer already.
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Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-11-2005 09:24
From: David Valentino
If the message was that you are rude, repetitive, callous and not even amusing, then we get it loud and clear.



I'm just not politically correct. I'll just give it to you without the sugar coat.
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