New Form of Griefing

I used to play quite a few online games in my past and this thing about griefing is something people seem to enjoy doing. In Ultima Online I noticed that if people had a dispute amongst each other if they went to PVP land and duked it out the loser would always get mad, go to the persons home that killed them if they had a rune to it and throw items on their doorstep and inside their home. There is a matter of the items decaying but it takes a while for the server to kick it off. I can only see people doing that to a greater degree since the obects once placed on the ground are still in your inventory, sure it costs them money to do that but if they have alot of ways to make the money come in they won't mind throwing some objects down that noone wants and make their house or build become really laggy, almost to the point of making those people and people around them crash too. It's kind've like flooding in 3-D. In the aspect of physical comparison to urban folk, it would make someone become offended and then they would move away. Like if someone decided to turn their backyard into a junkyard overnight and they lived in a ritzy neighborhood, it would lower their property value and destroy their relationship with their closest friends cause people take that kinda stuff for granted. But generally it just shows the people who have class from the people living in trailer parks

Gang this is getting boring. I am smart enough to figure out that most of the post or not about my lighthouse. There were however 2 that directly named my place. I have sense cleard the air with those folks and you are fanning a flame.So, Rivn thanks for the help, but before you advise me could you please read all post. If there is anything that makes me truly angry is someone who walks into a convo half way through and comments before he or she is up to speed.

ummm , I have read them all , and as a matter of FACT I started the thread !
Was just letting you know that I wasnt refering to your lighthouse

Your scenario doesn’t quite fit the situation. If you don’t mind, let me slightly rewrite your setting;

Your sitting in a bar with your friends drinking a beer.
In walks a minor and sits down with your group.
You buy everyone in your group a round of beer….
In walks a police officer……
Who is going to jail ?????????

This is a little closer to what was actually happening with a minor roaming freely around mature sims. Notice is said “was”, everyone I am associated with has totally stopped “buying rounds of beer”. As it sit’s now, other than death, the Outlands are a PG sim.



-TK

Ummm NO Tracey!!!
I am not gonna buy that change simply because The minor or minors in question here DO NOT need to be right beside you , hell you dont even have to be on the game for them to view something you put inworld!!!! so this changed senario dont work here sorry to say

It is NOT our responcibility to protect someone elses child that SHOULDNT be there in the first place!
The rules clearly state 18 years old to be in the beta test!
Linden Labs has broken thier own rules by admitting a minor!
They made those rules they broke those rules how is ANYONE other than them to blame for ANYTHING that transpires thereafter! they know this person is UNDERAGE and KNOWINGLY admit him and ALLOW him to travel uninhibited throught the world without consequence , we the testers have NO control over who is ingame , we were givin an area to "do as we please" within the rules of gameplay...We can NOT be held accountable for accidental exposure of a minor to conversations intended for adults, we can NOT be held accountable for exposure to Illicite materials by a Minor in a game INTENDED for adults and is within the application that you MUST be over 18 to apply and clearly is marked that said SIM is for Mature audiences...

We can be held accountable however for Knowingly handing Mature Textures , Items ect to a known underage player, or haveing Adult convertaions with sexual implications with that said Minor... The thing is we all KNOW Jack is a Minor and anyone doing these things with him needs to be Jailed! the problem is How many " Jacks" are in this game, 1 minor ? 50 minors?

Hypotheticly Shebang could be 13 for all we know( I am useing Shebang for an example BECAUSE.......she is inteligent enough to realize its only an example and wont go pissing and moaning over it........)
but anyone here could be 12 -17 and who would be any of the wiser especially if they dont talk much and dont post on boards , it would be dificult to pin anyone down that has only the most basic of conversations like hi how are you today .... wow i like that new (insert item here) you made looks cool....
yadda yadda yadda

THANK YOU RIVN......you have made the point we have been trying to get across since this whole mess started. The minor doesn't even need to be in the same bar. If we buy a round and he ends up with a beer, we are still responsible!


-TK

oops

I still must repectfully disagree....
I have been to bars that the owner has bought a round for everyone and inst even present (they just tell the bartender at midnight get everyone a drink on me or whatever)

He as a Owner of the establishment is reponcible for anyone who gets served by his employees and the employee is also responcible by law for the people he serves and is his Duty to make sure that he serves noone underage .... The owner would recieve a fine for a minor being served in his bar , the employee would recieve a fine for serving a minor BUT the owner would NOT recieve a fine for BUYING a drink for the minor BECAUSE he didnt tell them to serve UNDERAGE people just legal patrons of the establishment (that is a givin) you can NOT control what you have no control over that is why you are not allowed in a Bar in this state unless of legal age or accompanied by a Parent ....BUT
we are NOT employees of Linden Labs and we are not responcible for the admission into an adult game by minors henceforth we are NOT accountable for anything that happens once they are ingame unless we KNOWINGLY contribute to the delinquancy of the said Minor...

I will agree with your post in the other related thread however , (nothing personal Jack and other possible Minors here without SL and community knowledge) this isnt YET a place intended for Minors, until it is prepaired for Minors being here with every and all precations in place (nothing will be fool proof ) but every reasonable attemp is made to keep them from areas not intended for there Young impressionable minds they shouldnt be here....

my 2 coppers worth

As someone who has personally made a phallic snow sculpture in the (distant) past this particular mode of griefing/artistic-expression in SL occured to me a long time ago and I wondered when it would first show up.

As for addressing such behavior in SL, part of our plan was to allow users in the world to rate others through their content. That is, whenever you make something in the world you are exposing your reputation to your peers. When you offend people with your content then you may get negative ratings which will restrict your ability to make content in the future and would raise your visibility should a Linden look to see who has the lowest rating.

At the moment, negative ratings in the world are considered to be VERY SERIOUS, such that very few people will rate others negatively, and users are very offended when they get a negative rating. However, you may have noticed that the current rating system has changed: you can now rate someone in three different categories: overall behavior, skill at appearance, and skill at building.

Do you think the offensive content shouldn't be deleted before others have an opportunity to reflect their opinion upon the owner and creator?

Should objects that generate a certain amount of negative ratings be automatically deleted?

When a Linden is forced to automatically delete offensive objects should such a delete automatically contribute some negative amount to the owner's and/or creator's ratings?

Should users be able to flag objects as "inspiring/offensive", "beautiful/ugly", or "impressive/mundane", allowing Lindens to respond by immortalizing/obliterating content?

What do you think?

I would like it if building votes were only possible through an object the person created (not just one they own), and apparence ratings were only possible from their avatar (not a calling card or object they own). I think it would add more meaning to the different ratings. I'm not really complaining but I did recieve several, and gave out a couple, overall ratings (pos to all three) in the short time I was online yesterday. And some (again thanks ) even added overall positive ratings for me just through my calling card shortly after I logged in.
It just sort of dilutes the effect of splitting them up I think.

Here is an idea for a new form of voting booth. This one would allow the voter to choose a category for the place only once, ever. They could change their vote but not cast multiple ones. Categories would be stuff like you mentioned: "Entertaining", "Inspiring", "Offensive" etc. Then Have a Leader board of the top ranked for each category, that double clicking on one of the entries would give you a landmark to there, or just offer to teleport you there.

Currently specific buildings don't have ratings do they? It's the people, so how would you delete objects with low ratings? And how do you determine an "object"? What if the offensive structure is 50 different, unlinked, pieces?

I think this depends on what it is & where its located. If it is on a PG sim and an artistic rendition of body part(s) then I think Lindens should reserve the right to delete on sight.



I think there should be some penalty for them creating extra work for you. If it is monetary. call it enforecement tax,



I like the idea of being able to add a comment to a building. If there are set options they need to be chosen carefully.

I had previousl;y suggested the permanate biulding senerio , dont think it went over to well though but it was my idea then so maybe it will have better opinions now that someone else has suggested it lol

Please, please, PLEASE get off the paranoid eveyone is out to get me ride.

A post that would have gotten a better response could have been something like:

Hey, yeah I suggested that permanant building thing earlier. We discussed it at <insert link here>.

Maybe everyone just has you on ignore.

Xavier

I bet you don't go to football games either......

Well, for once, I agree with Rivn.

Ya know I try real hard to present views when I post, not attacks. And if anyone on *any* of the topics I have posted to feel that I have attacked them, all I can do is offer my deepest apologies. It was not ment to be singularly directed at you personally. Rather, it was an attempt from me to express my own viewpoint in the most dispassionate way that I can, with wording that may sometimes be taken out of context.

Now that said..

I wish everyone could strive to keep these forums to such a level - if for no other reason than what we are really here to talk about is the game in general and problems with the game in specific. In a tester role, there should be no reason to get personal over problems that arise. If something is offensive, dont strike out at it because personally it's offensive, but rather look at what is offensive about it (the whole maturity prob as an example), and discuss solutions. If someone has been a griefer, dont carry on about what an a**h**e that person has been - discuss ways that such griefing can be corrected.

In essence, be professional in your dedication to finding flaws with the system and post remarks or problems to the forums or the Lindens in a similarly professional manner.

That this thread has become nothing but an area of attack means two things

1) it's usefullness for debating a topic has completely come to an end.
and
2) That tensions are running high. In that sort of environment getting anything positive done is all but impossible.

I would ask that before this gets further out of hand, we all take a few hours to sit back, collect ourselves, and resolve to return to our discussions in a more professional and dignified manner.

Thank you for listening

All of you shut up before I assault you with my Penis of Griefing! (hope you don't think I am serious)