Hooray for BLOGS! SL Blogger!
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Prokofy Neva
Virtualtor
Join date: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 3,698
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06-12-2005 07:10
From: someone Quote:
Originally Posted by Prokofy Neva
Will he be using the Linden-based TOS as a guideline for these blogs or just let anything go?
Anything goes, just as long as it's not spam, or anything which is likely to get me sued for hosting it.
__________________ No, I didn't miss it, but he's evading the issue. He doesn't say "I will abide by the TOS" or "I will not abide by the TOS". He says "anything goes" -- that sounds sorta kinda like "I will not abide by the TOS". He also says "as long as it's not spam or anything which is likely to get me sued" Well..let's parse that a little more, shall we? Adam will not abide by the Linden TOS. In that, he'll be no different than dozens of other websites loosely tied to this game. He'll allow the publication of chat histories and IMs which are disallowed on the forums here, he'll allow the revelation of RL information someone might garner, and most other things. This would be fine in the world of values of the free press, where people can mount rebuttals, etc. on the same venue where the libel originally occurred. But in Adam's Blog-o-verse, he can't compel any blogger to run a rebuttal of libel, he won't be using his own centralizing services to rebut libel, he'll just be allowing "anything to go". Still, even Adam is giving pause at the notion of "suing". But...what kind of suing? by whom? Against what? His own Internet Service Provider? Where will someone go if they have complaints about how Adam is running his Blog-o-Verse?
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Rent stalls and walls for $25-$50/week 25-50 prims from Ravenglass Rentals, the mall alternative.
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Adam Zaius
Deus
Join date: 9 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,483
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06-12-2005 07:16
I'm not evading the issue. So, I'll put this in bold text so you avoid skipping past it:
I am not going to moderate the content, this places me in a position which I would rather not be in. There are several reasons for this:
1. This places my own bias over the content placed on the site. I am going to avoid the issue of 'why did adam moderate this, but not this' by not moderating at all.
2. This removes my protection under the DMCA for hosting content. If I moderate the content then I am liable in the event that something gets let through.
3. This would require a significant amount of time to moderate if it ever grows large. I simply do not have the time to put into moderating all the content on the site.
If a linden chooses to ask me to apply the Community Standards or TOS onto a particular post, I will comply, however - I myself do not wish to be placed into a position where I am selectively moderating the content.
-Adam
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splat1 Edison
Registerd Nut
Join date: 6 Sep 2004
Posts: 353
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06-12-2005 07:17
/me points to adams post above
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Splat Soft - We exsist in the RL to!
Gigas Bunny (Mule)
####
You see, our experts describe you as an appallingly dull fellow, unimaginative, timid, lacking in initiative, spineless, easily dominated, no sense of humour, tedious company and irrepressibly drab and awful. And whereas in most professions these would be considerable drawbacks, in chartered accountancy they are a positive boon.
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FlipperPA Peregrine
Magically Delicious!
Join date: 14 Nov 2003
Posts: 3,703
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06-12-2005 08:16
Just a tip Adam, which you've probably covered, since like the Simpsons... you've already done everything!  For sims like, let's say, Club Elite... the link uses an underscore. secondlife://Club_Elite/128/128/ Just a heads up. -Flip
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Peregrine Salon: www.PeregrineSalon.com - my consulting company
Second Blogger: www.SecondBlogger.com - free, fully integrated Second Life blogging for all avatars!
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Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
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06-12-2005 08:18
From: FlipperPA Peregrine Just a tip Adam, which you've probably covered, since like the Simpsons... you've already done everything! For sims like, let's say, Club Elite... the link uses an underscore. secondlife://Club_Elite/128/128/ Just a heads up. -Flip Oh sure you give him that tip but make me figure it out on my own 
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Cristiano ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less. ~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more. 
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Baba Yamamoto
baba@slinked.net
Join date: 26 May 2003
Posts: 1,024
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06-12-2005 08:19
People seem to LIKE Adam.. You on the other hand..........
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splat1 Edison
Registerd Nut
Join date: 6 Sep 2004
Posts: 353
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06-12-2005 08:25
/me takes a spade to baba
_____________________
Splat Soft - We exsist in the RL to!
Gigas Bunny (Mule)
####
You see, our experts describe you as an appallingly dull fellow, unimaginative, timid, lacking in initiative, spineless, easily dominated, no sense of humour, tedious company and irrepressibly drab and awful. And whereas in most professions these would be considerable drawbacks, in chartered accountancy they are a positive boon.
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Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
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06-12-2005 08:25
From: Baba Yamamoto People seem to LIKE Adam.. You on the other hand.......... Yeah, I am just so hated. U PWNED ME. Good job Baba! 
_____________________
Cristiano ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less. ~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.
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Baba Yamamoto
baba@slinked.net
Join date: 26 May 2003
Posts: 1,024
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06-12-2005 08:26
From: splat1 Edison /me takes a spade to baba Would that be an Oz spade?
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Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
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06-12-2005 08:31
From: Baba Yamamoto Would that be an Oz spade? No, it's an Aces Spade, and you don't want to mess with her. She's crazay!
_____________________
Cristiano ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less. ~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.
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Prokofy Neva
Virtualtor
Join date: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 3,698
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06-12-2005 09:44
From: someone No, I didnt evade any of your questions. The system doesnt require any control on my part - the frontpage is generated automatically from new content added. If someone wants to slander/libel another SL resident in a purely SL enviroment that doesnt have any legal implications for the host, then no, I'm not going to deal with it.
I will not be enforcing the linden TOS over content people choose to submit unless I am requested to by a linden themselves. If you write something and upload it, I am not going to touch it. End of story.
The front page is automatically generated, I dont do any editing, however I may remove a piece of content from the frontpage if it is overly offensive, but this is at my discretion, and a power I dont plan on using in anything but the most dire of circumstances.
The site is being operated non-profit, there is a 'Sponsored by SecondServer.net' link at the top, and a SecondLife join/refferal, however unless the service costs significant RL$ to operate, then I will not be placing any advertising over the content. (Operating costs have yet to be guaged, if they turn out to be high, then I plan on placing google text advertisements at the bottom of the navigation bar)
__________________ *clips and saves* So once again the Lindens are enabling a partnership with a third-party entity that violates their own TOS, and therefore renders their TOS meaningless.
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Rent stalls and walls for $25-$50/week 25-50 prims from Ravenglass Rentals, the mall alternative.
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splat1 Edison
Registerd Nut
Join date: 6 Sep 2004
Posts: 353
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06-12-2005 09:52
Im sorry but I think even you can see the true meaning of that clip.....
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Splat Soft - We exsist in the RL to!
Gigas Bunny (Mule)
####
You see, our experts describe you as an appallingly dull fellow, unimaginative, timid, lacking in initiative, spineless, easily dominated, no sense of humour, tedious company and irrepressibly drab and awful. And whereas in most professions these would be considerable drawbacks, in chartered accountancy they are a positive boon.
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Adam Zaius
Deus
Join date: 9 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,483
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06-12-2005 09:52
From: Prokofy Neva *clips and saves*
So once again the Lindens are enabling a partnership with a third-party entity that violates their own TOS, and therefore renders their TOS meaningless. I dont see where it violates the TOS... care to point out the section that does? My non-enforcement (which I clearly stated the reasons for, and you clearly failed to reply to) is not the same as violating the TOS. You may want to correct your post. |
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Baba Yamamoto
baba@slinked.net
Join date: 26 May 2003
Posts: 1,024
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06-12-2005 09:55
Stop cluttering my SLBlogger lovefest thread with this crap...
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Prokofy Neva
Virtualtor
Join date: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 3,698
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06-12-2005 09:59
From: someone I dont see where it violates the TOS... care to point out the section that does? My non-enforcement (which I clearly stated the reasons for, and you clearly failed to reply to) is not the same as violating the TOS. You may want to correct your post.
__________________ Um, excuse me? I "may want to correct my post?" Is that a threat? Like..you're going to sic your RL lawyer on me? Please. Is this how you plan to "moderate" you blog? You never sign up for the TOS. Therefore you can't violate it -- you can't be in violation of law you don't recognize. But my point is that once you form a partnership with Linden Labs and have access to their subscription base to sell your services and gain access to their world through communication links, i.e. having the SL blogoverse, you open up the question about the enforcement of their TOS. This is a legitimate question. At which county line does the TOS of the Lindens tap out and cease to prevail in a partnership with a third-party? Right at the point of entery to the third-party's server? What are the ramifications of this? An action in SL that is a violation of the TOS is readily transportable across "county lines" into a merged, but "separate" world where you can violate the TOS by saying "The TOS does not apply here." My point is non-enforcement is the same as violation in this merged world situation with blurred lines.
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Rent stalls and walls for $25-$50/week 25-50 prims from Ravenglass Rentals, the mall alternative.
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Prokofy Neva
Virtualtor
Join date: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 3,698
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06-12-2005 10:00
From: Baba Yamamoto Stop cluttering my SLBlogger lovefest thread with this crap... Ohhhh ok I'll shut up then.
_____________________
Rent stalls and walls for $25-$50/week 25-50 prims from Ravenglass Rentals, the mall alternative.
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Baba Yamamoto
baba@slinked.net
Join date: 26 May 2003
Posts: 1,024
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06-12-2005 10:01
That's not neccesary ;0 I just wanted to say SLBlogger lovefest.. It rolls of the tongue!
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splat1 Edison
Registerd Nut
Join date: 6 Sep 2004
Posts: 353
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06-12-2005 10:04
/me slaps baba
Shh we want that!
_____________________
Splat Soft - We exsist in the RL to!
Gigas Bunny (Mule)
####
You see, our experts describe you as an appallingly dull fellow, unimaginative, timid, lacking in initiative, spineless, easily dominated, no sense of humour, tedious company and irrepressibly drab and awful. And whereas in most professions these would be considerable drawbacks, in chartered accountancy they are a positive boon.
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Adam Zaius
Deus
Join date: 9 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,483
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06-12-2005 10:06
From: Prokofy Neva Um, excuse me? I "may want to correct my post?" Is that a threat? Like..you're going to sic your RL lawyer on me? Please. Is this how you plan to "moderate" you blog?
You never sign up for the TOS. Therefore you can't violate it -- you can't be in violation of law you don't recognize.
But my point is that once you form a partnership with Linden Labs and have access to their subscription base to sell your services and gain access to their world through communication links, i.e. having the SL blogoverse, you open up the question about the enforcement of their TOS. This is a legitimate question.
At which county line does the TOS of the Lindens tap out and cease to prevail in a partnership with a third-party? Right at the point of entery to the third-party's server? What are the ramifications of this?
An action in SL that is a violation of the TOS is readily transportable across "county lines" into a merged, but "separate" world where you can violate the TOS by saying "The TOS does not apply here."
My point is non-enforcement is the same as violation in this merged world situation with blurred lines. The boundary of the TOS stops at LL themselves. The moment we are dealing with anything that isnt owned by Linden Labs, the TOS no longer applies. The TOS is short for TERMS OF SERVICE, it's for the Second Life service. There's no blur here - legally the line is very black and white. If the service comes from Linden Labs, then the TOS applies, otherwise it doesnt. What you want is a community standards which applies to SL and it's fansites, and that's something I'm not going to do. I already stated my reasons, and yet again you didnt respond to them., I'm leaving this site in the care of the people who contribute to it, I am not going to censor them, as much as you would like it so. |
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Baba Yamamoto
baba@slinked.net
Join date: 26 May 2003
Posts: 1,024
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06-12-2005 10:09
From: splat1 Edison /me slaps baba
Shh we want that! I'll tell you what I want, what I really really want.....
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splat1 Edison
Registerd Nut
Join date: 6 Sep 2004
Posts: 353
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06-12-2005 10:10
The spice girls locked away for a very long time...
_____________________
Splat Soft - We exsist in the RL to!
Gigas Bunny (Mule)
####
You see, our experts describe you as an appallingly dull fellow, unimaginative, timid, lacking in initiative, spineless, easily dominated, no sense of humour, tedious company and irrepressibly drab and awful. And whereas in most professions these would be considerable drawbacks, in chartered accountancy they are a positive boon.
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Prokofy Neva
Virtualtor
Join date: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 3,698
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06-12-2005 10:35
From: someone The boundary of the TOS stops at LL themselves. The moment we are dealing with anything that isnt owned by Linden Labs, the TOS no longer applies. The TOS is short for TERMS OF SERVICE, it's for the Second Life service. There's no blur here - legally the line is very black and white. If the service comes from Linden Labs, then the TOS applies, otherwise it doesnt.
What you want is a community standards which applies to SL and it's fansites, and that's something I'm not going to do. I already stated my reasons, and yet again you didnt respond to them., I'm leaving this site in the care of the people who contribute to it, I am not going to censor them, as much as you would like it so. I disagree. The TOS boundary is blurred when you are able to run your third-party service precisely in reference to SL. Your blogging service would drown in a sea of such services if you were trying to reach the blogging public at large. It's precisely because you have access to SL's audience that you can even *have* a business. Your business depends on interaction with LL. So LL should define what it means to enable you to have features that de facto violate the TOS even if they de jure do not violate the TOS. Actually, you've got me wrong. I'm not for censorship. I'm not for them having this ROC notion that you can't start threads on individuals or groups or do what they characterize as "troll". I'm for eliminating those restrictions if we are to have a free world in which enterprise is possible. Put such expression in a "rants" section if you must, but allow it. I'm for allowing it, because the Lindens' partnership and enabling of third-party sites which take photos, blogs, and therefore notecarded inworld private chat and photos taken without permission, renders their TOS meaningless. The Internet has defeated their restrictions and their wary censorship. Long Live the Internet. I'm for them realizing the consequences of this, and stop clinging to the fig leaf of TOS they have on this site, and selectively prosecuting those who violate what is a fig leaf. If they don't want to do that, then they need to step up to the plate and ask at least voluntary TOS compliance of their partners.
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Rent stalls and walls for $25-$50/week 25-50 prims from Ravenglass Rentals, the mall alternative.
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Baba Yamamoto
baba@slinked.net
Join date: 26 May 2003
Posts: 1,024
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06-12-2005 10:41
If I started a community for people who like blue shoes, would the blue shoe makers have athority over me and the content of my site? What if I went to the Blue shoe store ( to get mroe blue shoes) and mentioned to all my blue shoe friends that I had a new website.. Would I then be held responsible to the blue shoe makers for the content of my website? If you're answer is yes.. Please shoot me now because my life is over! I can't live without blue shoe freedom!!! From: Prokofy Neva If they don't want to do that, then they need to step up to the plate and ask at least voluntary TOS compliance of their partners. When did SLBlogger partner with Linden Labs? Did I miss the memo? I've been a member since the beginning.. It must be oh gosh! Several hours now..
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Torley Linden
Enlightenment!
Join date: 15 Sep 2004
Posts: 16,530
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06-12-2005 11:49
In more breakingly wonderful news, Adam Zaius's and Cristiano Midnight's brainchildren have mated to give birth to braingrandchildren -- or er, SOMETHING!
You can now embed Snapzilla photos on your SLBLOGGER.COM page, it's a quick-'n'-easy way to highlight your caps as part of a fuller entry while retaining the flexibility and commentary that Snapz (thanks Brace, LOL) offers.
To do it, just use the tag [snapzilla:id_of_picture] in an entry. For example, [snapzilla:13520] -- you can get the pictureid numbah easily by hovering over a thumbnail in Snapzilla or copying the shortcut to it.
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Baba Yamamoto
baba@slinked.net
Join date: 26 May 2003
Posts: 1,024
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06-12-2005 11:59
That's great ;0 When do we get that for the SL forums? 
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