Shadow people, Annunaki, Reptilians, Insectoids, Grays...

John titor is REAL

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A few years ago there was a short story in Asimov's SF about an alien AI probe in orbit that opened communications with humanity by setting up a site on the world wide web. Nobody paid attention, so it joined a MMOG and played so well that everybody paid attention, even the Department of Defense....

Story was called "Cockroaches", I think.

Thanks for listing their names, I'll do some reading about them.

Side note: Putting "documentary" in quotations because it isn't balanced or isn't thorough is not ironic or clever. It is a predominantly western misconception that film can be a "scientific and impartial eye" or that it can somehow prove something as true. The French shot that theory down before I was even born. All presentations of information are just that, presentations, and the work of an author. Documentary is a mode of filmic expression operating on all the principles (and fallacies) that govern rhetoric. Ethos, pathos, and logos are used to sway an audience-- not prove anything.

Now, if you were actually putting ironic quotations around "documentary" because it was trying to prove something and operate without an agenda, then you'd be clever.

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Now, back to playing devil's advocate:
The second link with those guys' names points out how some crop circles are still unexplainable (this doesn't mean aliens made them, just that they can't be explained easily).

I keep finding two different sets of dates in all this b.s.

Many of the articles cite 1970's as the starting point of crop circles in England, which coincides with the two hoaxers that Chip mentioned.

But some of the other articles say it's the 16 or 17th century, but then fail to cite sources. Too sleepy... maybe some other bored soul can find sources for these dates if they exist.

x_x

Anyone here ever assaulted by shadow people?

Well, that's all gonna change next week.


Go Danica!

First of all I'm not sure why you're being so defensive about a neutral topic unless it's something you really want to be true. Your tone of replies throughout this thread leads me to believe that you're not objective about this subject at all... and neither is the "documentary" you mentioned which is why I put it in quotes. I am familiar with the meaning of the word and that you're not using it incorrectly. I just find the notion of a documentary about something so fantastical that doesn't even bother to mention the likelihood that they're all hoaxes to be... er... hilarious. Sorry.



I have no trouble believing that one was done by humans. It's layout is really very simple. All the circles are based around common centers with progressively smaller diameters. It would be easy to survey with nothing more than sticks and string. They'd just have needed a lot of people. Difficult to accomplish in one night in no way equates to impossible. I ask you a simple question... which is more likely? That it was made by space aliens or people?

There is a woodblock from the middle ages with a rather clear picture of a "devils circle" (and a devil making it), the circle looks a whole lot like a crop circle. Fairly exact in fact.

The presence of one image like that does not mean much though. The next occurance is actaully late 60's and then nothing until the 70's when it really gets going.

The thing I find interesting is that right from the beginning, there was the argument that the stalks were bent over "unnaturally" (at the node) in an imposible fashion, and that this could *not* be done with the boards. Yet in the 5 or six books I have read on it, this one point, (which is easily testable), is not tested.

A clear prediction of the ETH theory of crop circles that no-one seems to be willing to test.

Since 1980 at least, if every time a circle was made someone took a sample and sent it to a lab, the whole thing could be decided one way or the other.

How curious that no one ever does this.

The point is not that people attempt to explain UFO sightings by recourse to religion but that people *believe* in UFO's and aliens in a way that is very siilar to religious belief. Thus when one of the many things that engender a UFO report are seen, they tend to interpret what they saw as "aliens" because they have the pre-existing (religous) belief that aliens exist.

The only way to determine reality in those cases is by strict adherence to the principles of critical thinking and by researching the facts.

If it makes you feel any better, most of the sceptics are similarly challlenged, having the strong pre-exisiting (religous?) belief that aliens *dont* exist. This is how such illogical bafflegab as some of the chief sceptics put out comes to be. Most people are so happy to have an explanation for UFO's they fail to notice that the sceptics very rarely achieves this. Their theories are harldy ever more likely than those of the UFO believers.

For instance some of the sceptical explaations for UFO's that you have quoted and seem ready to concede like EMF's from the molten core, and experiments with brains and radiation are absolute nonsense. Persinger has been completely discounted, and Philip Klass's ideas of ball lighting are seriously flawed and based on thirty year old gueswork, also similarly disproven. What is important is doing the research and making your own decisions, not just believing everythign you read.

In my opinion the only "very likely to be real" UFO/Alien sighting that I have seen, is the Kelly-Hopkinsville sighting (1953?) There maybe others of course, but i have never heard any serious argument that brings anything about that sighting into question.

It does not prove anything, but it is the most "realistic" that I have ever heard of.

Exactly. Well said Dianne. For the record, I'm someone who very much wants to be convinced, but I have yet to see anything that is actually convincing. Even what I've seen with my own eyes. I just know I don't know what it was. I do think it's highly unlikely that we're alone in the universe, but the distances are so vast that it's unlikely we've been visited. We don't at this point even know if FTL travel is possible. It hasn't even been shown theoretically.

I run with sharp objects.



And you are objective?

You're illustrating my point with the latter half of the above quote. Documentaries are not objective, they are subjective. It's not ironic to put it in quotes for not being objective. -But it is ironic that you are explaining exactly what I'm pointing out in order to refute what I'm pointing out.



Familiarity doesn't equal understanding. .



Did I argue that it was made by space aliens?

I haven't looked into the validity of those theories, my intent in mentioning them is to point out that there are always options in this complex universe that we might not be considering. It's hard to know anything for sure, only up to a point.

What happened in your UFO sighting? *EDIT: Oh, I think you meant "seen" as in read about. But if not, please tell the story.*

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Proof of alien life.

Yep, and one of those possibilities is that it's all bunk... something many people discard because it's contrary to what they want to be true... which is what my comment about rational people becoming blathering idiots was all about. Franky, at this point I have no clue what it is you're actually arguing.

I never claimed to be arguing about whether or not aliens exist. I started this thread in the hopes that people might tell some weird stories, describe what their perception of weird events were, or talk about crazy theories. Those things are fun. I didn't start it to actually argue a side as if I could definitively prove the existence or non-existence of space aliens on the internet. The one thing I was actually ready to argue when it got brought up is whether or not documentaries can prove anything (proof is the realm of science, not media-- and media, like this thread, are for rhetoric or entertainment).

If I come off as hostile beyond that, it's because I have a nasty superiority complex.

And don't call me Franky, Buster.

Yes I did not mean I had a "sighting" per se.

For the record I have seen and heard many amazing and mysterious things, not the least of which was a rather large meteor streaking to earth less than a half a mile away from me. (an event almost as rare as a good UFO sighting.) I have seen lights in the sky which *could* have been FTL spacehips manouevering in space, and once even heard a real ghost moving around a house with my own ears.

The trouble is that all these things (except perhaps the meteor), could just have easily been something else as well. The perception of them as anomalous events depends on what you believe, both at the time you percived them, and now.

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/ufovideo/

This is pretty scary. How the heck is this guy doing this?

Either way, he says this week there will be a lot more showing up, and he's going to make one fly down low enough for all of Las Vegas to see.

hehe, fair enough. Sorry to be a spoilsport. I'll tell you the weirdest thing I've seen. One night back in the mid 80's I saw what looked like a bright star or planet come up from behind the tree line on the south horizon. It was moving about the speed airplanes appear to move, but it made no sound. It was too fast and stayed visible too long to be a satellite (and it was too bright). I watched it move from the horizon until it was pretty much straight overhead, at which point is divided into three lights all the same size. The center one continued north and the other two went due east and due west, all three at the same speed until they all vanished over the horizon. When it divided it was instantaneous with no discernable change in speed at all. It was pretty freaky, and I can't think of anything that can explain what it was. It's been so long now since I saw it I can't be certain that it wasn't a dream since I was alone at the time.

Yep.

In the late 80's I moved in to a "haunted" apartment. One morning I awoke to see a bluish figure standing by my bed. As he(?) faded, I noticed a strange noise- the wall heater -which I'd never touched- was running. Other weird things happend when I lived there. Once I open the door and found a plastic bottle rattling by itself. A tabloid sitting on a dresser would be turned to different pages when I returned to the room, once to a page that read "Amazing proof of life after death". A phone would ring by itself when it was disconnected. Durring a visit with my upstairs neigbor, the front door drifted open. Someone made a joke about the ghost, and it slammed shut!

Before someone calls the ghostbusters, lets look at this a bit closer

Waking up to someone/something standing by my bed?

The heater that turned on by itself?


The tabloid that turned pages by itself?

The phone that rang when unplugged?

The door opening and slamming shut?


While my story doesn't disprove ghosts (or aliens), it shows how everyday oddness can be misinterpreted to as paranormal. If I met a ghost/alien/fairy/monster in person, while fully awake (including no sleep deprivision), with witnesses, I'd be much more inclined to think it was real, compared to the 'phenomena' I experienced in the haunted apartment

Tilting head to the side.

I sometimes become obsessed with alien stuff. It's very exciting and I think I've had a few encounters myself. But I think it's more important to develop our spiritual awareness starting with our intuition. I'm just greatful for the opportunity to be here on earth nomatter who or what I was in a past life, who is on top of us below us and who or what is out there. It doesn't matter as much as who we are now on the inside.

I'm interested in exploring my own phyche and how I might be connected to the rest of the universe. I think perhaps there may be aliens out there who are using technology to rip holes in space and time in the same manner that we use current technology to power our vehicles. It's unnatural and harmful to nature's balance.

I imagine that some races are highly developed spiritually and can traverse space and time using technology that works with nature and the abilities of spirit like the Jedi, and other races are probably only developed technologically and go around like barbarians simply operating by brute force. If we last long enough I wonder which direction the human race will go.

hahahaha, that's hilarious Olympia

Another way to rip holes in space and time while exploring the psyche:

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dmt/dmt.shtml

Maybe a fireball? Ball lightning?

Here's a "UFO" experience I had in the Texas Hillcountry, though I don't know if it even classifies as UFO. It was a quiet night, no chance of rain, no other cars around. My mother and I drove up to our security gate. There was no street light, this is the middle of the country. My mom stopped the car and opened her window to lean out and punch in the security code. Just as she was leaning out, a white light that seemed to come from the sky came on her side of the car, enveloped the entire vehicle so that we could not see anything but white, and then seemed to fly off past my side of the car and ascend. There was no sound during this experience, not even wind.

Then we sat there for about 5 minutes asking each other if the other had seen that in between saying, "WtF was that?"

I've only had two strange experience with this apartment that comes to mind. This apartment is prone to drafts and doors open and shut frequently if they are not securely shut. Anyways, that's not the strange part.

The strange occurances are actually the same thing happening twice.

My girlfriend and I were in the living room watching TV, when we heard a loud "CLICK" come from the kitchen. When we entered, the gas burner of the stove was turned all the way to high. We hadn't been cooking, and even if we were cooking we wouldn't put the fire that high because it burns the food, but we weren't. There is probably a mechanical explanation for this, but it has only happened twice.

Most strange things that happen, I can discount as coincidence or I can convince myself I must not have read the situation correctly because there is no 3rd party agreement. However, there is one situation that happened that I cannot discard for those reasons:

When I was younger, my friend and I used to meditate together for about an hour and a half a day. One day, after a few months of doing this, we were riding a bus together and meditating but after an hour he stopped because his eyes hurt. I continued, however. After about 10 minutes, I suddenly saw something explicitly and the distinct feeling it impressed upon me was not one I have ever felt again. At the exact moment it disappeared from my vision, my friend exclaimed "Ah!!!" and I opened my eyes.

"What?" I asked.

Then he proceeded to describe the exact same thing I had just seen but it filled his vision with his eyes open.

I don't really know what to say about that experience, but I feel really stupid talking about it. Funny, I don't feel stupid talking about anything that might have some logical explanation but that particular experience and the feeling I felt make me feel really stupid for talking about it. If you want to know what I saw, the closest thing to an explanation was what I read in.... The Eagle's Gift, I believe it was, by Carlos Castaneda since an almost identical vision was explained there. Strange, but I am also part Yaqui.

Anyways.... ehhh. Kimoi.