Where do the dinosaurs fit into the Bible?

John 10:25-30 (AMP)
25 Jesus answered them, I have told you so, yet you do not believe Me [you do not trust Me and rely on Me]. The very works that I do by the power of My Father and in My Father's name bear witness concerning Me [they are My credentials and evidence in support of Me].
26 But you do not believe and trust and rely on Me because you do not belong to My fold [you are no sheep of Mine].
27 The sheep that are My own hear and are listening to My voice; and I know them, and they follow Me.
28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never lose it or perish throughout the ages. [To all eternity they shall never by any means be destroyed.] And no one is able to snatch them out of My hand.
29 My Father, Who has given them to Me, is greater and mightier than all [else]; and no one is able to snatch [them] out of the Father's hand.
30 I and the Father are One.

John 14:6 (AMP)
Jesus said to him, I am the Way and the Truth and the Life ; no one comes to the Father except by (through) Me.

Isaiah 45:22-25 (AMP)
22 Look to Me and be saved, all the ends of the earth! For I am God, and there is no other.
23 I have sworn by Myself, the word is gone out of My mouth in righteousness and shall not return, that unto Me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear [allegiance]. [Romans 14:11; Philippians 2:10,11; Hebrews 6:13.]
24 Only in the Lord shall one say, I have righteousness (salvation and victory) and strength [to achieve]. To Him shall all come who were incensed against Him, and they shall be ashamed. [1 Corinthians 1:30,31.]
25 In the Lord shall all the offspring of Israel be justified (enjoy righteousness, salvation, and victory) and shall glory.

Matthew 7:21-23 (AMP)
21 Not everyone who says to Me, Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven.
22 Many will say to Me on that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name and driven out demons in Your name and done many mighty works in Your name?
23 And then I will say to them openly (publicly), I never knew you; depart from Me, you who act wickedly [disregarding My commands]. [Psalms 6:8.]

Matthew 10:32-33 (AMP)
32 Therefore, everyone who acknowledges Me before men and confesses Me [out of a state of oneness with Me], I will also acknowledge him before My Father Who is in heaven and confess [that I am abiding in] him.
33 But whoever denies and disowns Me before men, I also will deny and disown him before My Father Who is in heaven.

Matthew 10:38 (AMP)
And he who does not take up his cross and follow Me [cleave steadfastly to Me, conforming wholly to My example in living and, if need be, in dying also] is not worthy of Me.

Is it? As an American, am I to be held accountable for all the actions that my leaders have done? How about the ones that I did not vote for? How about the actions that I have no control over? If I move to another country, am I still held accountable for such acts?

The argument you make here is preposterous. To take it a step further, we could say that all peoples who America has agonized should have the right to demand compensation from Europe for sending their ilk to America in the first place.

I did not follow in the footsteps of the Papacy who declared the first (or any) crusade. Nor did the Bible EVER elicit such action. Those actions were dictated by a few who decided to enhance their existing power. As a matter of fact, the crusades were, for the most part, not about religion at all.



Matthew 5:14-16 (AMP)
14 You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden.
15 Nor do men light a lamp and put it under a peck measure, but on a lampstand, and it gives light to all in the house.
16 Let your light so shine before men that they may see your moral excellence and your praiseworthy, noble, and good deeds and recognize and honor and praise and glorify your Father Who is in heaven.

Matthew 6:1-4 (AMP)
1 TAKE CARE not to do your good deeds publicly or before men, in order to be seen by them; otherwise you will have no reward [reserved for and awaiting you] with and from your Father Who is in heaven.
2 Thus, whenever you give to the poor, do not blow a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites in the synagogues and in the streets like to do, that they may be recognized and honored and praised by men. Truly I tell you, they have their reward in full already.
3 But when you give to charity, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing,
4 So that your deeds of charity may be in secret; and your Father Who sees in secret will reward you openly.

I am not asking you to believe in the Bible Michael. I am not here to prove it to you in any way. The Bible speaks for itself. If you choose not to believe, then do so.

I am answering questions that have been posed based on my belief in the Bible.

That really is something that each person must answer for themselves. But it is good to fellowship with others and study the Bible to find it.

As far as knowing the mind of God, He says we can not.

Isaiah 55:8-9 (AMP)
8 For My thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways My ways , says the Lord.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways and My thoughts than your thoughts.

Woah! I just had this very conversation on the forums yesterday! After I tried to explain to someone that different people have different ideals, opinions, morality and ethics, he also told me that his ways were higher and more righteous than mine! (At least I think that's what he meant reading between the insults about my depravity).

I know who GOD is!!! AND HE POSTS ON THESE FORUMS!!!

Why do i get the feeling that in spite of all their pious and heavily annotated pontificating, creationist Xtians are retarded?

Maybe, maybe not. There are some intellectuals that believe the New Testament was originally written in Aramaic, but those texts were lost. Remember, Jesus and the disciples spoke Aramaic.

And some of the Old Testament was in Aramaic as well:
- Genesis 31:47
- Ezra 4:8-6:18, 7:12-26
- Daniel chapters 2-7
- Jeremiah 10:11

Remember, when the KJV was translated, Aramaic was used in both the New and Old Testaments. As a matter of fact, in translating these texts, the 54 authors consulted translations in:
- English
- Chaldean
- Latin
- Spanish
- French
- Italian
- Dutch

Now, while I wish I had time to devote myself to each of these, I just don't.

Hey Kris. I do not pretend to be high and mighty. This is a direct quote from the Bible. I am but a humble being.

She wasn't talking about you... there was another thread in which someone used almost those very words... and not in a "quoting scripture" context either.

The Pope is a man who makes up rules and tries to get people to follow them.

The only way that the apostles were different is that they arranged to die before we got the chance to argue with them.

Some might say, perhaps correctly, perhaps not, that he speaks god's will. Thats heresay, regardless of the truth, but no more than that can be said about the writers of the bible.


God can make you win the lottery, or he can kill your baby. Both actions reinforce your believe that a force outside yourself controls events within your life. Religeous leaders tell you that its called "god". Athiests call it "chance". The end result is that your believe in an outside force. What god wants is your to believe in him/her/it. The line between Good and Evil are human perceptions. Gods means leads to his ends, whatever that may be.

Science is an attempt to understand the universe. You have a thinking, reasoning brain, and a nosiness and so you can seek to understand that what you dont(including god). If you believe that god exists, and if he didnt want this, he'd stop you dead in your tracks, so to speak.

Therefore, you have a mandate to seek out answers to what you dont believe in, using logical deduction. Regardless of what you believe in.

The whole point of science is to lead us to to the fountain of creation. Use it.

At this point, I'd like to quote someone.

"I. Saw. GOD." - Tommy Chong

Thats the science of good cultivation.

If God did everything, it'd be boring (for God). The whole point of choice, from a deity's perspective, is to make things interesting. Not to say that any being takes pleasure in pain of others, but there would be no value in good deeds if they were automatic.

Oh PLEASE if thats teh case, may I burn in frickin hell

Yes, I can, but I would not call them stupid because that would be demeaning you.

Maybe you don't take it this way, but most people do.

And you're an authority on what their intentions were based on what?


More can be said - like the fact that the writers of the Bible lived in the times, and were connected quite directly to the events happening. It's not proof that the text is holy, but it certainly would be closer to the source.



The more interesting thought is whether or not God would choose to do either at all.


This is a huge stretch of logic. I would argue that God would desire humans to have free will, and so direct control of events is not in line with "the plan".

I think it's much more likely that "chance" was set up as an intentional part of our universe. Your argument essentially relies on begging the question.


If you believe in God, then how could Good and Evil be human perceptions?


But why? What makes you convinced God would stop what God does not intend? If eating a taco does not fall into God's plan, would you choke and die on it? You cannot have free will without the ability for your actions to have consequences that you must live with.

To me, it's futile trying to make a book that's so old and written so vaguely fit in with modern science.

It's like all those people who believe in King Arthur and the Knights of the Round Table with absolute conviction and go on pilgrimages across England. It's just a story, you won't find a lake with a woman in it offering swords to people wandering along it's banks. It was in fact the first mass-produced book ever printed in France using a printing press, no wonder people fell for it the same way they did on October the 30th in 1938 when Orson Wells broadcasted the War of the Worlds. It was a new thing to people, and very convincing.

How many people have read Rudyard Kipling's Just So Stories? Have you ever believed his reason why Leopards got their spots...



It would definately be a controversial statement today and (hopefully) most people would just laugh, but it's just as possible as the world being created in 7 days by a mystical being... in my opinion. It's definately got the same amount of evidence to back up the theory. A chapter in a book and plenty of imagination.

Being modern doesn't necessarily mean it's correct.


Are there really a lot of people who do this?


Actually, historical evidence shows that both Arthur and Merlin were actual people. Most of the story has become allegory, but they still represent actual events and ideologies that happened.


Are you kidding? One is a book that was printed as a story of a legend that already existed. While that was the first printing, the story had been around for centuries.
The other is a radio broadcast by a very serious radio broadcaster of the time, intentionally done in a style to be confused with real news. The two bare very little similarity in how they went about telling a story to people.


Not really. Most people at the time still didn't read, and the ones who did were educated.


That book never made any attempts to state that it was real - heck, even the title "Just so" implies that they are tall tales. Apples, oranges.


Attacking the notion that religion and science can fit together, where you are really just attacking the most literal explanation, is a straw-man attack, plain and simple.

The overwhelming majority of religious christians believe in a looser interpretation, and if you wish to state "it's futile trying to make a book that's so old and written so vaguely fit in with modern science" you're going to have to focus on a wider set of interpretations than just the most literal.

Okay, so basically, our views are the same, but our conclusions are different.

The reason I asked in the first place was because many people seem so emphatic about their interpretations of the Bible that I wonder if they are worshiping the Bible instead of God. It is a releif to know that isn't the case here.

The reason for that is Christ is the Word. So worshipping the Word would be consistant with Christianity. Many Christians don't think the Bible is flawless, because God gave man freewill to corrupt, and because Satan was cast to the Earth, and given certain control.

Nope. Grease is The Word.

The Bible does not equal The Word.

Assuming God's Word (aka The Word) is inherently powerful, and can create all of creation simply by being uttered, as Genesis documents, the The Bible has to be a translation from an unknowable, holy language of God.

So I back Zuzu's comments. While "The Word" is something godly, The words in the Bible are not "The Word".

This somehow reminds me of Ulrika's "choose your favourite equation" question... can't quite put my finger on why, though...

Your reasoning is one reason why I said many Christians don't find the Bible infallible. As far as I'm concerned, the Bible is a mystery, only to be understood by those who God wants to understand it. It's not a matter of intelligence as much as it is inspiration. With the Holy Spirit interpreting, the Bible can be the Word imho. But to an atheist, it's a lot of words. The Bible says it's meant to be hidden from nonbelievers, if I remember correctly.

"Hidden" from nonbelievers? But why?


So no point in having nonbelievers see it then, or discussed in schools?

Which seems to be the opposite of things I thought you believed in - this is not a cricitism - just... ???

Thoroughly confused now.

I think it's a matter of one's heart. If one's heart is closed to God, he/she won't be able to understand God's hidden meanings, even if it's explained. God insists on faith before proof. The truth is so simple, if it wasn't obscured non-believers could believe without faith, taking away freewill to believe or not. Once one has faith, the proof comes in ways that can't be shared with non-believers.

That's why Jesus said no one can enter heaven unless he/she is born again. He said one has to see things in a way a child sees things. To be a child, or a baby. A wise tax collector came to Him to better understand the concept. He thought he needed to enter the womb again to be saved. Jesus explained... What is born of flesh (water) is flesh, and that which is born of spirit is spirit. He was saying we must be born of the spirit as well as the flesh, in order to understand spiritual matters.

God does not exist.

~Ulrika~

You make me smile and laugh way too long somtimes Kendra