Club Piranha Forced To Close

After 8 months in SL life, PIRANHA gives to hudrends of ppl a special way to enjoying

and partying in game.SHAD raffke (owner of the club) gives the opportunnity to many ppl

to play there music in club.I am one of them my first steps in game was in that club.Last

days we expirience attacks from griefers,as a result club crashing and works abnormally.

From this post i want all the great massive of piranha shows the love and the power we all

have.We are a big family and no one can take away our home.

WE need to make LINDEN LABS support us and secure us in the best way.

LINDEN LABS WE WANT TO PROTECT US

So plz all ppl knows the club and ppl we believe that situation is unfair post in that

topic

ITS TIME TO SHOW OUR POWER PIRANHA~NATION

Welcome to Second Life hon.

Need a dj gig? Play rock? Lemme know!

muahahahah.

daisy if u can live with that (griefing and abuse its ok)

the matter is linden has to protect citizens properties before all of us

forced to close our clubs or companies

thanks for ur reply

Sorry to hear you had to close, but before you do, get the advice of a security expert. There's quite a lot you can do with the land settings and simple defense weapons to protect yourself to a large degree. LL seems to have determined that a defensive orb or system that teleports someone off your property and sends them home is OK, so you can boot people out as you wish without having to attack and without having to justify it.

I display a defensive orb at a landing point. It sends a simple message: grief, and be gone. If your patrons are newbies, educate them to sit and ride out griefing while you handle the issue. Griefers want you to panic. Laughing at them is a better answer.

fcuking griefers

Thanx for the post Psygate! Right at time!!

I am a resident in SL for more then 1 year know and I have seen many clubs raise and fall, as many ideas coming to a quick end. It surely would be the wrong reaction, to blame circumstances like griefing as responsible. Mostly, the projects do not hold together, because the people behind can´t do that either. But in that case it´s different and I strongly support the words from Psygate!

Piranha is a good idea and one of the most striking places I ever have seen during my second live.

It´s a shame, that this place and its people behind are forced to shut down that club, because they are exposed to some actions, they can´t defend them selfs against.

If some of you Lindans read these lines, please do consider how to help a project to survive, because Piranha stands for all that, what you Lindans are also standing for. Toloerance, fun, open minds and a platform for so many skilled DJs, who delicately seperates from the huge crowd of soc alled "DJs", who just play their Lists of MP3 up and down.

Please help to let Piranha survive, protect that peace of diamond and help it to shine again.
PLEASE!!!

@ Shad Raffke (Owner of the Piranha)

Heads up Shad! You are not alone and you have friends behind you!! *hugz*

Daisy Beauchamp? As in the same Daisy Beauchamp who owns Sanctuary Rock Land Management & Sanctuary Rock VIP groups?

Welcome to walking yourself right in the middle of the controversy!

I will submit that one of the offending persons just so happens to be member in both the Sanctuary Rock Land Management & Sanctuary Rock VIP groups. I cannot help but wonder if he is employee of yours??? And if he is, I sincerely hope you are not of the same moral character.

My sentiments regarding reasons for closing PIRANHA will follow in short time.

Your sympathy and suggestions are greatly appreciated. I have explored the various options and have also been previously involved in beta-testing of both weapons and various security systems. None are as adquate as or effective that I would like.

This has been longstanding personal matter that 2 individuals have held against me for many months and during which time I hoped they would eventually lose interest and stop. Four months prior to recent events, I had justly dismissed one of them PIRANHA staff for reasons I do not wish to share yet at this time. The other who is this particular individual's RL significant other resigned voluntarily after lending me choice words. For the next days both of them remained for the most part "civil" hoping I would be willing to make sale of the club to them. I will even add that these individuals attempted to coerce me to make sale behind the back of my business partner. Refusing to do so and asking fair time to repond to their offer, I discussed with my business regarding possible sale, and both of us agreed no desire to sell to this couple. Once I made response to the couple that would not be willing to sell, their actions quickly turned hostile.

Over the next four months these individuals intermittently returned to the club. I had never estate banned them because I sincerely hoped eventually they would get over the differences they had for me, and to be honest the environment promoted at PIRANHA was one of tolerance and one that was forgiving. At first it started with them intermittently showing up and ignoring professional and polite attempts to welcome them and disregarding making any return response. This progressed such that I gave up on trying to attempt further greeting them if they were going to be rude without responding in same fashion. I simply sat back letting them enjoy without antagonizing them. Shortly thereafter, upon future visits one of them began making rude comments and gestures to me in public chat. With each future visit by this couple, the severity of the comments and gestures continued to progress. Again I simply kept quiet through this without responding as I still remained optimistic they would grow tired of their antics and eventually stop.

Last Monday, September 10th this couple again showed up at PIRANHA following what I later would find out that they had sent emails to various others encouraging them to show up for a quote-un-quote "REUNION." After taking another personal insult from this person in group chat in front of our guests, I only responded "that was unnecessary." This led to yet another further insult from this person and I responded with an immediate ban. What followed from my refusal to accept this person's harrassment was tragic. A person accompanying him then proceeded to also harrass me publicly, and so I immediately banned this person as well. Finally, I banned this person's RL significant other hoping to avoid further conflict and public disruption. Shortly after another individual came who is an SL partner to the accompanying person and led a SIM attack that resulted in 2 crashes and me being barely able to return and secure the sim. Over the course of the next 3 hours, I suffered severe harrasment through IMs form these people before they finally halted.

I submitted timely and thorough abuse reports on all 4 individuals accurately depicting their roles. No timely intervention was taken. Through the course of the week we suffered further attacks from avies sharing common groups to these individuals. No matter how many I ended up banning, another of different name would ultimately come. Additionally, I had also been warned one of the individuals was asking around attempting to get a hold of the new password changes I had made on our stream servers.

By week's end I had unwillingly turned off object creation and object entry across the entire sim hoping this would halt their malicious efforts. I also hoped they would not be intelligent enough to know script attacks conducted through avatar attachments. On Friday we had an episode where the sim abruptly began to lagg and crashed. Immediately following return, the sim was still under severe lag with threat of cashing. Again, I looked through profiles until finding avie with again same common group affiliation. I turned off parcel scripts and bumped this avie from the parcel so that the avie would reset to no scripts and immediately SIM performance normalized. After this avie ported back to the club, this avie stayed only short minute and left. I assume whoever was behind this avie realized I turned off sciprts and could no longer continue griefing and therefore left.

No current security orb technology is able to prevent against such attacks. Politely waiting and hoping they stop didnt work. Attempting to ban each avie only led to a new one coming. And submitting abuse reports did nothing to help...and I will add that IP bans are usually on a couple days to week or so at most even if followup had been timely. My only effective option was to disable scripts and objects across the entire sim. However, this did not spare me from fearing further assault from these people.

The moment I realized PIRANHA and entire sim would be indefinately forced into settling for no objects and scripts for its guests, PIRANHA seized to be the very club it represented. Though I formerly made a hard decision to close PIRANHA, all of the involved indidividuals had in a sense already destroyed it.

I was victimized and gave up many months of charitable hard work, as I did not see these people ever stopping their harrassment. Not once did I ever grief any of these individuals, and after over 4 months of already hoping these individuals finally mature enough to stop, I finally lost all of my optimism for this and I no longer have desire to subject myself to malicious attacks from other citizens. The future of PIRANHA was indirectly victimized, and every DJ, host, and guest to PIRANHA was also indirectly victimized.

In my opinion, the chain of events prove there is neither a current effective process of protection for citizens against persistent malicious griefers nor is there a timely or effective method for obtaining help. I can only hope Linden Life someday provides more effective estate tools that will permit sim owners to inspect individual avies suspected of script attacking or perhaps even logging them out automatically if they flag as utilizing extraordinary sim resources through attachments. I can only hope that Linden Life someday provide more timely, effective and parmanent outcomes through abuse reporting. I can only hope these involved individuals have a consiounce for how many citizens beyond just me their actions have hurt.

One thing I am thankful for....not having given RL personal informantion to this couple at the time they were staff at PIRANHA many months earlier. I was wise enough to recognize the "red flag" when they attempted to coerce me through guilt of "not thinking enough of them as true friends" to trust them with info regarding my RL identity. While I have no yet developed personal opinion, pro or con, for age and identity verification in SL, it is obvious to me the reason both of these individuals are members of the group "SL'ers against Age Verification!"

I had hesitated to ask you about this story because of the soreness that must accompany it, Shad. Looks like I was right.... I still find it hard to believe who one of these persons was (name begins with an "A".

Knowing you, it must have been a sad time when you had to switch off objects and scripts there--but it seems the only course of action you could take. You did everything else already.

Well, like Jaqueline said:



and to add a quote from SVEN Newman:



So... what can be improved in SL to prevent this sort of thing from happening? You mentioned IP bans, I didn't even know there was such a thing here.

I have been in SL intermittently for the last couple months. SL is not my type of game and because of family matters, I cannot really spend a lot of time in there. In the 20 or so hours that I have spent in SL, the only place that I found was really worth stopping by was Piranha.

It's a shame that SL does not provide better tools to protect against human insanity but at the same time, SL reflects what happens in RL. Shad, the way you describe your philosophy is only shared between a small percentage of the population in RL. The fact and the matter that SL is a game basically provides individual that seems to share your philosophy in RL a platform to anonymize themselves and forget about their RL philosophy and manage to become different individuals online. This fact alone will lead to chaotic behaviors and combined with the other fact that SL reflects RL, you will constantly have to fight and as in RL, defending yourself without front running actions to attack your enemies will not lead to your success. I fully understand that you're first goal and feel bad that you had to find the hard way that SL is just a game after all.

With that said, I totally understand why you're closing the club. It's a shame because what you've built with your partners was really invigorating to me. I have grown older and with all responsibilities (better jobs, kids) I cannot rave as much as I used to and Piranha was a place to bring back memories, listen to good psy music and feel as if I was still part of a movement.

Thanks to all the great DJs who mixed there!

Good luck for all your future endeavors!

Hi 2 all.. just wanna let y know.. as new as I am.. I found a great place havin fun and enjoying the music at your club PIRANHA - Shad..

and therefore I won’t believe and can’t imagine the reason why ppl do that to you (attacking and stuff)

It makes me sad to see that the place (SL game) where most of the guys stay to play their dream life .. be used by ppl to bring their rl shit inside..

Thank you for having a great time at your spot..

Charley Yalin
Germany

Shad

I admire you style and your life philosophy. More of your kind..wars will be over and forever peace on earth.

But until then...war is declared against Piranha and it's members

The attacks you describe is not only an attack on Piranha but also an attack on all of us individuals loving Piranha.

So please Shad..give us the names of the ones guilty. There are no more reason for you to keep it secret and to be nice.

Members of Piranha..we are at least 100...and we have friends...If all of us and our friends ban those guys from our homes ..sims..clubs stors etc...it will have some effect.
Let' s spread the word...and make theire lifes misserable in SL ...Lets strike back ..and put up theire names on the board of shame..Let it out in the open.

Those of you having computer skills and/or skilled friends ....plz help Shad to defend Pirahna

United we can put more pressure on Lindens by sending request on help in this issue....100's of mails will wake them up.

I call on all of you loving Piranha.. Let's Strike Back! Don't let them win!!

/ Jeppe Wilder

Its just a sad story.
To declare war, as the former poster suggested, is not the answer and will not bring back Piranha as it was.
And to blame Shad to have a certain approach to SL is just not appropiate.
It is just that approach I want to defend.

Peko

Yes , it s really pissing me on that one of the best and my first Locations I learned to know in SL is closing now .

But I think its not the right way to give up all and it cannot be the way to count on help by Lindens . I really must say why just cancel the possibillity of using scripts in Piranha , or trying to find out over Linden Lab who did this shit ? .... just why the base meaning of Piranha should allow anything to use and do there ? ....why not a compromise like if anyone wants to use scripts he shall ask and giving him a temp. permission ? Why just running away instead find a way to survive ? that would be same (I think) when u never go to a rl-party after a razzia or a police control - at the end u sitting home alone and got fear to switch ion the PC ! That which not kill us makes us stronger - and the Piranha was ever a Club that makes u meet good people from other scenes and the base of the Piranha (so I learned it to know) was ever a GOOD THOUGHT and the LIGHT side wins at the end !

If u mean this will help I say help help help too .......but I really think there must be another way for Piranha ..... it s just the questin if Shad (heya Shaddy) ) is ready to find a compromise or is just too tired of all . I ever meet Shad as a nice , wonderful , clever and an exemplary person and I hope she can change her decision and find new positive energy for a new hope or new beginning .

Freizeit Planer / Sunshine Man - Nothern Germany BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

PS : who find grammatical Faults can keep em )))

ROFL, yes thats right - Pirahna is forced to close so let's start a vigilante movement, because thats just going to bring good publicity to the club name isn't it.

I know we've had our differences Shad but I am truly sad to see Pirahna go, It was a great club back in the day and had some great times there.

Perhaps it would be best to remember the better times of Pirahna ?

I dont think Piranha is forced to close down.

As a DJ for Underfiend Radio and Club 138 in Secondlife, I have seen all kinds of club griefing. We have an eject bot that will either teleport them out or send them home, or even issue a 30 minute ban. It's a pain, it really irritates me when it happens during a show, but you relog and keep on keeping on. To close a club cause of griefers sounds a little drastic to me, but since I am not of the crowd for that club I don't know all of the who shot john that goes on in the clubs. One good thing is SL will never run out of clubs, one goes two show up.

my avatar got attacked

this is worth a huge priority ticket to LL.

Well, what should I tell you? Congratulations for a nice peace of your actions, which undoubtedly has been founded on greed of yours?
Or for the cowardly actions against a honest person, who decided not in your greedy favor?

Tell me, what kind of thoughts and feelings do you have, attempting to hurt one person, a loved place with all its people?
I suppose, that you must feel very lonely and it seems to me, that you simply do not understand, how social interaction is made, whether it´s SL or RL.

I know very well, what to tell you!

Leave SL, because people like you do not belong here. Go out in RL and satisfy your ugly greed there.

@ Shad

Thank you for let us know about that. I do understand your actions. No doubts, I am very sad, and it hurts to know, Piranha is gone.
Nevertheless, it´s you and your wellbeing, which counts much more.
You are still in SL, you will hopefully make many people happy with your lovely sets of Psy. That is most important to me.

Keep in mind, there may be some lost peole, who have badly acted against you. But there is a huge crowd behind you, and they will love you and be there, when you once again are spinning the tunes. Thank You for the good time, and(!) for the good time to come!

First thank you Jenns. I received message in world regarding your sentiments and was very greatful.

No PIRANHA was not forced to close down, it was a decision that while based on many reasons, was FORMALIZED after being the focus of malicious individuals who after 4 months still saw fit to continue their attacks against me.



I have eject button as owner of the island. My policy with any greifer that ever presented was to politely request in IM they stop. I estimate >90% the time they did so peacefully when approached privately and politely. The remaining that became hostile or chose to ignore were parcel and/or estate banned. For 8 months this policy worked to perfection. However this is not a matter of the usual SL griefer we are all familiar with. The involved are stalkers who after 4 months still continue to harrass me.

I will also add that if ever a banned avie contacted me giving reassurance not to do again, they were given welcome to return. More often than not, we never had further problem.

Thankyou PSYGATE for opening this discussion. Aw, Shad words can not express my sadness and sympathy for you. That you were forced by the hostile actions of these griefers to close the club is a shocking indictment of the dark destructive side of humanity that sadly exists all around us. While narrow-minded griefers such as these form a small minority, they are unfortunately able to wreak havoc amongst the open-minded friendly majority in ways that are out of all proportion to their numbers. I don't think I'm exaggerating when I say that it feels as if a suicide bomber just walked into the Piranha club and blew it to bits. The people behind these attacks on the club share a similar mentality and they didn't just spoil the enjoyment of all the members. They also spoiled whatever enjoyment they might have had themselves if they had been more open-minded. Shad, I know this must have been a terrible blow to you after all the work and effort and sheer talent you put in to building and running Piranha. I just hope you will be able to get over this setback soon and perhaps even get round to starting up a Piranha version 2.0 maybe under a different avatar name so that the griefers won't know it's you and attempt to spoil the fun again. Please don't get too downhearted. So many of us have enjoyed the music, the chat, and the good vibes that Piranha stood for. It would be a shame to admit defeat because of a couple of rogues with narrow twisted minds.

I'm still new to SL, not even a year old yet. My SL partner introduced me to Piranha when I was what you might call an infant. Through Piranha I gained so many things. For one, I was shown a whole new world of music (electronica) and thereby so many doors were opened for my enjoyment and expression. Also, it is at Piranha that I really learned about how social interaction in SL could be, how people could form a sense of camaraderie and well-wishing toward one another. I know it's not mentioned much (PLUR), perhaps it's not considered significiant, but to me Piranha always represented the ideals of Peace Love Unity and Respect, more than any other place in SL.

The DJs at Piranha, the hosts, management, the partiers, and especially Miss Raffke, all contributed to make it a magical place, unprecedented and inimitable. I eventually took up hosting at Piranha, and during that brief time I only had to deal with one griefer, who received an eject at my hands. If only I had known the potential for grief was so high, I would have perhaps chuckled at this individuals' poor attempts at disruption.

But as others have said, what truly upsets me the most is that, no matter what beef (real or imagined) these harrasers have with Miss Raffke, by performing as they did, and being as inconsiderate as they were, they managed to kill the experience for all of us at Piranha. Piranha is not just the club, not just the management, or hosts, or even just the DJs. Piranha for me was always the people who came and lived the party, as well. And they did nothing to deserve such cold uncaring abuse at the hands of a few petty but determined individuals.

I was shocked to find out the name of one of those involved. Like Nebulae said, it begins with an 'A'. I have removed her from my friends list and will not voluntarily associate with her any longer. I don't like the idea of a war, because war never heals. But I would not mind in the slightest knowing the identities of the culprits, if only so I can be sure not to associate with them, either.

What was done to Piranha is a tragedy. Some people have said Miss Raffke went too far when she closed Piranha. I say until any of us can say we know exactly what she had to deal with, month after month, and especially recently, that such a judgment is a little precipitous and a bit condescending. Even were it not intended that way. Shad has worked so hard to try to make Piranha the best virtual rave experience, period. She has given herself to no end, time after time, even when others did not seem to rightly appreciate it. I will always support her decisions, and this one too, which cannot have been made easily or frivolously.

I hope in time SL has some kind of protection features to prevent this ever happening again. A handful of people with an agenda should not be able to bring disruption and an end to something that has touched so many people's lives for the better.

Piranha is in all of us, in each of us who will carry her ideals with us wherever we go.

And because of that, she will never die.


--Ama

I am sorry this happened to you and the club Shad. Some of my favourite memories are from being there. I recall opening night. You, Natalie, the rest, all so friendly and wonderful. Always cheerful people and wonderful times when I went to Piranha's.

I know the decision isn't an easy one and obviously not a rash one. I wish you well and the best, not just to you, but to your staff, from not just me, but the rest of us at TOC.

Don't stay a stranger