Taking the fun out of shopping

No, time = distance / speed.

Really? It only costs your time, I guess, and so your time is worth...what?...let's see, you sell something at 250L, and it took you between 10 and 12 hours to make (not counting upload costs) which means your time is worth 20 - 25L per hour? Seriously? That's like 5-7 cents an hour. You must be kidding with the above quote.

I do understand what you mean about the perpetual sales and no monetary cost to create, but that statement seems a little exaggerated.

Oh man, nothing cheeses me off more than when I walk into the Apple Store and find out that buying a new MacBook Pro will cost me a couple of thousand dollars. Come on! I only wanted to pay $20.

Really takes the fun out of shopping.

Well, to be fair, after the first, say, half dozen sales, I consider myself monetarily compensated for most things I produce, which rarely take more than... 10-20 hours of work. I'm not charging full contract rates here after all. Those rates would be for stuff I don't want to do.

It bloody does as well. Vote for me as Supreme Dictator Of The Universe and all Macs will be free!

LOL! In the area I live it's more like $8-$9.

Man, I gotta move outta here!

i don't want a mac, i want a daily croissant, filled with virginia ham, and maybe cheddar.

My Mac for a croissant!

and orange juice

TY. While i am producing things that are higher end and cost more lately, my original things have not beel raised one L, and lately I ahve been contemplating lowerring them by quite a bit just so ppl who now have no income might be able to find a way to aford them. That and I am going to be doing some major improvements on those lower end tiems to make them more attractive and realistic and still NOT raise the price of them. Unlike most ppl in here I remember what it was like running around with chalky skin, crayon colorred hair and with nothing in inventory but all the crappy free junk pl sent me in huge amounts in the Ahern WA. It wasn't fun.

You can have croissants! I promise! Just put your X in my box, there, that's it, goooood *rubs hands*

*chokes on the comment and then spits it out* So, I guess that will finally make them what they are worth? Nothing? Then some of the other companies should start paying you to take theirs!

The only thing that might make me raise my prices is if the Lindens charge more per upload. Otherwise, what is the point? I like making things, and while they take time, I'm having fun doing it. It's not a job for me, it's a hobby. I can understand why the others have higher prices, since they do treat this as a job.

As for the RL money vs time? I consider it like this, it's a few more cents per hour that I didn't have before, which is pure profit. Not that I'm likely to be cashing out any time soon.

I agree that this is not happening to much of any extent and that people may be saying so - or making it sound like everyone is doing it - in order to panic everyone else into raising their prices.

I will raise my prices when I want to, and not because of what the Linden dollar happens to be doing. Like Jonquille, I aim my products toward those looking for good value for the money, and some new players. Every product I make goes on to sell again and again - it's not like I have to make a new house each time it sells.

coco

Well you are right about the ridiculously low "wages" we get for creation (check out Surreals post). Here I was thinking more of just the upload fees but even if it takes six sales or so, the principle is the same.

The way I look at it, like most people in SL (until recently) I would have made the stuff anyway because I only make what's interesting to me and what strikes my fancy.

Also, all those arguments about time=money and the cost of rent are also a little thin.

Sure your time is worth money if it's a job, but most builders and creators are hobbyists using their "spare" time. It's not like anyone is twisting your arm to spend long hours at the computer making talking lingerie or dancing teddy bears or whatever it is that people seem to think is worth so much money.

Sure the rent on the store goes up usually when the Linden goes down, but it's still like an extra two dollars only, so the idea of doubling your prices especially if you are a high volume business is way over the top.

Sadly, my experience is that the places that deal in high volume crap are the first places to raise prices even though they have the least justification for doing so.

wrong wrong wrong wrong
Here is a bvh animation which is resold over and over and over on the internet in a webstore
http://www.turbosquid.com/FullPreview/Index.cfm/ID/149467

200 USD

It's 30 frames of animation

Whereas in SL you get an animation for 25 cents USD, and often times better quality than you can find available on the web

So does that mean all animators should be selling animations for 66,100 L$ which is the current equivalent to 200 US?

Or should you STFU and be happy you are getting animations in SL for 200 L$ which at current is 0.57 USD?

If a creator raises the price of something even 50% why are you even crying?

Or should you just download Avimator and make that shit for yourself?

Honestly, $200? Who are they kidding? Only people with ridiculous expense accounts.

Not everyone has the same creative talents


heh you should be looking at it the other way around, animating is a real world profession, why are you not making 200 off animations?

I must set a higher price at my SL real gold ladder .. 10% up - it will become 32.985 L (ONLY) - after reading AL this. Ohhhh. Its only two Starrax wands BYW..

/Tina - You know the brand now dont you?)

PS: I still have a chocolate milk shake - for only 10 L if you urgent need to shop...

Another thought that occoured to me... programs.

90% of all computer programs are created once and then sold over and over and over as well. Does that mean scripting a program in RL is different than scripting one in SL?

Certainly software companies adjust their prices to account for the changes in economy.

The average price for software in RL is around 75 to 100 US. that's average, some can go into the hundreds of thousands.

SO listen up if you script in SL, your time is valued lower than your RL counterparts, your customers have spoken, they think you are worth-less

Personally I don't understand the fuss. If I don't think the value/quality of an item is worth the price, then I don't buy it. Same in SL as in RL. Vote with your pocketbook. Simple. Easy.

What bothers me in this thread and others is the nasty judgemental statements. People have the right to set their prices where they want to. You have the right to buy or not buy. Calling them greedy or thieves just makes you look bad.

EXACTLY.

Don't tell me how to sell and I wont tell you how to shop.

Besides, content creators and shoppers are NOT the problem with the SL economy right now. If you want to be angry at someone you can start by demanding why Linden Lab has set us in a downward spiral with an ever-growing L$ glut.

I still very dissapointed. More so I see some arguments sounding much like demanding something for nothing. I hope that not so.

Is fact that if you see something you want, you find it valuable. It is only appropriate that you trade value for it.

If they ask for greater value than you see in it, then you don't trade for it. Simplest form of economy.

But to argue they charge too much becasue there no fabrication costs is to disreguard effort put into making the items, and maintaining the stores. They offer support for items too. All ongoing effort and if you found product worth buying then you support them in thier effort - if you do not, then do not buy. Is simple.

Stop claiming greed when fact is so many do so much and ask tiny amount from us. Sound too much like entitlement.

Yeah. Let the market sort out the value of one's work. Anything else is jackassery.

Actually entitlement is greed, it's like they are saying Why can't I get my stuff for cheap / free? I want it now, you are not giving it to me cheap enough!

So I am very bewildered by the accuasation of greed especially when delivered by someone who wants something for nothing.

I love shopping, and I love giving people some L$ for encouraging them to continue their work. I wish more people appreciated how much work is done on a product. Sure you create it once, but you do customer support on it forever.

I'm sure a content creator would want to create and not do customer support, especially for a 50 cent product. My hat is off to content creators for putting up with the mean accuasations in the forums and still finding time to deliver customer support while creating new things

Everything in SL is by its definition a luxury item. We're not talking bread and bandages here. It's an entirely free market. I guess I don't know what to say beyond gtfo to anyone who's under the impression they're owed the labor of others for cheap prices.

Yea I dont really get that either. Granted to make a flex prim skirt I needed to change my style a bit, align the prims differently etc. But the process didn't take any longer than it took to make an ordinary prim skirt. So I just priced my flex prim skirts at the same price as all my other prim skirts. I set my prices based on the amount of effort I put into the product.

EDIT after reading more of the thread: I don't USUALLY price my items at only one or two L$ (with the exception of older merchandise I discontinue and mark off as freebies) because I actually do put a lot of time into a project. So when i say I set my prices based on the amount of effort I put into it, thats exactly what I mean.

I'm not counting upload fees because yes that is made back in the first sale. I'm not counting in what I believe the type of work would be worth in RL in $ because I'm not selling it for $, I'm selling it for L$. Whether or not I turn around and trade those L$ for $ is my choice and has nothing to do with my customers IMO so I dont set my prices to account for it. I simply charge what I believe the amount of time, effort, frustration, whatever is worth in SL money in this SL world.

The way I see it is this. In the real world, if I spent three days sewing a dress, pricking my fingers with needles and swearing over uneven seams until the dress was as perfect and beautiful as I expected it to be, then I might sell that dress for 250$ and feel like it was worth my time and blood.

In the SL world if I spend three hours designing a dress, clicking and moving my mouse until my wrist aches, and swearing over uneven seams with every upload until it is as perfect and beautiful as I expected it to be, then I might sell that dress for 250L$ and feel like it was worth my SL time and my carpal tunnel (dont have carpel tunnel yet ).

I disagree - in second life, as in real life - you have to cover the costs of where you are selling from. If people are unable to pay the tier for their stores they will have to re-evaluate their business plan.

Personally I've found no need to raise my prices, but if I fell underneath the threashold that it takes to maintain the land I display my pools etc. on, then I would have 2 alternatives:

1. Put out more items and hope they took off (probably needing more land to display them on)

2. Raise prices in order to still have a store.

3. Pay the excess out of pocket.


For some people, like myself - number one may not be a fantastic option - I put out things as I make them, I don't set deadlines that I 'must put out more stuff' as that leads down the slope to the 'crapfactory' - I prefer to be associated with quality things, things I actually cared about making.

Option 3 doesn't sound so hot either - the ability for my Second Life to pay for itself is the primary reason I can be so involved in it. There isn't any way that I'd be able to maintain the areas I do without that.

So that leaves us with option 2.

I've always priced my things low - because it gives me the option if needed of raising them in the future should need arise. Lucky for me, that day hasn't yet come.

Either way though - although the ability to mass produce doesn't cost in SL - the ability to functionally display or have things permanent in SL does.