You can all thank me now...

Because I have saved the SL texture market. It wasn't BoingBoing or the Lindens or the 3D modelers who told you all about GLIntercept. No, no. They were afraid of being painted as the "bad guy" and kept this secret in their shadows. It was me, Jarod Godel, who yelled, [edited], who -- having learned what I did from the LSL Virus incident -- kept pressing the issue until the Lindens couldn't ignore the problem anymore.

It was me.

I saved the texture and clothing industry.

I'm the hero.

I'm the g-d Batman!

Nah.

did you use the forum post upload content identifier to prove you were the first?

but seriously, thank you for pointing out this news. that sounds like a really good development for texture uploads and usage! this sounds like a major step towards a more productive and secure future for SL.

and i believe i do remember when you were talking about this topic awhile back..

It'll be useful for sound files as well. In fact, they could tag objects with creation dates while they're at it so people can more easily prove that they built that particular sofa looking prim arrangement first and everyone else's is a mere copy.

You are indeed damned.

LOL

This is still useless.


Cristiano makes a sting bikini, I grab the texture, fix it in PS and upload it. It is an original work, I can prove it and prodive the photoshop file layers etc.



Also, how will this stop al the people that are stealing and photosourcing to begin with?


They can't even moderate the forums, you think they can really allocate resouces to prevent texture theft?

It will create massive drama, and that will be fun, so I give it my full support.

I agree, but... photosourcing is not stealing.

Try making a dress out of some crappy jpeg you find on the net and see how easy it is not and how much of the texture is your own sweat and tears.

Stealing copyright images is stealing. Lets not go down this road again. People are stealing, we all know it. I am tired of people trying to justify it.


The point is on more than one occassion we have had multiple people photosource the same things. How will that be resolved? Drama and a Celebrity Forum Deathmatch!

Will the person who stole it first and uploaded it get to keep the stolen image?
Will both get to keep it?
Will it be removed entirely?


Ruh Roh...

I hope that SL keeps in mind that a lot of textures are from commercial and publicly available royalty-free image libraries, so just because two people are using the same image as a texture that doesn't mean one stole it from the other.

The most obvious example of this is all the different versions of Hokusai's "Great Wave at Kanagawa" I've seen in-world. This is such a well documented work that it's often been possible to figure out with a pretty high level of confidence what web-site an object's creator got their image from by looking at the flaws in the woodblock and the inking pattern. For example: the "fingers" of foam below the crest of the wave show signs of damage by boring insects, and later repair, in many prints.

Yes, that is another excellent point. I would hate to pay $10 USD for a high quality texture only to have it removed because someone else purchased it and loaded it before I did.


Again, this could be a massive timesink.

Agreed, but the one thing time stamping does help is that when CalvinKlein or Disney catch wind of someone ripping off their stuff, they can subpoena Linden Lab, get the time stamp on the image, and when they take the offender to court, they have even more proof that the image was not original -- that it was created after their copyright date.

At the very least, Linden Lab can no longer claim complete innocense when it comes to copyright theft, because now (or soon) they're offering tools to protect their userbase from it. It's not a silver bullet to stopping such theivery, but I like to think maybe it's a first step.

The solution isn't much of a solution, but, uh, thanks?

No. I don't see "proving first use in SL" as much of a solution either.

For example, about a month after I came to Second Life, I found a piece of artwork in SL that I recognised rather well - since it was an original work by me from several years previous. I used to also find textures in use in SL that I created originally for other resources. No, I didn't upload them to SL first. But I sure as hell have every right to use them if I want to!

If I have to upload every little texture and piece of art I ever published on the net or in any other resource that could potentially be ripped into SL so I can "prove first use" it's gonna cost a lot of Linden Dollars

It might help as an extra verification for the Lindens should someone be AR'd for misuse of a texture in SL that already exists elsewhere in SL, but then most of the time its going to be pretty obvious who did it first without this stamp anyway. And it certainly shouldnt be the only and indisputable measure of the 'winner'. Don't think that people wouldn't have the cheek to AR someone for using their OWN textures... it happens. Trust me!

(yes that was crossposted)

So what you are saying is this is the first step in LL becoming liable for copyright infringement?

Dear Batman,

Next episode could you please exploit and force resolution on the alpha draw order problems? Thank you in advance.

Well, I sure didn't say it...

Yes what Logan said please Mister Batman sir.

Robin did say "inworld." LL are not accepting any responsibility for what we do by making upload (data entry) timestamps visible. They're simply giving us access to data that already exsists in The Asset Server All Hail The Central Asset Server. As long as they make all relevant data from inworld transactions available to us, we can defend outselves.

No Kris, you don't have to use SL as a copyright mechanism for every texture you publish on the Internet. If someone is violating your copyright inworld using a texture you published elsewhere on the net, you'll have to prove that with data from elsewhere on the net. It still has nothing to do with LL other than them providing what relevant data can.

No, what you did was advertise a tool in the public forum that makes it FAR MORE LIKELY that someone's hard work will end up floating around free to copy. Once that happens how the hell is being able to prove first upload going to solve anything? Does LL also plan to purge all the fully permissioned copies out of the asset server? You could have addressed your concerns privately with LL but instead you chose to grandstand and put every content creator in SL at much greater risk. Gee, thanks. Your original post on the subject is the first post I've ever AR'd. It was a truly irresponsible and stupid thing to do.

Ah, I see this is already being trumpeted. No surprise I guess. To bad I didn't see this before; I just posted my own entry and would have linked to the IM log Jarod posted (of course, I would have informed him if I were going to post something from our conversation - simply out of courtesy; had our roles been reversed, not having a link wouldn't have been an issue for him).

Anyway, I'm happy to have kept my mouth shut. And when something in the future affects residents as much or more than Linden Lab, I will do so again unless there is a compelling reason to do so. In this case, I saw no compelling reason.

Is this what Prokofy means by techiwiki FIC? We know about all this stuff but don't share the information because YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH111

Clothing manufacturers et al have been bellyaching about people copying their work for years. Those threads usually devolve into stated expectations that LL should do something to protect our IP rights. Bullocks. All LL can do is provide data to us. That's what they do, database stuff. That's all they do.

We have to protect ourselves if we want, oh wait, we don't really want the responsibility that accompanies the freedom to protect ourselves do we? nm Yeah Jarod, following BoingBoing links and forum threads then warning us about possible abuse was wrong, right?

Yeah, Khamon... advertising hacking tools in a public forum (and even providing a link to where people can download it) and stating you plan to use it to destroy the clothing and skin market in SL by stealing textures and releasing them is oh so helpful. How very noble of Jarod.

Well maybe we have a terminology problem.

Stealing copyrighted images is indeed stealing. People *are* stealing, etc etc...

Photosourcing (as in "I used a photographic source I found on the net for a texture that I used for this dress.", *can* be stealing depending on trademark or copyright issues but in most cases it's not.

Real hard core, black and white stealing is what has just been enabled by the revelation of this program.

In other words until LL has time to enable the fix, one to one copying of other peoples original artwork in SL is now possible on a scale that makes two dresses photosourced from the same eBay auction photo look ridiculous in comparison.

1. Anyone who reads BoingBoing, 3D modlers' blogs, or the tiny statue thread would have found GLIntercept. You have to download it before OGLE will work. That's how I found it. I wasn't the first person to find it, I was just the first to point out the inherent dangers.

2. Yes, I threatened to destroy the market... My plan is now proceeding apace. By making the announcement I have given Linden Lab time to plan a counter-measure to my villainous scheme. Now, I must be off. I'm planning a bank robbery in Metropolis, and I need to seal all the Kryptonite in a steel box and mail it to the police.

3. You tell me how else to get Linden Lab's attention besides rampant sensationalism? The last time I tried to warn them about anything, they deleted my post. The "proper channels" for this kind of thing is bitching in the forums. It worked for viewing linked prim information, telehubs, permission systems, and now this.

May 24, 2005; 8:34AM - Link - My first post on ripping data (it spreads everywhere, including BoingBoing)
Nov 8; 2005; 12:20PM - Link - Additional information on ripping videostream data (this time relevant to SL).
Jan 24, 2006; 1:09PM - Link - Jarod's thread
Jan 24, 2006; 1:54PM - Link - Clickable Culture posts entry
Jan 24, 2006; 2:43PM - Link - Jeska Linden locks Jarod's thread
Jan 24, 2006; 7:37PM - Link - Blueman Steel's thread
Jan 24, 2006; 8:35PM - My comment on Clickable Culture's thread
Jan 24, 2006; 8:56PM - Link - My blog entry referencing Clickable Culture
Jan 24, 2006; 9:25PM - Link - My post on Blueman's thread (I didn't read Jarod's thread until a day or two later)

I'd say that I've been fairly open about my efforts. Also note two things:

1) HijackGL did not grab texture data; only geometry
2) Jarod knew of the texture ripping before I did

Given who knew what and when they knew it, the issue in my mind isn't "FIC" and sharing information, it's how loudly one screams to gain attention. I don't scream. And other than hoping to see the facility at Eyelab, I'm far from being a part of anyone's clique.

When I was growing up I was taught stealing is stealing. There really is no grey area.


Who uploaded something first is really useless in protecting people. Also, there are a lot of people that will just steal things for their person use and not sell them. They will likely never be caught.


Locks only keep honest people honest, there is no way to prevent this unless they go to a There like system of approving all textures before upload and charging more for it.