Point out inconsistencies and get punished?

This is not me sticking up for a buddy, cuz I don't know Sensual (will I get punished for mentioning her by name? )... I'm just calling it like I see it...

...and what I see is that Sensual pointed out an inconsistency in what Linden Lab say and what Linden Lab do and apparently got suspended for 3 days?

Seems a little harsh, dontcha think?

Just sayin'


Prediction: After this thread is locked for Linden review with an appropriate CoS quote, I get suspended for naming names and starting a thread questioning her punishment

Yeah, I agree, it was harsh.

All that needed to be done was to REMOVE the pictures if they were that bloody bad, what if she had put lil stars over them? Would that have been ok?

This place gets more like a joke everyday and it's becoming REALLY hard to stay optimisitic.

I was surprised to see that she recieved a suspension.

But I wonder if it was more making a second thread to bitch about the first being closed, than anything else.

oh. was it cited as being for posting pixellated nudity? So if she'd linked direct to the pictures on snapzilla instead of showing them inline she wouldn't be suspended?

You have a point Min, but seriously, how many threads that are still open have better reason to be closed?

People make second WHYYYY??? threads all the time, it's just the way the forums work, you don't get a reasonable explanation for your thread being locked and you ask why, you get ignored.. rinse, repeat.

I still think that that's counter productive. Ask the resmods or, better, Lindens for an explanation by e-mail. Pitchforks and torches are great implements. However, raising a mob on the forums every time just to ask why a thread was closed should not be "just the way forums work".

Many forums I frequent will issue a warning (and a 3 day suspension on 3rd offense) if you don't respect the TOS, including only questioning thread closure directly with the admins. I can understand the angst of seeing your favourite thread evah being closed, but get a life.

It's good for the drama rating though.

Wendel

Which ought to be the way it's done, but I think the level of anger we see in some threads is nothing more than an outcome of feeling powerless. If the Lindens (or resmods) aren't timely in their responses or send you meaningless platitudes, it doesn't help to settle the anxieties.

I agree with your take, Wendel, but there's also a human behavior explanation for why these things happen. And then there's people like me who just want the attention

I understand that. It's just not the way I choose to act. I guess some people would say I'm very (too?) slow at getting angry. I also have less invested in SL than some people. And hey, mobs and shouts and protests and burning cars seems to work for the French every time they have a grievance, right?

I still think that the true answers do not lie in those WHY! threads though. If you are not happy with a decision, question it with the people who can answer. But I guess that's just me.

Oh, and you know that you do not need such artifices to get attention. You just need to walk into a room and everybody stops talking... and rushes for the shin guards.

Carry on...

Wendel

Totaly wrong-- done.. I get scared..

Stars over parts can be added by a admin if so... or pics be taken away,.,, But ban some like this.. ohhhhh hope its Joke.. A misunderstanding!!

I feel that producing contributions to forum wil never be the same (for me).. I will alwyas from now be affraid of writing something that dont fit (for some) or show something wrong (for some) can result in a ....

Sorry LL... maybe this text can make me baned to.. who knows.,..

/Tina - EXAKT worried... scared..

Jarod was recently suspended for posting Torley's job description. It's not safe to participate in these forums if you want to maintain access to the grid.

<tinfoil>
I found out, apparently, you might, sometimes, get suspended for talking about locked threads.
</tinfoil>

Interesting...

yes and for posting links to them as well

As someone who's moderated public fora before, I have to say, (a) people are usually suspended for breaking the rules repeatedly, even after being warned, and (b) other people invariably claim people were suspended for some other reason. It's not that people are banned for criticism, it's that somehow people expect criticism to be a shield. "If I criticize, I can break every rule in the book, and they won't suspend me because if they do that, it'll look like they're suspending me for being critical of them." The sad thing is, that actually works with some mods, but it never worked with me, so I was constantly taking flak for closing threads or banning people for all kinds of bullshit reasons, none of which were true.

Thus, I take these kinds of threads with a grain of salt. (Or five tons of heavily iodized salt... )

*sighs* It used to not be like this... sometimes the drama was worse, sure, but usually, you got a reason for why threads were locked, even if it was obvious why! This... is silly, frankly. As I said, if it was the images, then they should have IM'd Sensual to remove and/or edit them rather than locking the thread and then issue a warning if she hadn't followed through.

Locking the thread proved that the Lindens (or the resmods, who represent the Lindens in the forums) don't trust posters to fix their own mistakes, as far as I'm concerned. And why not post a thread asking why? After all, how many of us recieve answers from them? They don't trust us, and now, I'm not sure I can trust them, when it comes to the forums. Great to demand that we follow the guidelines, but why not follow them too?

Is there any guidelines on what kind of punishments and procedures for the resmods and the Lindens to follow, so that we, the common player/poster, can know what to expect from them?

Community Standards - http://secondlife.com/corporate/cs.php

Global Standards, Local Ratings
All areas of Second Life, including the www.secondlife.com website and the Second Life Forums, adhere to the same Community Standards. Locations within Second Life are noted as Safe or Unsafe and rated Mature (M) or non-Mature (PG), and behavior must conform to the local ratings. Any unrated area of Second Life or the Second Life website should be considered non-Mature (PG).

If someone is breaking the rules... they're breaking the rules. It might, at times, seem unfair. While many people feel that their freedoms are being assaulted when a thread gets deleted, and the poster is suspended/banned, the simple fact of the matter is this...

LindenLabs owns SecondLife, and the SecondLife website. This, of course, includes the forums. They have the right to moderate the content posted on their servers as they please, and if we, as SL residents, wish to use their website... we must follow their rules.

And that is all very well, all that people are requesting, is a little bit of consistency when moderating/suspending/whatevering.

I can agree to that. Of course, different people will have different opinions about whether or not a particular punishment is consistant.

Sensual has been around long enough to know that people browsing the forums from work or with kids around them don't expect a huge tits popping up on their screen while reading the forums. SL itself is another matter but lots of people access the forum when they aren't in a position to go in. Why the heck are you so sure that someone in that position didn't AR the thread to begin with? I'm allowed to access the net at work but not sites with such material, cartoonish or not. Many sites are automatically blocked but I "agree" not to access innapropriate stuff every time I log on (in the same way I agreed to SL's TOS when I logged in there). I have more privacy at work than many but I can definitely see how others would be placed in a spot due to her decision to disregard the rules. Someone new might not know but would be expected to rectify the situation when informed (and having alterations made to the photo is not LL's job nor should it be). Even after Sensual was made aware of the problem, no attempt was made to remove or alter or have the pics accessed via a link. Although she did point out that she would have done something if the ResMod had asked her nicely. What a pouty little position to take. Oh, grow up. You take your chances when you stick your ass out on whether or not it will be kissed or kicked. You've always had the fortitude to be held acountable for your posts, Kris. To try to paint Sensual out to be the victim of being punished for criticizing LL is just drahma.

p.s. Yes, I realize that I have just presented an excellent reason for many people who would definitely not miss my posts to push for the forums to be mature.

I would hate to see the forums go mature... I won't be able to access them from work if digi-naughties are flying everywhere. lol

I agree with Gaius, I admin/moderate forums for another site and it generally takes a pretty large amount of bad behavior to get your butt banned, and I'm not talking about criticism, I'm talking about consistently ignoring warnings, clearly posted rules, polite requests, attacking others, etc... Usually by the time I have to take action there have been multiple complaints from other forum members and I've privately warned the person at least two times to discontinue the behavior. An unfortunate problem that has developed in foums all over the intarwebs is that anonymity breeds bad behavior. All it takes is one person diving into the well of personal attacks, ad hominem and hyperbole and suddenly the floodgates have been opened and the thread ends up being closed. If more people would follow two basic forum rules there would be a lot less trauma:

1) DON'T FEED THE TROLLS
2) Unless it is a verifiable fact, it is only your opinion. There is a big difference between "You are an a**hole" and "Personally, I think you acting like an a**hole." The first will provoke retaliation every time, the second much less so. If you want someone to actually listen to your criticism, then criticize the behavior, not the person.

link pls kthxbye!

I didn't know most of what you outlined as the course of events. But the irony of course is that if what LL assured us was true was actually true, she wouldn't have been able to post the picture in the first place. Which I think is what her point was. I think I'd have handled it exactly the same way

And I will continue to argue til I'm blue in the face that nekkie avatars is NOT NUDITY any more than a nekkie Barbie Doll is.

Actually, if you wanna see drahma, lets just start another age play thread so we can continue back and forth with ever increasing personal attacks on whether nekkie child avies are child porn and whether two consenting adults can engage in paedophilia?

When LL or a resmod locks a thread, a reason is given. Like it or not, that is the "official" position.

Posting another thread "asking why?" is reduntant. The rules say you can't do it, so don't.

To do so, risks a trip to the corn.

The problem was, the resmod didn't post a reason at all until the Why? thread.

I'd love to see a set of guidelines that the resmods have to follow, as we have to follow the Community Standards. Also, a guideline for what hoops we have to jump through if we think something done by the resmods is unfair.

In the case of Sensual, there was no reason posted by the resmod concerning the locking of the thread. It was just, "Locked for Linden Review." If it had been the pictures, then shouldn't they have IM'd OP to edit/remove the images, along with stating the imappropriate images are against the CS? Sometimes, people don't realize that something isn't technically against the CS, but they are willing to go with the rules, if notified of the situation. The OP could have edited/removed and life could have gone on without suspension/banning.

So, frankly, all I want is consistancy and a bit of fairness. Now, I will agree that the Why thread shouldn't have been done, and that Sens should have IM'd the resmod or a Linden.. *sigh* But I've lost a lot of faith in the game recently... correction, a lot of faith in many of the people behind the game. There is nothing really wrong with the game itself.