Here I go again: Better privacy-to-passerby balance.

A sociopath is a mentally ill and potentially dangerous person who doesn't care about his/her impact on the society around them.

I think you mean antisocial, as in someone who tends to avoid contact with the others.

I think across a few threads there are some consensus ideas:

1. Keep the Ban limit up to 200m (or even higher) for individuals on the banned list
   
2. Take the "privacy" limit back down to 40m or so to allow innocent exploring
   
3. Prevent entry and creation of objects by banned individuals
   
4. Prevent physical force from banned individuals
   
5. Block scripts owned by banned individuals
   
6. (one of my own) Suppress Chat messages from banned individuals. Could be an option.
   

Are any of these that hard to code? I presume raising the existing ban height was trivial, probably just a CONST value that could be tweaked for the rebuild. We clearly need better granularity than that.
Doesn't solve the clone-Alt problem of course.

Claiming sociopathy is hateful.

I didn't call you one and should have used anti social instead. However I have meet griefers that have meet that description!
Always claim that Nova should give me a refund!

Why do you think the sim would have a problem with negative offsets? It currently handles objects and avatars at negative offsets just fine. If you find a good world edge and play with large sit offsets you can avoid the ground-lock on the camera and play around there yourself.

The hard part is likely to be the interest list changes to allow you to render part of the world invisible. There's all kinds of rules and exceptions in there and the glitches as they brought occlusion culling in on the preview. And unfortunately occlusion culling tself doesn't help, because it only culls inactive prims. For this they'd have to cull everything.

And using negative offsets would let you avoid that... you could simply place each parcel's basement volume at a different offset, leaving at least 100m gap between them. That way they'd be beyond sensor and shout range of each other, lights are limited to 20m now so they're not a problem any more, and putting virtual invisiprims around the volume would let occlusion culling do the rest of the job.

Yes, there would probably be scripts that would break. I've got some like that myself. But it'd be worth it to get real privacy. But I really think it would be easier on the back end...

I have to disagree... mostly becasue of the question "What happens when you fall?"
But i don't claim expertise there either.

I'd kinda still prefer to have the server do the blocking so that adjacent parcels can have thier private spaces rigth beside one another without crosstalk. I'm thinking of the 512 meter folks here. Not everyone can buffer thier land.

IN the end, whatever it takes to get real privacy so we can clear the land of "global" ban lines and needlessly harsh security scripts while giving the users of said something better.

Tangental thought here,
What if instead of a floating pocket universe on the grid you take it completely off the grid.

Give each person (premium account) the ability to spawn/host a mini universe (say 1024x1024x2048 4-500 prims) and have the ability to teleport 5-6 friends in. the pocket universe would be only available when the owner is online as it is 'hosted' by that player.

The asset server still provides content etc but chat and local physics & scripts are provided/run by the hosting player. This would keep major social gatherings & events etc on the grid and allow you to test risky code without melting a whole sim.

So every premium owner would get a private 'treehouse' in which to work / hang out in and not have to have the floating clutter that gluts the grid right now. Making the world a prettier place.

I think it's a good idea - is it possible?

The way I see it, there would be a teleporter on my land that would TP me to the space. I could program the TP access. Entering the space might be set up so it's like going through a portal into a room, getting into an elevator that decends into a basement, stepping into a sacred pool that sends one to another time, etc., etc. It doesn't need to be large.

Exploring and flying are exceedingly important. I think most people are crazy with the restricted access/ban lines because they want a little privacy. I'd like to see Jillian's pocket universes, and the end of restricted access altogether.

A pocket universe that does not affect the main grid is a good idea. Linden Labs can charge a small fee for the service perhaps in the form of Lindens to create a another sink. I dont have any problems with the Jet Girl's thought however anything that makes sl more ugly does not get my support. However this seems like a win win. I miss exploring and flying........

Careful here, I'm certain that LL's business model is based at least partly on hosting of shared space on their servers. There are at least two projects I am aware of that are based on peer-to-peer construction of shared worlds (including a side project of a certain multi-perma-banned user) but I seriously doubt that this issue would be worth the technical and business barriers that would have to be crossed.

I really like the idea of 'virtual private sims'

It seems that LL has a reasonably easy time of moving sims from server to server, why couldn't they have virtual sims come online and vanish 'on demand' instead of always there? Particularly if they're not connected to the grid.

Buy a 'virtual sim', set your prim and guest limit by setting how much tier you want to dedicate to your virtual space.

Use the "My Land" menu to pick and teleport to your virtual sim. (forbid creating landmarks there because who knows where the sim will come up in the future)

If the sim isn't already online, the teleport takes a few moments longer while it loads the world data from disk.

Then invite in whomever it is you wish. Build as you like. When the sim spins down again after the last visitor leaves it's all saved away safely until the next visit.

No-Copy items not owned by the virtual sim owner should probably be returned to their owners when the sim spins down, because they won't be able to return to collect them on their own later.

If the owner logs or leaves the virtual sim, have a spin-down timer depending on tier. (longer for more tier, obviously) so that guests could remain for a while even if their host departs.

It probably doesn't make sense to have a full sim tier tied to a 'virtual' sim, when you could use a normal private sim just as easily. I think it'd be very appealing in the quarter and eight sim sizes though.


Even with reduced prim limits, resticted guest limits, something like a private virtual island in the 1/8th sim range would be a great way to give potential full sim owners a taste. It would also allow someone to start small and build up to a full private sim. (It should be trivial to make a temporary virtual sim into a permanent private sim after all, when someone is finally ready to pay full sim tier for it!)

LL can still follow the model of auctioning off large numbers of virtual sims to middlemen to re-sell to individuals. Virtual private sim owners should probably have the full range of estate tools, though obviously some of the controls may have no meaning if folks can't get in without invitation.

Naturally, the downside would be that during peak hours, you might not be guaranteed a server slot to host your virtual private sim.


Anyway. I'm rambling.

I'd assume it would be the same thing that happens when you walk off the edge of a sim with no "ground" under you... there's a kind of spongy force-field that pushes you back. The bottom of the basement zone could work the same way.

I wasn't suggesting that the server *not* do the blocking, I was suggesting a mechanism that Linden Labs could use to implement blocking underground, if the interest list turned out to make things too hard to implement using parcel walls.

Two 512m parcels next to each other would have their zones at (say) -576 to -512, and -704 to -768, giving each a 32x16x64 private volume 128 meters away from each other. Additional zones would be staggered deeper.

If this turned out to be unnecessary, and everyone could have their parcel's area from -768 to -512, that would be even better.

As an alternative that would be easier to implement and more profitable for Linden Labs... now they have void sims, you could have people rent space on a partitioned void sim by paying a premium of 1/4 the tier of your parcel for an underground with 'void sim' level limits but the same area as your main parcel. The void sim would have llRegionCorner set to some vertical offset from the main sim. That way the local coordinates would remain zero-based, and the global coordinates would be consistent with an "underground" or "sky" region... but you wouldn't run into it.

Would you tier up to get privacy (and a few extra prims)?

That would either require the overhead of an extra simulator (expensive!) just for that universe, or it'd be another presentation of Jillian's and my idea with the 'mini universe' at some offset from baseline.

If you want total privacy you should pay something extra for it. I dont need the feature so dont think I should have to pay for it. It does not have to be alot.

Well LL's doing a shadow of what Jillian's proposed, and I'm happy. One of the anti-griefing tools coming up will at least help landowners. A switch will prevent outside pushes from hitting anything on their land.

This should kill off a large chunk of griefer enthusiasm because unlike people with no land, a landowner can't just transfer to another sim on a whim. Griefers will lose their non-moving targets.

I'm not sure how they're implementing it but if I don't miss my guess it will use the same approach that can make the pocketspace (you're unreachable while being right there in front of them) a reality.

Actually, that's no longer true. Going in to God Mode allows you to have unlimited camera zoom. It really should only be a builder assistant tool, to help with large builds outside of the normal SL bounds, but wanted to point out the current state of affairs.

Here's a related thread.