Non-Profit Grid?

That's Star Trek, that's not socialism....

Pretty much.

Beta also had a shitty land ownership and prim management method and a word the size of a matchbox, and an uncertain future.

The rest is up to us.

LL isn't in the business of making everyone sit around a fire singing camp songs.

The United Federation of Planets is a socialist society. It's gone beyond any socialist society on Earth today, in that they've eliminated money completely. The only money that shows up is in the hands of throwback capitalists like the Ferengi, or on the frontier.

OK. But I took them seriously when they wrote the articles in Terra Nova and other outlets about structuring a "community".

My mistake?

(_|_)

I'm not a total expert on internet communites, but it seems like the best communites seem to just "happen", while a community that is planned and structured for "best growth and community feel" from the start fail miserly, and feel stale and bland.

I think you're likely engaging in some heavy paraphrasing at the very least.

I'll entertain this further if you provide some actual quotes. Also bear in mind that LL is a company selling a product, so you're going to see some marketspeak. As we all know, LL, and hence SL, would not be around if not for commercialism and capitalism. If LL is providing any sort of community -- it is a community that enables and encourages us to create our own sub-communities.

I've been around for 3 years now, and the message I've gotten from LL is that they provide us with the tools to build communities. In fact, just as is the case in real life, the greater mass of the world's populace is a collection of communities.

In SL, over time, we've seen communities emerge -- political, religious, furry, Gorean, fantasy role-playing, et al. I think this is why LL gave us many of the things you label as "toys" -- private island sims at the forefront.

See this entry in Philip's personal blog and the related comments for more:
http://secondlife.blogs.com/philip/2005/12/country_or_plaf.html#more

The tag line is, after all, "Your world, your imagination". We are charged with building not only most of the physical content, but also the communities themselves. This is not your typical MMORPG, where the company is in the business of structuring the community by setting up a predefined infrastructure. I have nothing against those sort of games, and in fact have a World of Warcraft account. I go there when I am in the mood for a more structured and linear environment.

Overall though, I prefer the open-ended, non-linear freedom SL represents. "You guys are elves, and you guys are orcs", and so forth is fun for me for a while, but I much prefer defining myself and finding my own place in the world.

I for one would not be happy if LL started trying to define and enforce a greater community upon us. It's just not scalable, and people (especially the plethora of individualists you find within SL) don't like being herded.

So if some like-minded folks want to make "Barter System Island", that's wonderful, but the day LL makes a special communal grid for them, is the day that every other sect is going to demand the same, which is, again, not scalable, and not financially prudent. LL is, at its very core, a business, despite the wishes of of some that they should spend their money to make us happy on a case-by-case basis.

In closing, it is my opinion that SL outgrew one cohesive community a couple of years ago (if there ever really was one), that it wouldn't be in anyone's best interest to go down that road, that it's basically impossible given human nature, and that it would stifle progress.

Edit to add - I agree with Talon above.

Here's an easy way to not have to deal with money in SL.



You ready? Check this out.



Don't use money. Don't want things that cost money. Then the money situation doesn't matter to you.


Oh, but you want to be able to have things that are valued in money? What about the people who created those things? Do their interests not count?

Theirs is to serve, while yours is to want? Is that it? You'd like to barter with them, you say, so that money isn't necessary? What's stopping you now? Barter away. Your next deal is just an IM away. What if they don't want to barter? What if they want to work their asses off the pay their bills for the month?

If they can find a buyer, they are entitled to do just that. And you are entitled not to participate. You can build things yourself.

And never worry about money. It's a personal choice.

Fact:*

There is no longer such a limit.

*assuming a Linden's own blog can be believed, and assuming further that I read it right.

coco

pay no attention to the man behind the podium... look at what they do, not what they say.

They don't provide mechanisms for enforcing contracts, and they make it hazardous to invite people into a landholding group... but they just gave me the ability to create a garden of carnivorous plants to worship Stillpink Sandgrain's hippofly wings! I can't wait until that's available in the main grid.

Actually, I'm not so much trying to paraphrase as to
Living in this whatever-it-is long enough, I think people lose
terrain.
politicized virtual environments
"anarchy"
informal level. I do find
highly ritualized.

I read with interest the
fractured American urban environment. You may have once enjoyed the
disconnected, alienated sprawl

In short, I'm not sure how you would define
easy - everybody wants those.
drama and conflict in SL and its forums almost always revolves around
the Lindens often focus on in many of their white

puzzling
Because
the difference between SL and
an immersive community.

On edit: There. That's better!

No, there's not. Thank God, I really didn't want to give up my robot business when --

I mean.

Uh.

Snakes on a plane!

nice shiny toys means more dedicated players and creators. sl is overall more fun now than it ever was before. it gets better every day.

adding USD commercialization to the social sphere was the best thing that happened to sl. true, there was a time we got pats on our back for making bobble toys in SL. however the incentive of USD has raised the bar and noone will pat us on the back for attaching three spheres together to make a snowman. i guess if i didn't want to grow past 3 prim snowmen to earn accolades, i would lament for beta.

nice shiny toys means more dedicated players and creators. sl is overall more fun now than it ever was before. it's bigger and more diverse. it gets better every day.

adding USD commercialization to the social sphere was the best thing that happened to sl. true, there was a time we got pats on our back for making bobble toys in SL. however the incentive of USD has raised the bar and noone will pat us on the back for attaching three spheres together to make a snowman. i guess if i didn't want to grow past 3 prim snowmen to earn accolades, i would lament for beta.

Dude. In beta we would probably have made our snowmen out of 500 prims and not even link them together
Then our neighbors would call us prim hogs and retaliate by rezzing 30 different chairs so as to reserve some prims for them. But they would get very angry if someone accused THEM of hogging prims, cuz they were just acting in self defense.

Hey there is nothing wrong with my rezzing 200 prim book shelves to preserve prims for the yacht I'm having built

Briana Dawson

I can rotate some plants.

( . )( . )

This is your idea of rotating plants?

Good points

Same way the main grid is "policed" inconsistanly. Real answer, hold ppl to the tos and cs just like on the main grid. I guess when it comes to the barter system and such fake dollars could be used. Such as Hippo bucks. But there would be no system in place to cash in or buy for us$. You know it's called a game, ppl dig that sort of thing. Ask those playing sims, wow, guild wars... That do not cash out.

Or think back to what sl was like before money became an issue.



Cat

Really, I honestly think it made a bunch of mean self centered greedy mother fuckers.

Sure, a non-profit grid sounds idyllic...until one moves into your neighborhood. Suddenly there are panhandlers in every doorway on your street.
"Hey man, upload a texture for me? I wouldn't ask for it if I didn't need it real bad."
"A rich guy like you must have a ton of prefabs in his inventory...be a sport and gimme one, you won't even notice it's gone. C'mon moneybags, cough it up."
"Brother, can you spare a skin?"

Um the only thing that would be different would be no rl cash. Fake money per week you know like the old stippends used to be. Since LL prints the fake cash there would be no real limits except perhaps they could make a decent economy on that grid. You know start the folks out right. Same limits on prims, uploads and such. If you take away the incentive to "cash out for rl$" you take away the ugliness of greed, and "anything for a buck".

Sounds like a game doesn't it? If there is a need to percieve SL like a game, then I say give ppl that oppertunity also. It would be much better than being bitched out in the forums for calling it a game, or treating sl like a game. Which I'm real sick of hearing from mr/ms wanna be a buck 10 an hour business person. So yeah I would move to that grid too.