Governor Linden slanders my business

I would not expect Anshe to come here and defend those other builds that were mentioned. As they do not affect her self-interests. I'm not saying that is bad or good, just that I would not expect less from her.

And personally, I have yet to visit the infohubs. I doubt I will often. But if they ever install a game that involves seeking clues at the hubs to move on, then I'd visit!

I think I'm running out of analogies, lol. I'll try a visual one.

But okay, let's consider the fan sites page. Let's say everybody with a fan site can be listed on that page, something that looks like this:

[left]John Gotti's Missing SL Fan Page[/left]
[left]Joe Bazooka's Second Life Bubble Gum Site[/left]
[left]Pamela Andersons Inflated Second Life Opinions[/left]

. . . etc.

Or - something that looks like this:

[left]Linden Information!!!!![/left]
[left]Coco's Very Special Website (Lindens are not responsible for the other content on this site.)[/left]

John Gotti's Missing SL Fan Page
Joe Bazooka's Second Life Bubble Gum Site
Pamela Andersons Inflated Second Life Opinions

. . . etc.

coco

I do see what you mean, but I don't think it applies. What we >seem< to have currently is one "fan site" that sits in the middle of an otherwise blank page. So what if it chooses to have a bright red point 5 font? As far as I can tell, there are no other “links” at all.

Ex:
[left]The Only One of It’s Kind (Also featuring official Linden information!)[/left]

If Infonet continues, in the months to come to be the only source of news and user editorials provided at Infohubs then I can agree that it seems biased, or at least irresponsible to let one company alone be endorsed as an official news source. If Linden does continue to put up user content (including news, editorials, and freebies) from other sources however, how can we complain that one group was first?

Does anyone know if there is a Second Life newsgroup, magazine, etc trying to contact Linden about space in the Infohubs at all? You can’t blame Infonet for being the only source if no one else is trying to compete (read: share their resources) can you?

Sorry to disagree but Mahulu has been a terrible "teletrap" since the day it was built. I constantly get caught in a box from not going up high enough or angling in slightly the wrong direction when trying to escape it. My best recollection is that you did not buy that mall, you bought the land and built there.

Also, while I applaud your reforestry efforts ... some of your teams got a little carried away with the "drag and drop" work on the trees and shrubs and ended up with plants in other peoples land, and in the Linden roadways. (You can indeed get plants onto land you dont own when you push them there. and its easy to do when you are doing large scale drag and drop.)

And finally, I have to point out that "ugly mall" is a matter of opinion ... it is one opinion that a platform built on the side of a volcano with 3-sided boxes stacked on it, all facing the telehub, is not ugly. That opinion is not universally shared.

I don't personally see what the problem is. You aren't personally mentioned in Second Hell. Yeah, Warmouth is mentioned, but then again, it IS an ugly mall. Not only that, but it is only one of several mentioned locations.

Not only are you not mentioned, but even if someone did make the link between that ugly mall and you, what does it matter? You are already one of the most famous people in SL, and as such about 90% of the population has already formed an opinion about you, an opinion that is not likely to be affected by one article mentioning one mall on one of the many properties you own.

Third, it's not Governer Linden that is slandering your work (as a matter of fact, your work isn't being slandered at all, but I already made that point), because Governer Linden didn't make the article. Not even Infohub is to blame here. No, if you want to point fingers, track down the writer. To read the Second Hell article that one of your lands are -barely- mentioned in, you have to go through two disclaimers, one saying "Linden Lab is not responsible for the content on this hub" and the other stating the same about InfoNet. A nice waiver to would-be complainers.

Concerning none of your good works being advertised... look at what we are talking about: Second HELL. HELL. HELL is the operative term here. Why would a beautiful construction be listed in the list that documents the worst places in SL? It is contradictory by definition.

See, it strikes me that you think you are entitled to special priveledges because you have a prosperous land business. Sorry, Queen Anshe, but I'm afraid you're just going to have to put up with bad publicity like the rest of us lowly peons.

None of her good works are being advertised because she didn't pay GNAT to advertise it. InfoNET isn't a free public directory like finder. I think she's just peaved she has to pay for advertising.


After reading alot of Anshe's threads I agree with this statement.

Why should anyone have to put up with libel in the Welcome Area? I think Coco is on to something. Is every resident in SL being given equal access to this? Why not make a bullitinboard or something where each person could post instantly then, instead of a thing that requires going through the processes of a private SL org? Why not make it instant and true equal access? That I could support so long as someone took down the libelous graffiti now and then (namecalling in spraypaint isn't and shouldn't be accepted as appropriate public discourse).

Yep, but "The Only One of Its Kind" is even worse, lol.

And yes - other people can get on the Newspapers sandwich boards.

You still don't pick one service and decide to promote it above all the others, just because it's handy. No one can convince me that the Lindens couldn't make this "service" for the welcome areas and infohub lands themselves.

And so they should.

None of this is Infonet's fault. (All they have done is to take the offer given them, and not understand how it is unprincipled to do so.)

All of this is Lindens' error.

Get the Infonet OFF Linden Lands, or simply list it along with everyone else who wants to be listed - in the SAME kiosk or bulletin board.

coco

Which is the other part of the problem.

Why should we have to pay an individual resident in order to be featured under a special kiosk that is titled "Linden Information"?

We shouldn't.

coco

You act like this has changed in light of the infoHUBs. InfoNET has always been this way. Maintance isn't cheap ya know and honestly, GNATs prices and directory service is more fair then the current ingame classifieds. I never advertised on the telehubs, but knowing LL's habits I doubt they were free to begin with. So whats the big deal with paying a resident instead of LL? You can claim LL is impartial all you want, but seriously you can't tell me LL is impartial when it comes to big spenders in SL (remember that one 1.7.0 patch? The "Wells Fargo" patch?).

You say "other people can get on the Newspapers sandwich boards," but perhaps when it's all said and done representation will be more equal and fair than we are predicting it might be. And if not, ask for it to be! Some people didn't want Infohubs, they were implemented anyway. Fighting against something Linden supports isn't as likely to work as asking for them to use it in a different way.

I think the only reason its “The Only One if it’s Kind” is that they can’t find anything else to compare. We (of the forums at least) often spend more time angry over what we’ve got than suggesting better alternatives. Maybe build better alternatives? I know I don’t have the scripting skill.

Instead of saying "get rid of Infonet,” which makes me think "remove user created content support!"not intended as a slippery slope comment, I promise), why don't those who have worries ask, petition, cry out for the assurance of equal advertisement?

Don't try kill one useful invention because we aren't sure what other items will one day be represented. =(



Let the Lindens know you want to see more center piece items set up like the InfoNet terminals, unless they are planning to sell Infohub land they seem to have way more space (from what I've seen) than they can fill with the content they currently have.

Given that LL has reached new heights of randomness and desperation, I suggest divesting yourself of as many in-game assets as possible.

I've been watching this firm for 2.5 years, tried to aid them for 1.5, have seen my share of tech start-up failures, and this just don't look good.

For those who want to call me chicken little, please knock yourselves out. I actually hope I'm mistaken, so if someone has some quantitative, verifiable measure that this is not a sinking ship, I'd really love to see it. And no, number of active accounts on the big board is not verifiable nor proof that any additional revenue is coming in.

Actually, during the Community Roundtable meeting last week, they said it was just InfoNet. Katt Kongo was present (Hi Katt!) and stated she's like to put Metaverse Messenger there, and I mentioned I had a distrubtion network that could be used for Lindens to give out free items, but we were not considered.

Just an FYI.

-Flip

Ginko? Hmmm.....


Whine when it's YOU, but it's ok when you do it to other businesses.


I don't feel sorry for you at all.

Let me state first off that this isn't libel nor slander.

Libel: a false and malicious publication printed for the purpose of defaming a living person

Two things that make this not libel:

1.) It never once mentions Anshe or any of the other owners of the land as to which they're talking about.

2.) What it says is absolutely true, and it even provides picture support to back it up, showing pictures of 30 meter signs and giant malls looming over the telehubs.

Did you even read the article?

And that bulletin board wouldn't work because within 30 minutes you'd have advertisements for every club in SL right besides posting of "alhdinsieoihiohfioshf" and "u r a ass lmao!!!1". Atleast Infonet has some amount of control to it.

And Coco, it's NOT under Linden information. Linden information is under a different section, it's under residential information.

my concern is with actions aside from this one particular article. My concern is with past actions (libeling Dione for example) and planned actions (worst of lists for creators).

I will be watching over the coming weeks, for sure, to see what else happens, but if we get a continuation of SL Tourbus to Hell for designers, I know for certain that InfoNet will never get any of my business, nor my recommendations.

It absolutely is, unless I'm remembering the whole thing wrong.

What I saw was a board that says "Linden Information" on it, plain as day.

Inside that board is Infonet. Plus this and that disclaimer. Then within Infonet you select Linden messages.

Therefore the whole dang thing is literally under "Linden Information."

What do you mean, did I even read the article? And there is no such thing as somebody's opinion about the best and worst places being "absolutely true."

And even if it WERE absolutely true, to say so on the Linden sign, under Linden information, on official Linden lands, such as the Welcome and Telehub areas, is a travesty I can't believe. I think this travesty should be publicized.

coco

Considering that the Dione article was taken down because of that, do you think that's a real concern? I'd be more concerned if it WASN'T taken down. The fact that they did atleast shows that they care about checking facts and will take down articles if it's pushing it.

However the article about people scoops and giant signs isn't pushing it at all.

Seems to me that Infonet is running well under public scrutiny so far. Caving to public demands when they're wrong and holding strong when they're right. I'd be more disapointed with Infonet if they took down that article (because of public demands that is, and not because it's just an outdated subject).

So far I see nothing wrong with Infonet and really I think that the only thing they NEED to do is get some more articles and updates on there.

As it stands for Infonets the Welcome Area, I've seen the people who go to the welcome area, and I know that if I were to have joined SL for the first time today, logged in and saw THAT; that I would have logged off in a minute, uninstalled SL and cancelled my subscription. I doubt seeing a few not so-shiny and happy articles about bad parts of SL buried in a terminal can do any worse than what all the WA hang outs have already done.

After all, why dig through a terminal like infonet to read about some of the bad places in SL when on your first day you rez into one of the worst?

Hasn't this thread been closed yet?

Hmm have to see what I can do.....

Maybe a new thread -- ANC$HE CHUNG LIBELS GUV'NA LINDEN!!!! OMGWTFZORZPr0N!'

I can possibly understand people being angry, but I'm not sure about this loose use of "libel" and "libelling". Speaking as a new resident, I agree with much of what was written on the InfoNet --- whether the Linden's should or should not be sanctioning it is another debate entirely.

Its the new and improved 'internet libel' basically where anything said about you that you don't like is 'SLANDEROUSLIBELOMGWTFZORZ!1111!!elevenPr0N!'

The good thing about it is that you don't need a lawyer - all you need is a well placed 'fuck off, idiot'

Yeah, it's under a sign that says Linden information. And one could defer that this was Linden Information. Well until you actually use it, then the disclaimer makes it abundantly clear that it's written by residents and Lindens don't claim responsibility for it.

I was talking to Persephone when I said "did you even read the article?", though I should ask if you did too since you seem to believe that the article was pointing out the worst places in SL. But it was actually pointing and sleezy and obtrusive business tactics such as gigantic signs and "people-scoop" malls, then had pictures of certain malls including anshes and signs that did this.

I honestly don't see the travesty here. I see Anshe getting in her classic huff because it effects her indirectly (though isn't it interesting that no one else who owned a mall mentioned in that article has as of yet seemed to give a damn?), and then a few people calling it horrible because it's Libel or for unexplained reasons but both of which seem to link back to Anshe getting in a huff in the first place.

Indeed, and there is a debate there since while I think the infonet idea is rather neat and I look forward to seeing how it'll flesh out, I wonder if LL made this decision too fast.

I think it's agreed at this point that there's nothing wrong with the anshe article in terms of libel or "governor linden slanders my business".

So let's leave that topic behind now.

So pros and cons of these infohub terminals:

Pros:

It gives an in-world information station where people can get an idea of what's going on in the world without having to leave the game for a website.

It does something still useful with the telehub lands besides selling them.

Linden announcements can be placed there, such as scheduled down times, newbie help, job openings, linden events such as mentoring and burning life.

Can maybe post New World Notes articles on there and have it be a unbiased glimpse of SL life too

Cons:

The residential side of infonet still seems to run through Squagmire and that group

The residential side could be taken as linden truth by less-observant residents such as the now infamous "second hell tourbus"

It seems because of the Squagmire group still in control, it's treated like a real business which means that advertisements and people who want to get on infonet have to pay to be there.

Because of the last point it singles out a business more than any other one by giving them official linden land in popular places like the WA

My Solutions to the cons:

Take the infohub terminals out of the hands of Squagmire and put it into the hands of the Lindens. The content therein would be controlled by a liason, but not created by said liason. He would simply accept new articles, put them under review and decide whether they can be put up or not. This would make the service free, unbiased to any particular group (despite prokofian FIC revelations), and make it truly "Linden (approved) information". Advertisements could still be in Infonet, they would just pipe them through the classified section.

The only con in that and probably the reason it won't happen is that it would take one liason from their job of whatever they do in SL to do this which would mean extra-money on LL's part to run this thing.

That's pretty much what this is all about in my opinion.

LL will do things in their own self-interest and in the interest of their "favorites" in SL. LL is not unbiased, even towards it's largest single customer.