Also, in order for many of us to still make informed decisions, script limits and such NEED to be laid out. Its once again, not good business to hold us in wait while you decide after you see what we do....
Thanks!
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Open Spaces Announcement & Talk with M and Jack Linden |
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Poppyseed Poppy
Registered User
Join date: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 22
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11-05-2008 11:16
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Play Pool
Disney as hell
Join date: 16 Aug 2008
Posts: 14
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No changes
11-05-2008 11:16
This makes no sense. 99% of the people will pay 125 from july or even more for business. Its not an better, we all know hardly anyone has a void type space anyway. Linden labs knew it too, long before openspaces were sold separately, they were already used residental (like Dreamland).
Sugar coating and sweet words, that´s all. But luckily there for linden Labs there are anough people dumb enough to be happy with this deline, even though you´ll still be paying the same increase AND get annoying limitations. I don't get it. |
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kramer Snookums
Registered User
Join date: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 12
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Still Try to Figure This Out
11-05-2008 11:16
well their message still isnt clear as to how many avys are going to be allowed on Open sims and how many prims there will be,Also how many prims and avatars will be allowed on the new "Homestead" Regions.We still have a bunch of unanswered questions
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Leo Mill
Registered User
Join date: 7 May 2006
Posts: 14
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11-05-2008 11:16
I agree with this post , Being able to buy a Homestead direct ( cut out the middle man ) from LL would solve a lot of problems , Prim limits is allways a sore subject ...you can never have enough prims...But if LL was to offer a limited avatar 3000+ prims homestead bought direct from LL ... they would sell like hotcakes at $95 a month . 125 a month. |
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Viktoria Dovgal
…
Join date: 29 Jul 2007
Posts: 3,593
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11-05-2008 11:16
What about those of us where the only choice that will work--and that we can afford--is to convert our openspaces back to full sims? It would be very considerate if Linden Labs would waive the $100 conversion fee for a limited time, given the circumstances that have brought about this change in policy. They have, until January. Check out that table at the bottom of the KB article linked in M's post. |
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Conrod Lane
Registered User
Join date: 11 Jun 2007
Posts: 8
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Not to be trusted
11-05-2008 11:17
LL why did you double the original prim limit on the open space sims if you know they could not surport it ? hmmm let me think not to make it more attractive for resident to buy and rent them ?
do not trust these guys. !!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Spacexcape Bridges
pissed off
Join date: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 104
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Thank you to M and J Linden
11-05-2008 11:17
Truly, thank you! This is a much more sensible result.
Unfortunately, too late for the Spacexcape Project. By announcing the way that you did, you drove away my tenants before I could make any changes and thus you destroyed my revenue stream that supported the project. It took me weeks to find those tenants (I did not come here to be a landlord) and I believe that we could have maintained a change as you suggest had you not been so radically unfair. It will take weeks for the situation to settle down in SL and I cannot foot my own bill. I have announced the closure of the Spacexcape Project as a result of your premature and, I have to say, very foolish announcement. This has to be an example of one of the worst PR exercises ever seen. My negative attitude towards Linden Labs will continue as the cost of my stupid support of you is recognised through my personal debts. The Spacexcape Project will be back. But not on Linden Labs servers! Good luck all. http://spacexcape.com _____________________
Spacexcape Bridges
_________________ Project Co-ordinator for the Spacexcape Project http://slurl.com/secondlife/Spacexcape/15/162/22 http://spacexcape.com |
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Chaffro Schoonmaker
Funny Bunny
Join date: 22 Oct 2006
Posts: 137
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11-05-2008 11:17
Bravo for the amendment. I applaud you for that.
However... Regaining the trust of your residents is now an even more mammoth task than it ever was. Communication has never been a strong point of the more senior Lindens, and this whole debacle has only served to illustrate that your communication skills are (excuse the pun) virtually non-existent. The residents caused uproar because they love the SL experience. They love the creativity and freedom that it brings, and you, Linden Lab, are responsible for that. Without your input, it would never happen. The changes that the world has undergone in the last 2 years alone is mostly down to the company; the abilities to create by residents have been forged from the Lab in the first place. But you need to respect, as the Residents do, that this is a 2-way street. You give to us this opportunity, we shape it into something you can show off at conventions, or to other companies or partners. the SL experience would not be as wonderful as it can be without the work of the residents. And as much as we read and listen to every word you tell us, you need to respect our opinions before you try and railroad schemes through that you fear might upset even some folk. We're not going to suggest anything that would be fincanically detrimental to the company, as the majority of people recognise it as just that - an investment, a company, a business. You need to start talking with us, not dictating to us. And you need to improve the way you talk with us too. Quickly. |
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Briana Dawson
Attach to Mouth
Join date: 23 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,855
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11-05-2008 11:18
Um, vehicles have a 31 prim limit. Argent, these days moving boats have over 1000 prims and attach to your body with the main piece of the boat build being a 31prim thing you sit on. Pretty innovative and definitely a OS destroyer. _____________________
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Tessie Gray
Registered User
Join date: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 18
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Grrrrrrrr
11-05-2008 11:18
So after all this to me it sounds like nothing was gained less prims, avatars and scripts on exiting OS sim staying at $75 per month thats then a HS sim with reduced prims avatars and eventually scripts at eventually $125. So again instead of getting something for the 67% increase we lose something. Or am I wrong?
Tess |
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Jean Swashbuckler
Registered User
Join date: 15 Aug 2008
Posts: 194
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11-05-2008 11:18
Well, I'm impressed. They're providing a product for the original OpenSpace users, they're creating a new intermediate product, and they're giving people a longer period to decide what to do. Absolutely. While there will still be some emotion and drama, this looks like a good stepped product line and transition path. It's also very responsive considering that many people believed LL would not act at all or would do something less responsive. |
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Kolor Fall
Registered User
Join date: 3 Feb 2008
Posts: 4
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I don't see any change from the starting post ...
11-05-2008 11:18
I read the prim and avatar limit on the open space (why not just say the limits in the post 750 prim, 10 max avatars). And at 125$ this is hopeless (i.e. basically anyone that has done anything on the open sim will be charged 125$ ... so all this and i still don't see any real concept comming from LL). Even the conversion is bad (i.e. i have to pay 750$ to convert to a Island ?, if everyone else in my "block" of 4 converts to a island ).
I'm not sure why people are saying this is a positive post? |
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Gigs Taggart
The Invisible Hand
Join date: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 406
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11-05-2008 11:18
very quiet because 9/16 parcels are up for sale and no one buys. no ban lines, perfect views Your estate owner isn't going to keep an island that loses money forever. Something to keep in mind. _____________________
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Lord Sullivan
DTC at all times :)
Join date: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 2,870
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11-05-2008 11:18
...that people are falling so blatantly for this ploy. It's probably fair to say LL have played somewhat fast and loose and got precisely what they wanted. Forget the hype over the original 66% tier hike - that was never going to happen in one bite, and they knew it. As others have said, the OS bonanza has resulted in what can only be called a bait-and-switch policy on the part of LL, and now people are seeing the "hike" reduced (INITIALLY) to a "mere" 15%, they're happy to accept. Bravo, Mark et al! You've achieved what you set out to do, and what I suspect you wanted to do from the start - introduced yet another tier level, a "new" form of sim, got residents to readily accept it AND managed to portray yourselves as "listening" and "responding". All through announcing what you knew would be an unacceptable hike in OS tiers.... I wonder if people would have accepted this "new" plan, Homestead sims, et al, if, rather than just announcing the so-called 66% hike back on the 28th October, Jack had simply posted what is in Mark Kingdon's "letter" to start with? Somehow, I doubt it. The furore would have been as strong and LL would have had nowhere to go. But now, through the clever baiting over the 66% hike, LL can sit back in the knowledge that most people will say, "thank you" and "well done!" in the mistaken belief they've been listened to and that they have "won". Well said  LL have lost my trust over this fiasco by them as they play the customers like puppets constantly as we develop and beta test their grid for them._____________________
Independent Shopping for Second Life residents from established and new merchants.
http://slapt.me  slapt.me - In-World HQ http://slurl.com/secondlife/Bastet/123/118/26 |
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Lindal Kidd
Dances With Noobs
Join date: 26 Jun 2007
Posts: 8,371
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11-05-2008 11:18
... There is a lot you could do to generate some good will in this situation, and waiving the conversion fee for a limited time would be much appreciated. They did. _____________________
It's still My World and My Imagination! So there.
Lindal Kidd |
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Briana Dawson
Attach to Mouth
Join date: 23 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,855
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11-05-2008 11:19
SO really...Nothing has changed.
I mean sure, some minor changes. But $125 is still the bottom line. _____________________
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Tomm Olifone
Registered User
Join date: 28 Jul 2008
Posts: 6
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11-05-2008 11:19
So you're going to do exactly the same, only stretched over a few months. Unacceptable.
$75 USD is *MORE* than enough money for you to run, power, and support an openspace sim. With a VERY healthy profit margin. If these regions are using too many resources, impose thread monitoring and bandwidth caps, but allow for rare occasions of high strain, since sometimes it's required (terraforming, etc) As a technical person, and a developer who's worked on the second life source code and protocol, I *KNOW* how trivial it would be for you to cap the region cpu and bandwidth use as required. So, you're not fooling anyone. Instead of "bend over, we're gonna ---- you for no justifiable reason" it's "Bend over, we're gonna ---- you slowly for no justifiable reason" Here's how you've failed the community: - You claim that the openspace sims were intended to be only water or land, or extremely light use. Yet you used them yourself for full projects. - You haven't looked into the technical solutions to this issue, did you even think to ask on the mailing list to see if anyone knew a way to restrict usage? no. - You are ALREADY charging an exorbiant price for your products. You're earning 800% more than other hosting providers with the same hardware. - You have taken disciplinary action against your customers for protesting against the changes - You have failed to discuss this with the 4,000 people who signed a JIRA requesting you to reconsider - Even now, after you've seen the MASSIVE community rebellion, you STILL throw this price change in our face, which quite frankly, you have FAILED to justify with any reasonable figures. Opensim is looking very attractive. |
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
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11-05-2008 11:20
What about those of us where the only choice that will work--and that we can afford--is to convert our openspaces back to full sims? It would be very considerate if Linden Labs would waive the $100 conversion fee for a limited time, given the circumstances that have brought about this change in policy. _____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/
"And now I'm going to show you something really cool." Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23 Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore |
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Vryl Valkyrie
Owner of 3D Concepts
Join date: 30 May 2006
Posts: 257
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Someone please explain this 750 Prims? I'm confused.
 11-05-2008 11:21
AM I missing something here? Where does it mention 750 prims for the original void sims? Thanks.
_____________________
Visit 3D Concepts for the best professional legal and licensed textures in SL: http://slurl.com/secondlife/3D%20Concepts/128/225/31
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Melody Regent
Registered User
Join date: 24 Oct 2006
Posts: 138
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11-05-2008 11:22
M & Jack, will you keep the same number of sims per server or will we see that change as well to help with load?
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
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11-05-2008 11:22
LL why did you double the original prim limit on the open space sims if you know they could not surport it ? _____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/
"And now I'm going to show you something really cool." Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23 Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore |
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Ricky Yates
(searching...)
Join date: 28 Jan 2007
Posts: 809
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11-05-2008 11:23
AM I missing something here? Where does it mention 750 prims for the original void sims? Thanks. http://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=4417&task=knowledge&questionID=5650 I wish they had included the link in the 1st posting of this thread.  |
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Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
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11-05-2008 11:24
Argent, these days moving boats have over 1000 prims and attach to your body with the main piece of the boat build being a 31prim thing you sit on. Pretty innovative and definitely a OS destroyer. Attachments are not included in the sim prim limits. You can wear thousands of prims on attachments and still get into a fully-used prim-allotment sim. |
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Phil Deakins
Prim Savers = low prims
Join date: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 9,537
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11-05-2008 11:24
Call me a bit of a plank, but i am unsure how one is affected by this if you have perhaps a mainstore or only store on the land. Few visitors, but obviously commercial. Anybody else confused? I am deeply concerned that those of us who are creative, innovative and seeking to bring new products and idea's will be stifled by charges that prohibit us from showing or selling our wares/inventions. I would hate to see only Armidi and Naughty left in sl!!!! Then SL will need its own monopolies commission. We most of us start small and have to have some success to be able to meet these tier fees. I go further to say that many work at a personal loss already and absorb thess fees with a view to growth and future success. I for one will have to shut up shop if this tier fee applies to me and i am sure many others are in the same position. _____________________
Prim Savers - almost 1000 items of superbly crafted, top quality, very low prim furniture, and all at amazingly low prices.
http://slurl.com/secondlife/Seymour/213/120/251/ |
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Eren Padar
Registered User
Join date: 14 Sep 2005
Posts: 94
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11-05-2008 11:24
After seeing this fiasco and yet more corporate smoke screening, I'm going out on a limb here and making a prediction:
Withing one year, Second Life will either be out of business, or a virtual ghost town... or alternatly Linden Lab will have been forced to wake up and totally restructure the method in which their company does business. Yes, Linden Lab, that's a "Wayfinder prediction". You know the historical accuracy of such predictions. No further comments. Leaving the company to its consequences. |
