Anatomy of a Fail

I never claimed you "needed" to do anything. That was your invention. If you're not interested, then don't read it. Makes no never-mind to me.



Same here with you. First, you go off on your own tangent about accuracy with accounting terminology to a general audience (yeah, that's really pretty damn tedious and off-topic, too), then me correcting one small semantics issue in what you said is now "tedious". Go figure.



Is that one? Then it would be 4.



I don't always get the last word, let alone "need" it. However, if you're going to ask a question with an intent to get an answer, it's kinda necessary.



Frequently.



Absolutely.

Probably a lot better off than we are now, I would think.

This is probably a mistake to ask, but what's the point of the question?

Only 15 years at it here, but in my case it is preparing financial statements and tax returns for business owners who think they know how the rules for each of those work. Running a business usually does not mean experience in analysis of businesses (unless you are in that kind of business, lol). It should, and it might in your case, but it usually does not.



We are not talking 'many job classifications.' We are talking management of a big enough NPO for this conversation to matter.



That is no different than a for profit corporation. A for profit corporation that concentrates only on making money instead of the goods and/or services it provides will not be in business long, since its means of making money are those goods and/or services. The same is true of an NPO. If it is not providing service, it can be de-listed as an NPO, and simultaneously, it has a harder time raising money.



And those issues exist in the for profit world too. A decade or so ago there was a management strategy going around that managers could increase profitability by simply firing people. This of course meant short term increases in net income due to the lower wage costs and thus management bonuses. Then the managers would move on to become CEOs of different companies, riding the 'success' of the companies they just stripped. Of course arbitrarily cutting jobs increased profits, but only short term... the cuts failed to take into account that those were not 'waste' positions. The people laid off were productive. The companies took serious losses when the effects caught up with them. Even where the CEO's were still there, they still kept their bonuses, since bonus plans rarely penalize management for poor results, only reward them for good results.



I still have not figured out why we are discussing NPOs in a thread about bots. I think you were trying to dismiss bots as a business expense and got caught up in definitions of profit.



I am sorry.. I did not realize there was some rule that analogies could only involve all inclusive situations. Contrary to your appearant beliefs, most new businesses are not started by people of Bill Gates' level of wealth. Most people on the planet do not have that level of wealth.



That is all it is about to LL... regardless of your opinions on how NPO's are or should be run, LL is not an NPO. And the laws of physics govern certain aspects of costs, but as the laws of physics are considered constant and universal, then this is not about them (unless you believe the laws of physics prove predetermination, in which case this is about the laws of physics, but it doesn't matter because this entire discussion is predetermined by way of the laws of physics... and if a certain vampire is still looking for an example of an ad absurdium arguement, that would probably qualify).

I thought you had the audacity to infer that Japan was a 3rd world country as you mention Japan and 3rd world country in same paragraph. If you didn't imply that then my previous comment cna be disregarded.





Regarding better off? Well if the U.S Govt. must run up huge budget deficits how they going to be funded.?

As of May 7, 2009, the total U.S. federal debt was $11,256,266,640,050.20,[2] or about $36,995 per capita. Of this amount, debt held by the public was roughly $6.927 trillion.[3] In 2007, the public debt was 36.8 percent of GDP,[4] with a total debt of 65.5 percent of GDP.[5] The debt of the United States is ranked as 12th in the world.[6]. As of May 2009 the debt was 80.1 percent of GDP based on current GDP. This level of debt has not been seen since 1951, with the nominal value the largest in recorded history.

Public debt is the amount owed by the government to its creditors, whether they are nationals or foreigners. External debt is the debt of all sectors of the economy (public and private), owed to foreigners. In the U.S., foreign ownership of the public debt is a significant part of the nation's external debt


Key thing here is that current debt is 80% of GDP of which 28% of it is funded by foreign countries some of which are those 3rd world countries you were referring to!

But the biggest alarm bells is this.

"The Government Accountability Office (GAO), Office of Management and Budget (OMB) and the U.S. Treasury Department have warned that debt levels will increase dramatically relative to historical levels if entitlement programs are not reformed. For example, projected expenditures for Medicare and Social Security programs exceed tax revenues by over $40 trillion over the next 75 years. Mandatory expenditures are projected to exceed federal tax revenues sometime between 2030 and 2040 if reforms are not undertaken.[15][16] The severity of the measures necessary to address this challenge increases the longer such changes are delayed. These organizations have stated that the government's current fiscal path is "unsustainable."

Before making sweeping statements regarding queuing, you might want to educate yourself. Below are few examples of queuing systems experienced around the world.

http://ask.metafilter.com/104881/Standing-In-Line

PS One thing i did get wrong, i implied the Swedes were bad at queuing through my personal experiences on holidays...apparently they are quite ordely back home in Sweden.

Sophistry. Casuistry. You can play humpty-dumpty word games as much as you like, but Second Life is not a regulated competition, it's an economy. Just because Linden Labs policy is that cheating is a dispute between customers and not against the ToS (and it still is... if you find a way to get Lucky Chairs to always come up "?" LL won't do a thing about it, but that's unquestionably cheating) that doesn't mean it's not cheating.

The other people in the queue will make it abundantly obvious, if not the first time then eventually. Of course some big and tough guys will keep on doing it just because they can get away with it, 'cos they're certainly not going to get arrested for it!

Don't agree! It's cheating when it's there in black and white in the rules section or specified in the TOS or LL announces a policy change.

I suffered greatly due to Bots being used, to the point that I ignored Places Search entirely, as i was deeply buried on Page 2 for the most popular applicable keywords in my sector.
I hold no malice to all those in front of me that used Bots to game traffic....as they did sell the products that the keyword attained to. They only used the tools that were "allowable" at the time and sanctioned by LL. Regardless of what i felt, it's immaterial....i guess the fact i didn't use Bots kind of implies my ethics were different regarding that particular practice.

The ones that i have problems with, are thosee other companies that used Bots but falsely advertised products they did not sell...and using those keywords applicable to my sector. In my eyes that is blatent cheating.

it varies from country to country...i have travelled to many different countries and i'm only going by my own personal experiences. I used boarding a bus or train as my default comparison check.......because that's what pisses me off most regarding queue jumping.

Nothing to do with tough guys at all....it some instances old aged ladies are the worst for worming or wiggling their way through queues.

Why? They're just lying. Is that a problem?

You call it lying....i call it cheating. Infact it's both!
They were gaining extra visitor traffic through the misuse of keywords....which should have gone to other legitmate businesses that sold the said product (even if they were using Bots.)

Good morning all

It started when I said that all businesses exist to make profits, otherwise they wouldn't exist, but I don't remember why I said it and I'm not going to search back to find out. That was goodness knows how many pages ago. Since then, Talarus has argued that it's not true - citing a list of not-for-profit organistaions, which isn't the same thing at all. He seems to be incapable of understanding that any not-for-profit organisation that operates a *business* to raise money, does so for the purpose of making a profit from the business so that it can be used for whatever purpose it was raised - paying for water systems in a third-world country, for instance, or paying for continued cancer research. The business is there to make profits over and above expenses, in order to provide it towards the thing that it exists for, otherwise the business wouldn't exist. But Talarus doesn't want to accept that such money is the profit of the business, and so we've had goodness knows how many pages of meandering through various aspects of business finance, just because Talarus doesn't want to accept that all businesses exist to make profits, otherwise they wouldn't exist.

---------------------------------------------

On the 'legality' of traffic bots thing - Rene's chat with a Linden was done during a thread in which I'd stated that I'd had such a chat. Rene did it as a test and received the same answer as I'd received months earlier. Before the recent rule change, the use of traffic bots was perfectly 'legal', had been given the go-ahead multiple times, and, because of that, was in no way cheating. Some people think that it was immoral and/or unethical, but that's their subjective judgement. Others think it was neither of those, which is also subjective judgement.

I see no reason to argue the toss about it now because the rule has changed and the use of traffic bots is now 'illegal'. Perhaps the self-styled super-moral types don't like that there's nothing to fight about any more and are just having one last fling here. They are warriors without a war What they don't realise yet is that there is a war to be fought, but they are still hankering after the old one.

ETA:
The idea of equating the use of traffic bots to adfarming and micro-plot extortion is valid. Both were 'legal' before the rules changed. Whether or not they were desirable to people doesn't come into it - they were 'legal'.

Right, but before bot-running was officially ruled out-of-bounds, was it any more against the ToS (hence "cheating" by the rules of our little SL culture) to tell an untruth in a parcel description than to pack that parcel with bots?

Perhaps I'm missing it, but I just don't see the difference.

Quick aside: The IRS publishes the table of class lives and recovery periods in Appendix B of Publication 946. There's some flexibility in terms of choosing depreciation method, and there might be away to argue for a different class life, but at least for the sort of small businesses I'm familiar with, those are the class lives that get used.

To my way of thinking, some things are wrong by their very nature, and don't need specific rules for them. Stealing is one such thing but, as far as I know, it isn't against the ToS. Lying in a parcel description, in order to get high rankings for searches that the parcel has nothing to do with, is another, imo. But having words in the description that cause a parcel to rank highly for something that it isn't concerned with is not necessarily lying. It can be done quite genuinely when describing the parcel, without any designs on rankings. For instance, there are many reasons to use the word "furniture" in a place's description without intending to rank at all for furniture. It's the crapness of the Places tab system that causes it.

Good morning!

Don't speak too loudly!. PICKS are next on the hit list for the "super-moral" types.

Some need excuses to gloss over the fact that there always a uncontrollable reason for their own SL business failures. The problem occurs when the Grid is cleaned up of what they deem to be malpractices.....it's at that point they're going to have look inwardly and wonder why their existing business are still underperforming......as the excuses have run out!

The ones with the best business savvy and most dynamic will always adjust to whatever the game rules are....and remain profitable. The natural order won't change that much.

Eg. Anyone thinking Stroker's SexGen business is going to plummet is only kidding themselves....he'll adapt pretty fast to these Adult Content policies....and it's my bet he'll remain one of the King pins....along with the likes of XCite and others.

Well lying is lying under any circumstances. If you falsely advertise...i see it as a form of cheating although it is not part of the TOS same as Bots were not....so I see your point.

Again....it was based on my distaste for it, the fact that it isn't included in the TOS is probably why businesses continue to do it. I guess i just have to lump it and accept it and work around that particular problem.

Which brings us to something else. Yes, they will remain kingpins in their fields, because all the competition will be in the same boat. Well, not exactly. Xcite will remain on top because all the competition will be under the same constraints, but I don't know about the SegGen business. If the change goes as I expect it to go, pure sex furniture businesses, such as Stroker's business, will be moving, but places like mine, that are mostly just furniture with some sex furniture, may not have to move, and there are a *lot* of them. If it's like that, then I think the SexGen business will be seriously impacted because it will be competing in half the market or worse, while the myriad of furniture plus places have the full market available to them.

Isle of Wyrms...why does that ring a bell.

And as far as them making it I did mention not all that make it to the top resort to numerous devious, downright dirty methods of advertising. And again I meant that more in a RL sense but totally screwed up what I meant due to it being late and I was tired lastnite.

Yes ofcourse companies in SL will make it due to honest methods and for me I'll shop at both honest, and crooked places. A good product is a good product.

And alot of the businesses in SL who are up in the big dog area, most of them have been in SL for a while already and that in itself sort of firms their name in the market whether or not they have a good product.

For instance, I'll go to stores that make decent products, some even great products but what I notice is due to them being in SL for a longtime they're prices are rediculously high(not all places ofcourse)...and they still sell like crazy! Then you wander off to a much less travelled place with more or less the same product with the same quality, or maybe even better quality, and your lucky to see 1 person drop in over the course of a hour.

So it makes me believe that a good majority of people tend to buy for "namessake" even if the prices are a bit rediculous for the product. But thats business, some people invest time to find better deals, some don't. In that case I honestly see nothing wrong with the guy who has a much superior product at a much lower price than his competitors resorting to a bit a shady advertising to get his name out there.

gotta keep in mind also, advertising isn't cheap in SL. Even cheap advertising isn't cheap. Taks money, alot of time hunting out places to advertise whether it be here, other forums, Xstreet, blogs, magazines, whatever. The cheapest, easiest, probably best advertising there is is the search button, so sure I see people trying to get their p[roducts out using bots. I personally don't swing either way with them unless...they have more than 8-10. In my opinion thats plenty to get you a good spot in search, even six is good enough to get you there, and instead of sitting them in a box, sit them on your product so people can see what AVs look like on it.

I've had six such bots in my store for a long time. Four of them are on three sex beds - a male/female couple, a male and a female. People use the bed menus to see or use the animations before deciding whether or not buy. The other two (male and female) are on a cuddle sofa for the same reason. They all get used by customers - they even get tips occasionally lol - and they serve a very useful function for customers.

Somewhere back in the mists, a Linden (pre-Jack?) is on record as saying that the reason that they were not moving on traffic bots was that they didn't want to get involved in an arms race.
Q to Linden: Is it OK to use traffic bots?
A from Linden: Don't contravene the TOS
Q to Linden: Are traffic bots outlawed in the TOS?
A from Linden: No

So on April 23rd


He didn't blog that the use had become unfair from that point on. The idea that it suddenly and magically became unfair is ludicrous.
It was always unfair. LL simply didn't want to devote the resources to what would become a continuing battle in which the level of 'creativity' to game the system would become more complex and which would require more skilled resources to deal with.

Clearly, the downside of traffic bots got to be noticeable enough the LL have now begun to engage in an arms race with the gamers.

If anyone thinks that "the war" is over, then they really are on a different planet.

Ordinal asks - ' are we still banging on about bots'?
From my point of view, we are not.
We're on about the mindsets that seek to defend the manipulation of Search.

The gamers don't want to read what Jack wrote
"...manipulate .....(and therefore Search rankings) is unfair..."

That blog posting was not the winning of a war.
It was a small victory in a larger battle about the use of bots to game Search.
That larger battle is only part of of a more general war on the manipulation of Search by gamers.
That blog posting says "....(and therefore Search rankings) is unfair...". There's your war.


People may write ' well look around you at the real world. Dishonesty and underhanded behaviour all over the place. It's just business.'
SL isn't RL. It's a small place, with a relatively small number of people engaged in cheating and sharp practice. There is only one jurisdiction. It's easy to whack the perps if the ruler has a mind to do it. No court case. No international constraints. Just whack them.
The ruler has decided to begin whacking one aspect ot the perps' behaviour.
They'll get around to the other behaviours eventually when enough downside of those behaviour is made clear.

tipping bots? niceeeee. sort of reminds me of when they first came out with the bots that talked back to you. I knew right off they were bots by their names and how they talked but it was funny watching people tip the bots dancing thinking they were having a actual conversation...i get a kick out of weird things

I have signs there that say what they are but people are good at not reading signs. As well as the occasional tip, they sometimes get IMs. One person asked the solo female to remove her panties not long ago, and told her how much he was enjoying her - stuff like that lol.

I while back, when I had them in on standard viewers, one person simply said "You wish" and walked out (they are in cubicles and are not in plain sight). I couldn't resist, so I used the bot's viewer and asked "I wish what?" The bot's name is 4times Nitely, and that's what it wished

Oh well. I suppose you have to have something to protest about or you'll probably vegetate. Whatever floats your boat

You have a good point....but if i were him i would split my bets. Partner up with another furniture provider share a portion of land....his partner can place all the normal type furniture and he could have a Dept within for his Sex Beds. That would qualify like any other Furniture company ina Mature region......meanwhile he could tick his SIM Adult rated for his out and out sex beds business.

Even though i don't provide Adult Content, I plan at some point to buy some land on Ursula and open some shops there. It could be quite lucrative long term......for one their will be a higher rate of "payment on file" users milling around Ursula than say any other of the type SIMs. (PIOF will be an alternative option for Adult verification).....which means the ability to buy Lindens and the ability to spend. Doing a Hunt on Ursula could be really worthwhile as it would eliminate some of the Freebie hunters ....of which many don't buy anyway.