Any place to file a complaint?

Nope...I don't dispute her right to a refund nor the need to fix the advertising. As a creator there have certainly been times when I have also offered a refund.

As I stated, it is not how *I* would go about handling this as the customer....given the easy workaround and all the other reasons I have already given. Guess I'm just reasonably flexible and understanding that way.

~ Desi

While I certainly understand your feelings about not getting what you were promised, I guess my question to you is how would the product have changed for you if it WAS full perms? You have a way to change the names (come on, you seem reasonably intelligent, and the "fix" is changing ONE line on a notecard), but if that's not acceptable, why not ask the creator to change the names and resend them to you? I would probably file the AR, but I wouldn't get all bent out of shape over something that you can FIX and USE in the manner you originally intended. Yeah, the creator made a mistake, but it doesn't sound like the intention was to defraud you. Doesn't "fraud" need to be partnered with "intent" by definition?? AR it and use what you have rather than taking a huge loss. JMHO.

If the creator has had a previous customer complain (as he mentioned) and has not changed the advertising then there is intent to defraud. Possibly he's afraid people will be less willing to buy "C/T/-M" than "Full Perm" and he's unwilling to lose those possible sales, but isn't that almost the definition of fraudulent advertising?

Maybe the world has started turning in the opposite direction, because for probably the first time I am going to agree with Argent and (not for the first time actually, despite what some might think) support someone for whom English is not their first language.

If something is advertised as "full perm" and it is not (which is irrefutable) then the buyer is entitled either to a full refund or to have the product "made good".

Pep (wonders if the seller understands English)

PS Hi Pip!

pretty much, no

I guess I still see this differently. Yeah, the seller should have changed the product labeling, but I think it's a leap to say that there's intent to deceive just because the seller didn't change that labeling to something different from what the competition is using for the same product class. (For that matter, maybe the seller just never got around to changing the product descriptions. Although sloth is a cardinal sin, I don't think it qualifies as fraud.)

TBH, I think the seller has every reason to suspect the motives of a buyer who insists on getting a version of the product with Mod permission when the only real advantage of that permission is to make the asset easier to smuggle into a no-IP-enforcement grid, and back. I'm emphatically *not* saying that this was the OP's intent, but really: there's just no other significant functionality conferred on animations by granting Modify permission. (More's the pity: we really should be able to modify everything about that animation that gets set at bvh upload, including especially Priority. But that's a whole different thread.)

If all products in a class are mislabeled (ice cream that's got no actual cream in it) they have still been required to change their labeling in a way that isn't deceptive (eg, iced milk product, or in one pint I bought a couple of months ago "HOME MADE (style) VANILLA (flavored) ICE CREAM (milk product)" with the small letters about 1/4 the size of the capitals).

And this is a bogus argument anyway because every animation seller is NOT advertising C/T as full perm. I've seen big signs posted in animation stores making a big deal about how their animations are copy/transfer but not moddable. THAT is what a responsible vendor does.
That's NOT the only real advantage. It makes use of the animation with existing scripts more complex (original problem), more cumbersome (I can't copy and paste and retyping 30 characters of punctuation hash is a pain), and in some cases impossible (no source to the script, in the case of some scripted avatars I own).
In which case there should be no problem with correctly labeling it, because it wouldn't hurt sales. If it does, then it DOES matter, no matter whether you think it should or not.

Full perms has to be full perms, nothing less. I understand the creators intentions, but if he wants to protect himself and his IP, he can't do that on the back of his misleaded customers.

I agree with everything you have stated in this thread.

If the OP is relating things truthfully, huge "FULL PERM" signs and all that, then it is fraud.

No intent to decieve? Selling something that is not FULL PERMS and calling it FULL PERMS is not intent to decieve?


agree here also

and also agree with this here

To update you all, the creator of the animations is still not responding anymore, probably muted me, I really dont know as I havent IMd him any further, giving him time to "help" (call me naïve) LOL

No Qie, I have no further intentions. I simply dont want to be bothered to move the scripts or notecard from the sitter, as I'm afraid if I do so it wont work good. I work with a lot of animators, many make custom animations for me and they have been doing so for over 2 years and I've kept my part of the agreement of not reselling or giving the animations but as part of my furniture. I am also careful of removing perms once its in my creations so their work wont ever be freebies. I have a good reputation with the ones I have worked with. I usually go shopping for new animations to give variety to my furniture and to try new animations creators. Custom is great, but takes time to make, so I do both. and no, I wont move them to my hard drive, lol, even if I knew how to.

Bottom line, if I go to the corner store and see a cherry lollypop, that has a sign stating its a cherry lollypop and has a cover on it saying its cherry, and I buy it and it turns out to be lemon, even if lemon is good I dont want it, I decided to buy cherry, why do they give me lemon? and expect me to change my preferences and expect me to pay more for cherry if they're not giving me cherry?

He knew he was selling something that was not what he promised in all the signs, he has had people coming back to him and the only thing he can offer is a work around, which btw isnt working. That little word everybody was telling me about yesterday isnt working, I have somebody working on that, trying to make this work, but why should I be bothering? why cant I use the animations I paid so much for yesterday? When we talk lindens we kind of lose perspective, but what I paid yesterday was a bit more over 100US and I dont think its fair I have them laying in my inventory till I can find a work around or to leave them there unusable.

I don't think it would be so difficult to just rename the animations to what the customer wants and give them a new copy. I would also change any ad that says full perms. That's misleading.

Poke my fuzzy nose in here.

I am not defending the seller of these, but what if he got them like that and can not even change them himself?


Plus after reading this wow that is defiantly fraud so I would do as the others have said here.

Honestly, you shouldn't file an AR for being obstinate...folks have said there is a way to change the menu. The item you bought is mod, just not in the way YOU want it to be modded. You can't mod animations (beyond name change) inworld even if it were set MOD, so the mod permission is irrelevant to animations. So you can't rename the animations for an easy fix...there is however a way to do it, as others here have stated. BUT the way of changing the name you don't wish to bother learning...so you'd rather attack the maker for 'false advertising' for what sounds like more an issue of arrogance on your part. OR you want to rip off the guy's animations and nomod is cramping your style.

What he/she did should only be ARable if 'Lazy Customer with lots of $L and an attitude to match' is ARable. You're lucky the maker listed perms at all...because of lazy whining 'customers', many store owners are NOT listing perms and it becomes a crapshoot as to what they will be.

No. It. Is. Not.

What? Lucky that the vendor lied instead of saying nothing? Nonsense.

That's true. Mod doesn't do much but allow renaming. You can't change the creator either. So leaving it no mod seems rather strange.i wouldn't AR the seller either. Seems he is just being quirky but not malicious.

Blame the customer for not showing perm info in your ads? Huh? That's dumb.

Full perm is full perm, and they should never have advertised their stuff as such. Now, it is good that the same result can be achieved with the Perfect Sitter but the bottom line is that if it's not truly full perm then it's probably not worth that kind of money.

Mod would allow the person to save it to their computer using Second Inventory, and then make changes (e.g., to the priority, or add/change sequences) and upload it as their own. I totally understand this concern, but then one should not call it full perm when it's not.

I don't believe what I read. Shop owners who don't list permissions don't get a lousy L from me. I work in RL, I buy L as a part of my entertainment, but I want to know what I buy!
And guess what... I don't IM shopowners and "whine" because I know what I buy. Shopowners who don't list permissions are bad at marketing.

!!

Exactly. I don't bother complaining, I just don't buy and move on....but I did ask a few I met WHY it was not listed. 'Keeps people from bitching' were the replies in various wordings. The more often folks get all puffed up about exact meanings (ala Argent and the OP) and indignantly demand their definitions/threaten AR's, the less customer service we seem to get as folks all CYA against said AR threats.

Me, rather than drop a lot of cash as the OP did and then discover an issue, I buy one item, check perms, buy more, check perms. Its tedious, yah, but I've only gotten burned once or twice and have those places noted on my 'Do Not Buy' list. Expect the worse and plan for it, this is SL after all.

Excuse me, me bitching???? have you heard youself???

My furniture is mod, and if the animation is no mod, it will show as no mod to my customers, even if its mod

Wow. That really sucks. I guess trans/copy will be the way to go. Sold with perms labelled as such.

Don't be silly. If you don't lie about what your permissions are, you won't get ARed for lying about the permissions.

How bleeding hard is it to check the permissions before you fire up Photoshop?

I hereby define "transfer" as meaning "I can transfer it but you can't". Hence I will be selling all of my products as "copy/transfer" from now on.

I'm afraid that if you don't understand that that is how words work in the marketplace for my products, you must be some sort of idiot and deserve not only no compensation but also a beating with a stick. A stick with nails in it.