Welcome to the Second Life Forums Archive

These forums are CLOSED. Please visit the new forums HERE

SL Banks are Toast - Yee Haw!

Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
01-08-2008 17:56
From: Gordon Wendt
Your misinformed then, at least 2 of them (JTF and L&L) were transparent, well run and L&L even fought LL successfully to get their money back so I think that it's unreasonable to say that because of Ginko all investments and banks are fraudulent and scams.


Transparency only aids solvency, it by no means guarantees it.

I don't think I am so much misinformed. Instead I just don't agree with you.

Evidently neither did LL, Not that that means anything.

Other than the fact that we will never know now.


------------

Of course if they truly are well managed they wont default on paying back their depositors.
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
01-08-2008 17:57
From: Raymond Figtree
I would like to hear if people are having any success withdrawing money from the various banks today...

Also what happens if the WSE does not reopen before the ban takes place?


If gambling were legal id bet money on it.
Alazarin Mondrian
Teh Trippy Hippie Dragon
Join date: 4 Apr 2005
Posts: 1,549
01-08-2008 17:59
From: Ordinal Malaprop
IBM aren't a bank. Why would any bank bother with SL?

Good publicity and advertising as well as on-site financial advice / investment in in-world projects.
_____________________
My stuff on Meta-Life: http://tinyurl.com/ykq7nzt
http://www.myspace.com/alazarinmobius
http://slurl.com/secondlife/Crescent/72/98/116
Dinalya Dawes
=^.^=
Join date: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 424
01-08-2008 18:01
From: Silverblade Dagger
I think LL was very irresponsible in doing this. The only thing I can give them credit for is at least being courteous enough to provide a window to be prepared, unlike the immediateness of the gambling ban.

Were there fraudulent banks in SL? Of course there were! But there are banks that have an honest track record that are now feeling the pinch because of a panic induced by LL's lack of thinking of the consequences. Where was this policy back when Ginko tanked? Where was this back when others tanked? LL turned a blind eye to it all. Like someone else had said, this only punishes the honest because the crooks use loopholes, or have already cashed and dashed.

I think LL made a terrible mistake with this policy and how they are executing it. As a customer of a well known and trustworthy bank, I wouldn't mind it if LL kept close tabs on banks to prevent fraud, but at the same time, I don't want them ruining honest money making opportunities for banks and customers. Drama caused by Jasper Tizzy, Ginko, Investor Allen and etc shouldn't happen again, but killing the patient to get rid of a handful of parasites is simply stupid.

LL, wake up and stop messing around. Think before you act, and act when action is needed, not just because you finally had time to do so between setting up fancy features and developing crashing clients. LL deserves blame instead of praise. So all that is left to make any money now is content creation, stupid HippiePay junk/spam, and camping. Good going LL, you've just created a virtual world of malls containing rehashed stuff, and a welfare system for those with absolutely no talent.

Honoris Causa...
Silverblade Dagger


Looks a little harsh to me to be honest. We all know LL isnt going to make a department of people to keep track of the investments and other going ons of its residents, they hardly have the staff to take care of the issues at hand. The fact that this action took so long after the Ginko incident and possibly others could be a direct result OF LL thinking before they acted. What other action could they take? They certainly arent going to follow behind and clean up the mess of every bank or investment that goes sour, though they more than likely got a load of complaints and calls when it happened with previously mentioned people or organizations. They did the only thing that LL could...if you dont have enough staff to deal with and police it, shut it down.

(In response to other things in the entire thread, not just quote above) Also, if they stopped turning LL into cash on their own or selling LL for cash, we would just have those that do it anyway. Check out any online game through google...WoW was mentioned more than once, you can buy the gold from unrelated companies and sites. SL wouldnt be any different.
_____________________
http://slgrandillusion.blogspot.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dinalyadawes/
Qie Niangao
Coin-operated
Join date: 24 May 2006
Posts: 7,138
01-08-2008 18:26
From: Gordon Wendt
As I've been saying for awhile, there are a lot of scams out there. That being said it's a shame that trustworthy exchanges like SlCapex/JTF bank are dragged into this since they've been honest and are entirely transparent so they shouldn't have been hit by this dragnet but LL in their general idiocy made it so wide that multi user tip jars are probably against the rules.
I really don't see that LL had any choice, short of setting themselves up as bank regulators. Indeed, given the limitations of SL "accounting", who but LL can actually know enough to judge an institution's transparency for certain?

But I agree that it's sad for those who were honest; I hope they'll find elsewhere to apply that honesty: it's something the supply of which can never meet the demand.

For SL as a whole, though, this was necessary, and an encouraging sign that LL is willing to make the decisions required to protect their creation. I'm sure this must have been difficult for LL management, given their apparent political philosophy; it's good to see them realize that only by being responsible owners can they have more than a game. For that, I'm grateful.
Joy Iddinja
Registered User
Join date: 15 Sep 2006
Posts: 344
01-08-2008 18:26
I think you hit the nail on the head. This is LL's plan. LL needed smart people to come into LL and make money to build the system up. However, smart people do not make good consumers, as they carry over their brains to buying. I know myself that I only withdraw about $100 a month, yet make six to eight times that, and no longer pay into SL at all. I know someone has to pay for all those Lindens, but the folks that pay and the folks that cash out are two different beasts. Now that LL is desperately trying to attract corporate and large institutions to invest, the smart, small business owner is a liability, rather than an asset. LL's goal is to turn SL mainstream, and that requires making consumerism, not entreprenuership the primary activity. They are slowly bleeding away talent and intelligence to replace it with common mind candy, and those that appeals to. They will spend as much or more, even if at first they are fewer than what is lost. Truely sad watching SL turn RL.

From: Silverblade Dagger

LL, wake up and stop messing around. Think before you act, and act when action is needed, not just because you finally had time to do so between setting up fancy features and developing crashing clients. LL deserves blame instead of praise. So all that is left to make any money now is content creation, stupid HippiePay junk/spam, and camping. Good going LL, you've just created a virtual world of malls containing rehashed stuff, and a welfare system for those with absolutely no talent.
Gordon Wendt
404 - User not found
Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
01-08-2008 18:28
From: Qie Niangao
I really don't see that LL had any choice, short of setting themselves up as bank regulators. Indeed, given the limitations of SL "accounting", who but LL can actually know enough to judge an institution's transparency for certain?

But I agree that it's sad for those who were honest; I hope they'll find elsewhere to apply that honesty: it's something the supply of which can never meet the demand.

For SL as a whole, though, this was necessary, and an encouraging sign that LL is willing to make the decisions required to protect their creation. I'm sure this must have been difficult for LL management, given their apparent political philosophy; it's good to see them realize that only by being responsible owners can they have more than a game. For that, I'm grateful.



They're playing both sides though, they're saying that we're going to make sure banks are regulated but won't regulate them themselves while still regulating that they're regulated (requiring the forms) so they're really being duplicitous at best. I agree it was needed but they could have done more than a half-assed job implementing it. This proves that they really need a PR firm or something to do all the talking and stay back in the server room.
_____________________
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/GWendt
Plurk: http://www.plurk.com/GordonWendt

GW Designs: XStreetSL

Aminom Marvin
Registered User
Join date: 31 Dec 2006
Posts: 520
01-08-2008 18:28
Once again, Chilly Charlton is a pro-illegal-gambling evangelist in a thread that has nothing to do with gambling.
For those not aware, Chilly formerly ran one of the largest casinos in Second Life. Seems like someone is still baawing about not being able to run rigged, illegal casinos in SL.

This from someone who said that his casino was "not about the money." ROFL indeed.
Gordon Wendt
404 - User not found
Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
01-08-2008 18:30
From: Aminom Marvin
Once again, Chilly Charlton is a pro-illegal-gambling evangelist in a thread that has nothing to do with gambling.
For those not aware, Chilly formerly ran one of the largest casinos in Second Life. Seems like someone is still baawing about not being able to run rigged, illegal casinos in SL.

This from someone who said that his casino was "not about the money." ROFL indeed.


Just because it's illegal doesn't mean it's wrong, I'm pro gambling in SL as well and have no shame in saying that, yeah some were rigged but the VGA tables were on the up and up (I know I won quite a bit at them) and like everything it's a matter of LL and more so US Law interfering where they're not wanted and not needed.
_____________________
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/GWendt
Plurk: http://www.plurk.com/GordonWendt

GW Designs: XStreetSL

Gordon Wendt
404 - User not found
Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
01-08-2008 18:32
From: Colette Meiji
I don't think I am so much misinformed. Instead I just don't agree with you.


I'll agree to disagree with you on that, we have two different views on this, although I still hold that many of the people that agree with your point of view are so used to untrustworthy institutions that they don't know that there are (for another two weeks at least) a number of good institutions out there.
_____________________
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/GWendt
Plurk: http://www.plurk.com/GordonWendt

GW Designs: XStreetSL

Mitzy Shino
can i haz ur stufz?
Join date: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 409
01-08-2008 18:59
From: Bradley Bracken
Only two weeks left folks!!!! Quick! Bring me your money! I guarantee 60% return on your investment paid before then. I promise. You can trust me.



Give me the SLURL and when I'm in world I'll drop by and deposit some cash, how could I resist!
Carl Metropolitan
Registered User
Join date: 7 Jul 2005
Posts: 1,031
01-08-2008 19:39
From: Aminom Marvin
Once again, Chilly Charlton is a pro-illegal-gambling evangelist in a thread that has nothing to do with gambling.
For those not aware, Chilly formerly ran one of the largest casinos in Second Life. Seems like someone is still baawing about not being able to run rigged, illegal casinos in SL.

This from someone who said that his casino was "not about the money." ROFL indeed.


That is far from fair. I've never heard anything but good things bout Chilly's Extreme casino when it was operating. It was a very friendly place with a good crowd of people. I know personally when I was a broke(ish) newbie, I made a lot from his freeplay slots, and I'm sure I'm not alone.
Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
01-08-2008 21:23
From: Joy Iddinja
I think you hit the nail on the head. This is LL's plan. LL needed smart people to come into LL and make money to build the system up. However, smart people do not make good consumers, as they carry over their brains to buying. I know myself that I only withdraw about $100 a month, yet make six to eight times that, and no longer pay into SL at all. I know someone has to pay for all those Lindens, but the folks that pay and the folks that cash out are two different beasts.


I think it's partly the case that "smart people don't make good consumers", but it's also partly because people who run businesses in SL tend to spend most of their SL time running their businesses or creating things, as that's what they most enjoy, and apart from the land fees doing that doesn't cost any money. It also seems that those people are more likely to have their "feet on the ground" in-world.

From: someone
Now that LL is desperately trying to attract corporate and large institutions to invest, the smart, small business owner is a liability, rather than an asset. LL's goal is to turn SL mainstream, and that requires making consumerism, not entreprenuership the primary activity. They are slowly bleeding away talent and intelligence to replace it with common mind candy, and those that appeals to. They will spend as much or more, even if at first they are fewer than what is lost. Truely sad watching SL turn RL.


I think it's a bit wrong to say that it's "LL's goal" - ever since Second Life started it seems, they've been pushing back and forth trying to find a solution to how to make SL work as a creative system, while still satisfying the business side. The only problem is that with real people making their livings from SL as it stands, and real companies operating based on it, LL can't really risk changing very much as they need to keep those people's trust.
Jackson Rickenbacker
Registered User
Join date: 8 Oct 2006
Posts: 601
01-08-2008 21:41
Well its gonna get ugly, but the cure never tastes good
Tiberious Neruda
Furry 'On File'
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 261
01-08-2008 22:23
From: Yiffy Yaffle
If the day comes that Linden Lab bans Sex, I will be having lots and lots of sex to protest it. As a adult we have the right to have sex. We already proved our ages and kids don't have legitimate access to the main grid so i don't see why they would need to take that measure anyway.


I will be right behind ms. Yaffle... literally. Likely with pants down, to boot >;3
Alicia Sautereau
if (!social) hide;
Join date: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 3,125
01-08-2008 22:44
Donations Bank will open it`s doors at the 22dn of january

All donations will have a 100% profit return for me
Payouts are on the first of every month to my bank account
Speculations are 100% risk free as i only speculate on the forums about stuff i have no clue about
Terminals will be placed around the grid for free on request and recongnisable by the particle emitting dollar signs
All newly signups will recieve a FREE business aka BiaB as a signup bonus
FULL transparancy so you know what i bought with your money
Ranking page to show the most unintelectual person(s) on the grid
Public forums to flame/troll&harash

No recruitemets at this time


Regards
Wannabe Head of Great Intelectual Trash Spam (GITS)
_____________________
Drivin Sideways
100% recycled pixels
Join date: 30 Oct 2007
Posts: 502
01-08-2008 23:43
From: unbonbom Aabye
the linden is famous.........why?......i buy money linden lab......but if my money in band and the bank no payme money.......linden have my money.......logic........the cuestion is simply......




I certainly have nothing to add to THAT.
_____________________
Raymond Figtree
Gone, avi, gone
Join date: 17 May 2006
Posts: 6,256
01-08-2008 23:53
From: Drivin Sideways
I certainly have nothing to add to THAT.
Translation: He put money in a bank. He wants it back.
_____________________
Read or listen to some Eckhart Tolle. You won't regret it.
Tod69 Talamasca
The Human Tripod ;)
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,107
01-09-2008 00:03
Of all the decisions on banning that LL has made......

This one is PERFECT!!!


Ok, not perfect if you're dumb enough to fall for these scams. ;)


So far, 2008 is looking good for SL!!!

Now we just need VBCode back!
_____________________
really pissy & mean right now and NOT happy with Life.
Beady Voom
Registered User
Join date: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 148
01-09-2008 00:59
From: Roobus Newt
Do I ask myself a lot of questions? I sure do.


And do I trust my answers? Certainly do.
_____________________
Regards,
Beady Voom
FD Spark
Prim & Texture Doodler
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 4,697
01-09-2008 01:01
Reading the FAQ it seems like WSE may or may not be exempt. It was covered they said they weren't focusing on them only banks that pay interest.
I really think they should been included especially since they moved bank accounts of Ginko members to WSE stock without the consent of the depositors and lots lost money.
I don't get why they haven't included them.
_____________________
Look for my alt Dagon Xanith on Youtube.com

Newest video is

Loneliness by Duo Zikr DX's Alts & SL Art Death of Avatar
Beady Voom
Registered User
Join date: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 148
01-09-2008 01:21
From: Tod69 Talamasca
Of all the decisions on banning that LL has made......

This one is PERFECT!!!


Ok, not perfect if you're dumb enough to fall for these scams. ;)


So far, 2008 is looking good for SL!!!

Now we just need VBCode back!


Actually I'm a retired police inspector. I hold 2 University degrees and have run a successful RL business for 10 years. I had, what for me, was a small deposit in JT Financial Bank.

It did not let me down in any way. I have made a substantial withdrawal since the announcement and consider any of the money which I deposited in the bank to be no more than a modest gamble similar to one that others make in various RL gambling endevours.

For me that modest gamble has paid off over the last few months.

The real risk to the honest banks in SL is pretty much the same as in RL. Someone does or says something that causes a 'run' on the bank, which they have difficulty in filling in the short term. I'd suggest that people should do a google on 'Northern Rock' in the UK which was a solid well backed bank with assets well in excess of its liabilities that suffered such a run at the end of last year for no rational reason.

I would expect contributors to think before calling people dumb. (Or given the general level of comments in these forums, perhaps I shouldn't really expect that).
_____________________
Regards,
Beady Voom
Matthew Dowd
Registered User
Join date: 30 Jan 2007
Posts: 1,046
01-09-2008 01:29
From: Beady Voom

The real risk to the honest banks in SL is pretty much the same as in RL. Someone does or says something that causes a 'run' on the bank, which they have difficulty in filling in the short term.


And in this case it is LL who has done or said something to cause a run on all SL banks - however well run they are.

Matthew
Beady Voom
Registered User
Join date: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 148
01-09-2008 01:35
From: Matthew Dowd
And in this case it is LL who has done or said something to cause a run on all SL banks - however well run they are.

Matthew


My point exactly.

Innocent untill proven guilty still seems a pretty good idea to me.
_____________________
Regards,
Beady Voom
Bad Bobbysocks
Registered User
Join date: 7 Jul 2005
Posts: 99
01-09-2008 01:42
Northern Rock was backed by regulation The Bank of england and the UK govt. who is backing these SL banks? How do people tell which had honest intentions from the fraudulant ones? quite simply most people cannot. These are NOT banks there other players for the most part "playing" at it. The tranparency of some of these so called banks is worthless its not supplied under any regulatory requirement and could easily be a complete fiction this is one policy decision from LL that was long overdue and I agree with
1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11