Banned without A warning

Ahha so i must dissect this OK, good! mind you he said this in a communication class not his standard english class. Communication is a two way street divided into several steps. [idea] >[encryption] >[Transfer] >[decoded]> [comprehension] > [Idea]
and then it fallows the same path back across to the first person. So when you place all the burden of this cycle on the speaker or writer and chastise them when they fail it's usually out of fear, It may have taken twice the amount of effort for that person to encode that message as for you trying to decode it, there is big difference between saying i don't understand, please reiterate, and chastising or ,correcting there mistakes, on the order of several magnitudes. IE: is this what you meant, is way different from you need a frickin coma over here!



Perfect in this case is what ever gets the point across. Leet though hard to understand when you first learn it, does get the point across,as does texting shorthand,however with those two sometimes the point is to confuse or hide what is being said so it does not fall into the wrong hands IE the parents.so yes those teachers who got disciplined for accepting homework in the for mentioned should have been.there jobs being teachers of english not teachers of leet.Now the etymology of a word is usually very entertaining but that is neither here nor there.



And to somebody with ADD or some type of dyslexia all those letters and punctuations are just as distracting if not more so and they worked threw it to get the base for the idea down on paper.So when a person does chastise or ridicule somebody for spelling punctuation or composition errors outside of asking is this what you meant it is out of fear or some short coming of that person,that they are trying to hide.

And i do have to concur is does speak for it's self very loud and clear, it is a very honest evaluation of what goes on in the world.uttered by a man who taught the subject. Something you don't get in school a lot, in todays world especially. i believe he understood that writing and the ability to use good english is a skill and just that, not unlike throwing a ball ,shooting a basket or playing scrabble. there are many people out there who are never going to hit a lay-up on a regular basis no matter how hard they try, practice may improve your chances but there is a physical limit to your success, your body and mind are hard wired that way.The same is true with writing,spelling and comprehension.

As taught in every communication class across the globe it is a two way street and the burden must be shared.


"Ridicule is a public confession of fear." - Vanna Bonta

Ah very true, but it's generally lazy, inconsiderate and possibly stupid people who think this way.

Are the standards *THAT* low then?

Pep (At least Mjolnir has the excuse of using English as a foreign language - I presume?)

But nobody said anything about needing a comma anywhere. Nor did the note to which you're responding say anything about chastising. In fact, that person hasn't commented on the original post at all.

As you say, communication is a two way street. If you're going to be fair about it, then you have to acknowledge the needs of the readers as well as the writers. There are many more readers than writers, so it behooves the writer to put more effort into it. If it's twice the effort to write as it is for one person to read, then it's only half the effort to write as it is for four people to read. That doesn't mean demanding perfection from the writers, but it also doesn't mean the readers should be the only ones making the effort.


I can't speak about dyslexia, but I can about ADD, as mine is rather severe. Many people with ADD have trouble learning grammar and punctuation, but that's because the subjects can be boring. But when it comes to actually reading and writing, proper punctuation is a benefit. It doesn't interfere with formulating the ideas - the idea is already complete long before I need to worry about where the comma goes. When reading, punctuation and spelling are absolutely critical. Punctuation breaks the sentence into ideas, so I can focus on understanding. Without punctuation, figuring out where a thought is supposed to end is the distraction. Stumbling over misspelled words is the distraction.

People with ADD benefit from structure and routine. The rules of English are part of that.


If you wish to consider it one of my shortcomings that I find it easier to read standard English material, and more difficult to read non-standard English, then fine. I'll freely acknowledge that that's one of my shortcomings, and that I'm not trying to hide it at all. But remember that standard English is the language chosen for this communication medium, not l33t, and not some shorthand intended for small ten-digit keyboards.

But please don't accuse me of ridiculing anyone. As near as I can tell, your English teacher and that lone hit-and-run post are the only two examples of ridicule in this thread so far.


Agreed, but with one important difference. In the US, English is a required course for twelve years of school to get a high school diploma. Colleges typically require two more years of coursework in subjects that require and improve writing skills. While basketball was a gym activity in high school, it was barely taught at all, and certainly not a requirement to graduate.

No one is asking that people write with the eloquence of Gore Vidal or precision of William F. Buckley. Yes, it's a skill, and yes not everyone can excel at it. But expecting people to write at a decent high school level is not unreasonable.

An example of why punctuation is essential for meaning.

Woman! Without her, man is an animal.

Woman, without her man, is an animal.

Pep (QED)

I wouldn't worry about getting banned. The owner of the business will be the one missing out on possible sales.

Considering the way I tend to read things ...... for something like that, I don't pay too much attention to the punctuation and will mull over the meaning. If any other text is around that can be used to infer what is meant ... I'll use it.

Any woman that actually needs a man is an animal.(he shoots,and it bounces around the rim a few times and falls out.)

This infatuation with grammar is possibly necessary if we had a large amount of LowQs, but I try to believe that we don't, though at time do get reminded I'm a horrible optimist. We have all read "eats, shoots and leaves" or at lest heard the joke. but nobody is working on there thesis here (i know there are polls that hint that is wrong but i really do hope it's an illusion, there is nothing happening here worthy for getting a collage degree in. this is not to say holding classes here is a waste just the study of SL that is questionable.) I have concentrated on mostly the developmental disorders, ADD, dyslexia etc, to point out peoples ill manners. I have not even brought up that SL is a multinational culture.

While we are on the subject and for your FYI a lot of the great writers use horrible grammar just look at it and there spelling is only passable because an editor cleaned it up and editors like most english teachers are frustrated authors at heart.

Though probably acceptable behavior in the 50s and before, doubtfully but possible, today it is simply droll. Getting pissy about anybodies use of english in todays world, with our present understating of how the mind works, is totally and emphatically rude, end of line. it actually has the opposite effect it does not make you look brighter than the targeted person it makes you look more dull,because obviously you have comprehension issues your not addressing. (She shoot,she score,nothing but net)

QFT

whoe. kares,?...

I think we have to make some allowances for the grammar and sentence structure of everyone here. We also have to understand that we come from different cultures (we all know that American English is NOT the English we write and speak in England - or Canada, for that matter. So English is a second languag efor most of us. It actually is for some of my real family members. We are tending to discriminate because a person has typed rapidly or is simply in a "stream of consciousness" and is doing his or her best to unravel complex emotions in an alien medium - whatever you may think, a forum like this is a relatively recent phenomenon for us to grasp. But there should be no "rules" per se. Language evolves. I had good tutors (I hated school so ended up with tutors) and I still rebelled and wrote English the way I wanted to. I never had a university education but judging by the rather snitty replies and constant demands for standardized English, I must say I heave a sigh of relief because I am sure some of us here do have degrees but sound exclusionary or even eurocentric in their quest for perfection. Demands for mechanical correctness of the language can remove immediacy. Shakespeare was breaking boundaries when he wrote his plays and I think he would applaud the new directions we are experiencing. Read Othello and you will find that Shakespeare was capturing the speech patterns of a second language speaker and, yes, there were Africans living in London at the time so he could research his topic and sympathize with the speaker who confronts prejudice and isolation.

People can ban you, that is their right.. sorry.
I would not take it personally and there are many other places to shop. soooo forget about it and move on. You ranted, I'm sure you feel better for it.

Not everyone has autoreturn on, and im not sure the rats would be a reason to ban... I like rats myelf.. and so do my snakes.

I agree, you had no right to ask for your money back. Obviously you liked the outfit enough to buy it and had no issue until the said ban....

Advice: when you rezz on someones land, they are in fact offering you a gift of sorts respect them enough to clean your stuff up...

/me blinks

But I so liked the movie better..

Then you'll agree with me that Mel makes a great Hamlet

Yes numerous works on ADD, ADHD, dyslexia and the other developmental disorder that effect how the brain functions, not a malfunction but just the way it works. And yes if you can't decipher 95-99% of the posts in this forum then you probably have a comprehension issue, it's no biggie that is how your mind works just like not being able to spell is how that persons mind works.(the whole hunter mind vs the farmer mind is a fascinating idea that does appear to have merit)







You will notice i have not defended laziness , quit the opposite i have pointed out that communication IS a two way street and lumping the burden on one party is very, very lazy. Respect is exactly what I'm talking about, they may be making that effort to communicate, your not making the effort to understand. You have chastise me for making presumptions to protect your presumption, that being that laziness is at the root here. You have and continue to presume everybody is able to use proper english and spelling, the point is you don't know why their words are poorly put together; and that kind sir is what makes it rude.





I have already pointed out the down side to leet and texting shorthand, however i will now note that most with ADD can remember triplet pairing easier than anything else and that a goodly proportion of messaging is in just that - BFF, LOL, BRB ,etc, etc, etc. That person has already made the effort they opened a Message box and started to type,where sir is your holy effert?

Yes Jig Chippewa i have mainly concentrated on how the mind works and not mentioned the ESL group my bad!

Links to any of these studies please.

It isn't that I can't comprehend their writing. I choose not to subject myself to it. 95% of the posts in this forum are legible. But when someone makes a post like the first in this thread, I will not read it or attempt to read it.

They are choosing to write that way. I have problems with my memory, typing, spelling and word choices due to a neurological condition. I make the effort to correct my errors when I spot them. I make the effort to use the shift and enter keys. So there is my "holy effert" (sic). I don't ask anyone to do anything I don't do myself. Sure it takes some time and work, but I have respect for the people who will try to read what I write.

English not being the person's first language is nothing but a cop out. I am friends with several people who do not have English as their first language. Sometimes words are used out of context or a wrong word is used, but that is easily overlooked in the grand scheme of their communication. A wall of text like the OP posted is not easily overlooked, it is a sign of lack of effort.

Oh no, not Eurocentric! Of course English is an European language and like it or not, this is an English speaking forum for the most part.

You seriously don't know about ADD and dyslexia? OK,well i might suggest starting on wikipedia for a quick over view(only really good for an over view the info there is old and incomplete) then move over to the Attention Deficit Disorder Association web sight. mind you I'm starting to believe that dyslexia,ADD,ADHD AADD and the like are actually symptoms of a larger condition and I'm not alone that is why i find the whole hunter mind/farmer mind thing interesting.

I always find it interesting when somebody uses the "I'm in the same court play" and then charges ahead all hard lined. It always brings up two questions. Is there malady that sever and if yes then have they forgotten the struggle they had to overcome to get here?

I'm sorry if i bruised the male ego here, that was not my goal. But may I point out that for most of us english class was over many, many years ago, and i have never seen a real english teacher correct an adults spelling grammar or construction unless they we're a close friend,and most will tell you that to do so is extremely rude.

I'm not forcing you to try and read something you can't,I DO have compassion. If your mind truly can't decipher something and it drives you nuts then move on without comment end of line, but don't judge how hard somebody is trying because neither you nor i truly knows.

Honestly, dyslexia and ADD/ADHD are a cop out as much as English being a second, third, or fourth language.

My spouse in real life has dyslexia so bad that letters actually move around on the page. However, that did not stop her from learning to communicate better in text than most people I know. I know it takes quite an effort to type out a coherent message for those with dyslexia (or insert neurological problem of your choice here).

Point is, if you plan on communicating in the written word, it behooves you to make an honest effort to type out a coherent message. Also, you guys are making a huge assumption about the original poster. S/He wrote something out that many of us would not, or could not take the time to read because the post was, simply put, a mess.

You can blame dyslexia, being a non-english speaker, ADD, ADHD, Strep Throat, Ebola, Vibriole Vulnificus, or whatever you want for the way something is written and/or read, but the simple truth is the original poster either won't, or doesn't care to take the time to communicate effectively. Ultimately, it is up to the original poster to figure out how to get a point across. It's not up to me to translate unreadable text.

How hard do you have to try to find the shift key?

Pep (Your arguments are only of interest to me if you can express them adequately, which you have signally failed to do)

QFT


Oooh, a new topic for my sigs!

Psst! Don't eat tainted shellfish.

LOL. we (two Australians) were in LA when that movie was about to come out, in a department store, and overheard two employees we had been talking to discussing the movie and one said "...yes but Hamlet with an Australian accent?" Then looked really embarrassed when she realised we had overheard.

My wife: "Why, do you think the character would be better with an American accent?"

No answer....