A reply to Brenda

> Wait, wait just a Goddamn minute. He's from Boston. You're from Boston. You should be the first one to grok it.......hmmmmmm in fact.....we've never seen the two of you together at the same time in any thread, have we? I think we need to get to the bottom of this, faster than you ca say "Charles Emerson Winchester".

*insert x-files music here*

> *But I do agree, no group should be above any rules on this forum, if any still exist. But if a rule is bent, we don't need 50 people pointing it out in public, and it can be done more civilly that it often is.

That whole specifc issue aside as I rather not add any more to that specific thread, I agree whats done is done. However in a general sense if we are policing ourselves then yes we need people to point out these things. Can it be done in a more civil tone? Prob I'd agree so. However when the people in question, like the fore mentioned thread, act like a 7 yr old having a temper tentrum (how I view several of those people in the previous thread) in the face of clearly obvious rule violations it nullifies the self policing. Thus in effect makes it a. either a free for all or b. (and what I think they prefer) a clique/self serving enviroment where a specifiuc group feels seperior over others. I have seen both happen in various forums in my travels. Some are natural progressions of the forum eveloution others are forced by events.

This forum obviouslly has several 'old timers' who feel a sense of entitlement (as can happen on any forum more then several months old). And us n00bs (and apparently other old timers) of SL see that for what it is and point it out. They don't like that, get defensive and sadly goes down hill from there.

My point of contention however is the, at the heart, their most basic reply; We know we are going against the rules, we dont care becasue we feel enetiled to do so, so just shut up and deal with it. We don't want to hear you point it out but you have to deal with us doing such. That really is what they are saying and I take issue with that, again, on the most basic level if we are to be self policing ourselves.

Please note, I don't have any interest in dreging up THAT specific convo/debate again. My point here to you is in the big picture, the 'how do we act when no active moderation' and how do we police oursevles and what standards are there?

Its a difficult question and you may not agree with my stance however I hope you atleast agree the question is worthy of disucssion.

Does anyone know what this guy is talking about or what thread he is referring to?

Couldn't you just have used PM?

No, that dead horse *obviously* needs more public beating.

harder, Strauss, harder...

I have answered the OP in PM and Ar'ed the thread asking it be locked. *But since we are modless I guess no one will.

Is this when you know you have made it? A thread is named for you...

May I ask who is policing the people policing themselves?

The SLU!

Second Life Underground.

But beware, you must not acknowledge their existance without bringing their wrath down upon you!

Bit ironic to complain about people "being above the rules" of this forum by blatantly breaking more than one forum guidelines with this thread.

Um... welcome to the forums...

The melting pot for personalities from all walks of life, where people really don't change based on rebuttals and it's likely best to accept everyone as they are ('cause it's saner that way).

Thread is against forum rules:

Not to address specific people with a thread. You should be PMing.

No, it means you've become just part of the problem.....

Call me part of the clique, I really don't give a damn. But I stand by my friends.

Brenda, you are not part of the problem. Not even close. The problem is the small group of outsiders who revel in their "I'm an outsider. I am gonna piss in everyone's pot." As for the claim of "old timers". Yes some of us are invested here. We have friendships. We have in jokes. If someone wants to join the group (not the cartel, the forum community as a whole) they are made welcome. But they have to make an effort to find their niche in the community. Even Ricardo and Elex are members of this community.

We have been left to our own devices. Do we follow every little rule passed down by the ones on high? Hell no. And I will give you one good reason we don't. We pay the freaking bills around here. We the customers have taken what we have been given and are using it the best way we see fit. The forums have run very well with no moderation. No great flame wars, no porn posted, very little trolling.

Here is another reply to Brenda:

I don't know where the car is. The last time I saw it, it was rolling backwards towards the Hudson. And I'm afraid the whole bag of Cheeze Doodles was inside. Sorry.

To be fair Resident Answers is not a community as such.. its a support, advice board for end users of a product. The cartel clubhouse is an excellent place and I do pop over now and then to terrorize people, but in all honesty as a separate issue no one should have to make any kind of effort to find a damn niche on a support board of a product that they pay to use.

The only thing Tiana, is that if no 'regulars' (i.e. community) were here to ANSWER the questions, RA wouldn't be very helpful.


*BRENDA, Please pick up some bread on your way home. Thank you

LOL

You always seem to come up with some sort of reply that makes me burst out laughing.




~mark checks his watch..mmm...almost lunch...I wonder if there are Cheeto's in the caf today...~

It does not take a community to answer questions though. It takes a poster. To imply that someone who may wish to take part in asking or answering questions has to find their "niche" is just plain wrong.

I found my quiche. Spinach and Swiss. Trout had sat on it.

Oh, niche... Nevermind.

How is it not a community? It is a gathering place. All groups form a community. We have people on these boards who have stepped up, answer questions, help one another. We have those who are quiet and unassuming, lurking for the most part. I have never seen a forum in with people did not have niches/roles they filled. But they have to find out where they fit, how they want to fit.

If they choose to not be a member of the community, then why do they throw stones at those who do.

I am not talking about the Cartel or the hangout in any of this. That is a separate issue.

Get back on the wheel and don't come off until I say...actually until I have ran a poll on it, counted the votes, called for a re-count, scratched my head some, bit my bottom lip and to save arguments started another poll...

Chris what I am trying to say is that Resident Answers is the last forum on earth that you should demand someone find their niche in a set community. There are plenty of other SL forums out there where you would expect a community feel, because people will more than likely seek them out for that fact. Resident Answers is a support for a product. People will come here maybe ask one question and never come back, they are looking for an answer to a product they are paying for. People may be lurking who have never posted but see a question they can answer so do so...and never post again. You are very misguided if you believe that a community feel should be prevalent here and that we should all have our own little part of it..once we fit in.

The banter and the jokes are great, being fortunate enough to know those that post regularly is a bonus, but to expect people to have to make an effort on a support forum for a product is wrong. No one is above anyone on this forum and no one has the right to expect anything, the colour of our money is all the same.

Tiana, (I'm not picking on you - I like the points you are making).
I think you and Chris are kind of saying similar things when you talk of 'lurkers'. If I'm not mistaking, the way I understood him, they are also part of this community.

You are both using the same word, but it has a different meaning for you, no?
I'm not going to quote the dictionary here, but community basically means a group of people.

If LL actually answered the questions people asked, I would be more inclined to agree with you, but they do not. No one is payed to be here. If there was absolutely no feeling of 'community', fewer of us would check in here to answer questions. It certainly wouldn't be a daily occurrence. People would only drop by when they had a question, then maybe answer one in return (if they had any class).

I do respect your point of you, though. The Primary reason for coming here should be to help others. Can't we do both? Help AND feel as if we are part of a community?





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I see what you're saying here and I don't disagree. Nobody should have to make an effort to join the community to enjoy the benefits of this forum. There are a lot of people who don't, in fact. We see new people come in all the time, ask a few questions and once their questions are answered, we never see them again. Their are a lot of people I've met at the hangout who say they are just lurkers and have learned a lot from these forums. Those people are all completely welcome here as far as I'm concerned.

Chris seemed to be addressing those professional outsiders who make no effort to join the community, then rail on and on about how it's a clique and people are unwelcome and how dare we enjoy ourselves, blah, blah, blah, which is total BS. If they make any effort to make friends here, they will. Having a community on a support forum is a benefit to the forums. The regulars all know each other and know their area of expertise. For example, if I see a question about scripting, I know that Qie and a few others are whizzes at scripting. If I see a land question and Raymond or Desmond have answered, then I know the problem is solved. If it's politics, then I know Chris has it all wrong. (I'm kidding). I know all the others as well, and I'm not excluding them by singling out a few names. I'm just saying that the community is a network of sorts that exists to help people who come here with questions, but as a secondary matter, exists also to enjoy SL and the group of friends we have here.

So, you're correct. Nobody should have to be a member of the community here. Anybody is welcome to be, but they don't HAVE to be. Anyone is welcome to show up and post a question, and someone here will take a shot at answering it. Anyone who wants to is welcome to lurk and not post. But if someone makes no effort to join the community, then they have no right to complain about not being a member of the community.