Are people holding SL back?

Marcush- your whole post was informative and held great perspective- this part of it though really spoke volumes. It shows you have an insightful grasp of these concepts- would you enable PM please? Would like to discuss your views further- (Notorious for picking peoples brains)

I think most SL artists without a professional background actually started by creating some things for themselves, and overtime got to a point where something "was actually pretty good". There's a big difference between buying a skybox, or trying to make one for yourself, probably tweaking and adjusting it for ages to fit your needs, at some point tweaking out all the flaws you made as a beginner.
The first one won't be able to suddenly make good skyboxes, not even with enough knowledge of the buildingtools in SL.
The second one will have developed at least as many building skills, but will also have a feeling of design, practical limitations, a "feel" for a layout that feels good.

As a creator, you have to constantly ask yourself things like: "Would I live in that?", "Would I wear that?" or "Can I actually use that?". Even if you intend to sell something right from the start, you have to be able to say yes to one of those questions. If you can't, you're basically saying you're creating something crap.

So, since I'm male, any female clothing that I make is crap by definition

Well, you can ask yourself a variation: "Would I honestly wear that if I were a female?"

Well.. I uhm attempted to make a man's jacket... it has been reborn as definitely female clothing- I can't make guys' clothes

Not if you're gay.

What's wrong with cardboard? *pouts and kicks over her cardboard box fort*

The problem with this model is that it doesn't work so well in the market anymore - because the top end of the market consists of pure professional creators who _never_ use what they make, because all their time is spent creating. They wouldn't live in the house, because they'll never live in a house, because what do they want a house for?

I do agree that SL desperately needs an upgrade to the build tools, though - they've hardly changed since 2005, and I get the impression they haven't changed very much since 2003.

I think basically that SL's "free pass" of "wow, it's a virtual world" has gone - and that affects everyone, not just LL's business model. "SL has no competition" is easily said, but it still has to compete with all other forms of entertainment to be the thing that someone decides to do tonight. Moreover, during the free pass, it was much more socially acceptable to make (for example) a ballerina avatar and perform - now the pass has gone, you're just someone who's spent $ on an avatar and is running animations and somehow thinks she is special lol. The Roflcopters roam the skies, and their searchlights won't let the truth escape any more. That was the risk of trying to go mainsteam too early So, better stick to freebies, camp, and dance - it's what all the cool kids are doing..

A lot of people, I think, come to SL as a Premium, get a piece of land, rez a few random objects on it, build a plywood wall on one side and a floor textured as one gigantic tile, get bored with SL and leave, oblivious to the fact that someone else might have to live next to the mess for months or even a year or more. I have had several such neighbours. I even have a piece of cluttered, neglected land next to me whose owner's account has renewed although the land has been untouched for over a year, I've never seen the resident and their profile is empty!

Remeber only those that activly look for fualts and problems,are the only ones who find what they are looking for in life! or to quote robin williams - joke them if they can't take a screw!

or to quote feild of dream- if you build it they will come.

I am very strong in my belief that creativity can't be limited to those we deem as good. Anyone and everyone who wants to make something, do so. Don't worry about it being good..just do it.

Creativity is like love, it has to flow and like love it has to be free from the control of others by whatever means.

I rejoice when I see the clumsy work as much as I do when I see the excellent work because it means this is a healthy world that is not limited or filtered but open to all.

You know, if they got rid of all the residents, so many problems with SL would be solved.

'course, then they could also shut down the place.

What she said.

That is a rather depressing thought really. I know of some clothes designers who also work in (for example) the gaming industrie. And yes, some texture creators are professional artists, some scripters are professional programmers.
But in the list of top creators from SL are just as many people who are talented amateurs, who spend 2 or 3 weekends or often even more, to design something. SL Content creation isn't something to make a living of. A few manage to, but there's enough competition (not to mention permission-hacks) that are making this very close to impossible. Customers don't care if someone is a professional creator or not. All that matters is the result, whether it's from a talented amateur or a pro.

On top of that: people do like their uniqueness. Even professionals are limited in the amount of content they can create. The bigger the name, the bigger the chance that your SL neighbour happens to have the exact same thing. So finding that unknown quality creator to get something more unique is part of "the game" as well. And you will probably take that small glitch in the design for granted, and just cover it up one way or another.


Even clumsy work can be brilliant. The first car in SL, though that was created long before I started, was probably very clumsy, and even the tools available at that time probably allowed for "more". But that doesn't mean it wasn't a brilliant piece on its own, and a milestone in SL.

The same thing goes for a great many things. The first house, the first SL pet kitten, the first gun, the first SL Studio, the first multipose engines. Without doubt, these could've been way better right from the start. But they're all milestones in SL history. You have to start somewhere. If people never made clumsy work, these things would never have been developed either.

Just look up Yadni Monde's autobiography. As every creator in SL, and probably one of the more respected ones at that, he admits as much. You start, you fall, you build lousy stuff, but you also develop, improve. And SL gives a lot of freedom to develop. As long as people allow you to develop, instead of stamping you down, saying you're not allowed to because it's too ugly or not good enough yet.

Gay people aren't transvestites, any more than straight people are. I'm not offended, but at least get your stereotypes right!

You're right, although the marketing system in SL is unfortunately weighted against amateurs, and people aren't willing to shop around (the price of the highest classified is a good guide to that - if people shop around and make their own decisions, advertising's effectiveness should be reduced, thus people would be prepared to pay less for it). But the difficulty is..



.. that there's a horrible feeling, to me at least, that this evolution has stopped. LL haven't added much in the way of new features recently, but a greater concern is that social evolution seems to have stopped too - largely because of the paralyzing effects of a) camping, b) trademark infringement, and c) the cool kids in the clubs. Why try to do anything new or passionate in SL when it will be hours of work resulting only in a single side remark before the next hoooooowwwwwl?

I think if you dislike the quality that a lot of people churn out in SL (and you might not like my stuff. You've seen my yurt in Hartley. You can see why I've got concerns about zoning.) what you are really reacting to is the quantity.

There just isn't very much there so there is very little that is original. Right now I'm the only one doing tube dresses whom I know. There are two or three of us doing ethnic hair. If you want a modern beehive or a dry suit or a pair of no-script no-rez skis (Most snow country is no-script no-rez), you know to whom to speak. Yes, the skis are cartoonish and have a kente pattern, but the thick poles stay visible when walking through the snow. Tube dresses can look like toilet bowls or buritos and alternative silhouette bathing suits make your avi look fat which is kind of fun. Feeling shameless about one's shape is very liberating.

Now, as a four month beginner builder, I shouldn't find myself this original. I build to fill my needs because most of the time, I simply can't find what I want. There is really good reason for this.

Second Life is much smaller than you think. Here -- http://www.useit.com/alertbox/participation_inequality.html is a piece on participation inequality by Jakob Nielsen.

Second Life is not a great city of a million souls. It's a small town of roughly 10,000 active members. Out of that little town how many of us build habitually either for ourselves or for the retail market? And remember not only do you live in a "little town," there is no Syracuse 50 miles up the road and no Lands' End catalog sitting on your dresser. Everything you find is either made yourself or manufactured in the little town.

have desided that in RL anyways 95% of the fasion designers are one of two types of people, guy men who accually hate women, or frumpy women that hate skinny women

Wow this has gone on longer than I would have thought. Anyway, I started building for me, and people would ask, 'where's your store?!'. So, I decided to have one, or two or seven.

Recently I decided to have 0 but have had my arms twisted into making a sim with a friend that will host both our stores. I still build for me, problem is people like it and if I don't sell it I'll get nagged to death. That's not a bad thing. Who will say NO to getting paid to have fun?

I believe it was a reference to the notion that a lot of the most well known fashion designers are gay. Trnasvestism was not the issue.

I have been in game for awhile now(lot longer than my avie states), & yes I have seen many (in my opinion) bad builds. However I have also seen many phenominal builds that has left me speechless (some of which was built by the same builder that had the bad build). What I see here is the learning process of many individuals, not everyone can or even will be a Micheal Angelo builder...& certainly even if they will be they won't be initially. There are many different skill levels as there are people & each will learn at there own pace. It's like the way people rib the newbies that has first started...did you not first start there yourself? Let the light of your experience shine on the path for those that wish to learn. Hmmm...food for thought, more of both in game tutorials & out game tutorials?