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Virtual Ignorance?

HoneyBear Lilliehook
Owner, The Mall at Cherry
Join date: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 4,500
12-20-2008 06:45
From: Avawyn Muircastle
Yes that is way most medical reports are done. If it's totally impossible to understand what the doctor is saying, we leave a blank to be filled in.

However, typing 5000 units of insulin is pretty ridiculous if one is a seasoned transcribers. For newbies, just type what you hear and leave the corrections to the doctors because a newbie might think 5000 units is the standard dose while a seasoned transcriber knows otherwise.



You are absolutely amazing. There are more misstatements and assumptions in this response than I could possibly have time to address.

Seriously, I'd put you on ignore if your BS wasn't so amusing at times.
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Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 06:55
From: Desmond Shang
Oh, that's a fairly common thing. It's very easy to bore the daylights out of a smart kid, in which case they appear stupid. Given enough years of boredom, the transformation may as well be real...

Some university colleges have enrollment criteria that effectively screen out all but the smartest 2 to 4% of the enrolling population; the net effect is that everyone there pretty much has 'genius' IQ as measured by the silly tests. Not that it matters one bit; these people still have the same petty drama and do stupid things. I've seen a lot of booksmarts manufactured by parental value systems, creating young people whose sole goal was to be top of the class at the great expense of all else. It's a heavy price to pay.

It's no wonder that stupid people out-reproduce the smart by a huge factor. I honestly think that too much book-learnin' really *does* eat up the afternoons one might have spent with the girl next door, learning all about life. Also, stupid people are generally comfy with being stupid - none of *them* throw themselves off the Social Sciences Tower roof with regularity for bad grades. Even taking into account the darwinistic forces of natural selection that apply heavily to the stupid on this earth, smart people still manage to keep themselves in the minority.

Maybe I'm unenlightened, but I do believe in stupid people. No denying it. I swear, my cat had more awareness and predictive cognition than some people I've known. Okay, maybe cats don't talk, but then again, my cat didn't carry on about celebrity gossip and smarmy tv dramas either.

Alright, back to the back-and-forth about grammar and suchlike. I'm getting some popcorn...
I've noticed that smarter people usually have a good idea of how smart they are compared with others while less smart people tend to believe themselves to be coming off as more clever than they in fact are.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 06:57
From: Rhaorth Antonelli
check out this book by Aidan C. Bell



It looks like it could be good. (I insist on intelligent protagonists though.)
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 06:59
From: Oryx Tempel
Did I ever mention that I think you're one of the coolest people in SL? *hug* You rock.
Why thank you. I feel exactly that way about you. *big hug*.
_____________________



Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 07:03
From: Olila Oh
I might not know who Stephen King or even John Lennon is... But that shouldn't be an issue in this forum.

If this was a forum about 'Russian authors' I might assume that most people would know 'Dostojevskij' without me having to get into that.

Not everyone here is from USA or UK... I'm Swedish.
I don't write posts in here assuming everyone know about ABBA, Björn Borg or Pippi Långstrump... And if I should I wouldn't mind explaining... :)

Since this is a forum that is discussing Second Life - I assume that most people here know the most basic stuff about THAT. I cant assume anything else really...
And that has nothing to do with treating anyone as ignorant. Its a cultural thing since people from all over the world are residents in SL.

Forums is about communication. With that in mind the main issue for me is that people get what I mean... (wether I spelled it wright or wrong) Never mind IQ - thats just about logic.

In forums maybe 'EQ' (Emotional Intelligence) - is more useful... ;)
One of the things I enjoy about this forum is that there all kinds of different areas of expertise. I learn new things, about all kinds of subjects, fairly often.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
12-20-2008 07:04
From: Talarus Luan
That little red triangle icon is the "report post to moderator" button.
<----------------------------------


There goes the neighborhood.
Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
12-20-2008 07:05
From: Kaimi Kyomoon
I've noticed that smarter people usually have a good idea of how smart they are compared with others while less smart people tend to believe themselves to be coming off as more clever than they in fact are.
QFT

Pep (Smart people also know how dumb *they* really are as well - even when no-one else notices, heheheh!)
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Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 07:11
From: Pserendipity Daniels


Pep (Smart people also know how dumb *they* really are as well - even when no-one else notices, heheheh!)
;) Smart people are probably better at hiding their mistakes. (They're also better at rationalizing their emotional responses to things.)
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
12-20-2008 07:14
From: Kaimi Kyomoon

Just to show that I'm paying attention and to justify my ego's need to define itself by reviewing my own knowledge: I think that if 50% of the population have IQ's under 100 and 50% have IQ's over that would mean that 100 would be the "median" IQ, not the average.


It actually works more like a bell curve in that the vast majority of people score in the 90-110 range, with substantially smaller numbers the higher and lower you go.

"Half" of all people are not below 100, nor are "Half" 100 and above. Its more like "More than Half" are around 100, and "Less than Half" are either below or above.

-----------

Of course as a side point "IQ Tests" do not measure Intelligence, they measure "IQ" by subjecting people to a standardized series of tests and attempting to run the resulting answers so some form of supposedly scientific analysis. It is not even guaranteed that someone taking different types of IQ tests will get the same "IQ", let alone different people achieving objective scores using different types of tests.
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 07:20
From: Colette Meiji
It actually works more like a bell curve in that the vast majority of people score in the 90-110 range, with substantially smaller numbers the higher and lower you go.

"Half" of all people are not below 100, nor are "Half" 100 and above. Its more like "More than Half" are around 100, and "Less than Half" are either below or above.
Thank you Colette. That is a clearer picture.

-----------

From: Colette Meiji
Of course as a side point "IQ Tests" do not measure Intelligence, they measure "IQ" by subjecting people to a standardized series of tests and attempting to run the resulting answers so some form of supposedly scientific analysis. It is not even guaranteed that someone taking different types of IQ tests will get the same "IQ", let alone different people achieving objective scores using different types of tests.

For sure. IQ test mainly measure a person's ability to figure out the correct answers on IQ tests. Which is probably somewhat indicative of their abilities to figure other things out.

It seems as if people with more need to be admired or accepted sometimes actually come across to those they're trying to prove themselves to as less smart than they really are.

Personally I think Good heartedness and generosity count for a lot too.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
12-20-2008 07:27
From: Kaimi Kyomoon
;) Smart people are probably better at hiding their mistakes. (They're also better at rationalizing their emotional responses to things.)
/me is going to spend the afternoon checking whether Kaimi has installed spycams in his house . . .

Pep (maybe experience *is* a great teacher if you are anything to go by!)
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Sling Trebuchet
Deleted User
Join date: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 4,548
12-20-2008 07:29
From: Kaimi Kyomoon
Thank you Colette. That is a clearer picture.

-----------

For sure. IQ test mainly measure a persons ability to figure out the correct answers on IQ tests. Which is probably somewhat indicative of their abilities to figure other things out. Personally I think Good heartedness and generosity count for a lot too.


Generally, the more IQ tests one does, the better one gets at figuring out the correct answers.
Ditto for indications of intelligence like simplex crosswords, sudoku.
Tests measure one's ability time to pass the test at the time of the test.

I've come across people who are wonderfully gifted in matters matematical, logical, creative, but who absolutly suck bigtime at being pleasant and/or honest and/or in any way bearable.
Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
12-20-2008 07:40
From: Colette Meiji
There goes the neighborhood.


Is it any worse than the already existing forum patrol? :p
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 10:10
From: Sling Trebuchet
Generally, the more IQ tests one does, the better one gets at figuring out the correct answers.
Ditto for indications of intelligence like simplex crosswords, sudoku.
Tests measure one's ability time to pass the test at the time of the test.

I've come across people who are wonderfully gifted in matters matematical, logical, creative, but who absolutly suck bigtime at being pleasant and/or honest and/or in any way bearable.
I think you are quite right. Lots of practice can be more important than high intelligence when it comes to doing things well. And being smart doesn't necessarily mean caring about others. And smart people can be just as blinded as anyone by emotion.

But once they put their mind to figuring out how to do well at something being smarter probably helps.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Amity Slade
Registered User
Join date: 14 Feb 2007
Posts: 2,183
12-20-2008 10:55
I have a mistake in thinking that I believe most people make.

If I do not understand what someone is telling me, I assume that it is the other person's fault for not speaking intelligently and clearly. If I do not understand why someone else has made a certain decision, I assume that they are not as good at making decisions as I am. If I do not understand another's behavior, I assume that the other person never learned proper behavior.

Those are all bad assumptions. And even though I intellectually recognize they are bad assumptions, I still make them, habitually, all the time.

I think there are two problems:

1. Face-to-face communication is mostly non-verbal. I remember in my Introductory Communication class in college, communication is 90% non-verbal. (To this day, I do not understand how it was quantified.) But if face-fo-face is 90% non-verbal, then quick-and-dirty math tells me that we communicate about one-tenth as effectively in Second Life than in real life.

2. Though Second Life is made up of, ultimately, real people, the rules of socialization are far different in Second Life than any we experience in real life. Someone entering Second Life for the first time is experiencing a culture shock equivalent to the rural person who first moves to the big city, or the American who visits China for the first time. It is not easy to fit into a new social environment.

Remember that all of us have been learning the rules of communication and socialization all our lives. We have been practicing and perfecting them all our lives. And most of us are still learning. If it takes that long to learn in real life, why would it be so easy to assimilate in a day in Second Life?

In real life, I am an adult, with three post-secondary degrees, who has lived professionally from her ability to communicate and negotiate with people. And yet, even I was once a Second Life n00b.
LittleMe Jewell
...........
Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
12-20-2008 11:17
From: Kaimi Kyomoon
This doesn't seem to be the link for the Wal Mart example...But anyway I understood what you meant when you said "average" and I'm sorry about my nit picking - although I assure you that at no point did it make me feel in any way superior to you, Lil.
Geez - who knows how I managed to mess that link up. Here is what I was reading - quite interesting and entertaining in some ways:

http://www.geocities.com/rnseitz/Definition_of_IQ.html
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-Lil

Why do you sit there looking like an envelope without any address on it?
~Mark Twain~

Optimism is denial, so face the facts and move on.
♥♥♥
Lil's Yard Sale / Inventory Cleanout: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Triggerfish/52/27/22
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/littleme_jewell
LittleMe Jewell
...........
Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
12-20-2008 11:22
From: Kaimi Kyomoon
I've noticed that smarter people usually have a good idea of how smart they are compared with others while less smart people tend to believe themselves to be coming off as more clever than they in fact are.
No way - I is way smarter than all y'alls is.
:D :p

_____________________
♥♥♥
-Lil

Why do you sit there looking like an envelope without any address on it?
~Mark Twain~

Optimism is denial, so face the facts and move on.
♥♥♥
Lil's Yard Sale / Inventory Cleanout: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Triggerfish/52/27/22
.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/littleme_jewell
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 13:10
From: Amity Slade
I have a mistake in thinking that I believe most people make.

If I do not understand what someone is telling me, I assume that it is the other person's fault for not speaking intelligently and clearly. If I do not understand why someone else has made a certain decision, I assume that they are not as good at making decisions as I am. If I do not understand another's behavior, I assume that the other person never learned proper behavior.

Those are all bad assumptions. And even though I intellectually recognize they are bad assumptions, I still make them, habitually, all the time.

I think there are two problems:

1. Face-to-face communication is mostly non-verbal. I remember in my Introductory Communication class in college, communication is 90% non-verbal. (To this day, I do not understand how it was quantified.) But if face-fo-face is 90% non-verbal, then quick-and-dirty math tells me that we communicate about one-tenth as effectively in Second Life than in real life.

2. Though Second Life is made up of, ultimately, real people, the rules of socialization are far different in Second Life than any we experience in real life. Someone entering Second Life for the first time is experiencing a culture shock equivalent to the rural person who first moves to the big city, or the American who visits China for the first time. It is not easy to fit into a new social environment.

Remember that all of us have been learning the rules of communication and socialization all our lives. We have been practicing and perfecting them all our lives. And most of us are still learning. If it takes that long to learn in real life, why would it be so easy to assimilate in a day in Second Life?

In real life, I am an adult, with three post-secondary degrees, who has lived professionally from her ability to communicate and negotiate with people. And yet, even I was once a Second Life n00b.
You've put some intelligent thought into this.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 13:10
From: LittleMe Jewell
Geez - who knows how I managed to mess that link up. Here is what I was reading - quite interesting and entertaining in some ways:

http://www.geocities.com/rnseitz/Definition_of_IQ.html
It is. Thanks.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
12-20-2008 13:12
From: LittleMe Jewell
No way - I is way smarter than all y'alls is.
:D :p

You haven't disproved it to me yet.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Keturah Kirax
Nyaa~
Join date: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 10
12-20-2008 13:30
I have given up on most people online, 90% of the population are those with an IQ of an ant. Sadly stubborness seams to come with ignorance. I see what was meant when they say the real stupid people are those who think they know it all because then they refuse to learn. There should be a intelligence test needed to join SL and enter some grids.
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Try and read it. (It is Binary)
LittleMe Jewell
...........
Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
12-20-2008 13:33
From: Keturah Kirax
... There should be a intelligence test needed to join SL and enter some grids.
No way - it would ruin the fun for many of us.
:D
_____________________
♥♥♥
-Lil

Why do you sit there looking like an envelope without any address on it?
~Mark Twain~

Optimism is denial, so face the facts and move on.
♥♥♥
Lil's Yard Sale / Inventory Cleanout: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Triggerfish/52/27/22
.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/littleme_jewell
Keturah Kirax
Nyaa~
Join date: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 10
12-20-2008 13:35
From: LittleMe Jewell
No way - it would ruin the fun for many of us.
:D


Better then ruining the fun of all of us.

I say suspend anyone who bitches about some ones avatar because that is where most of SL drama comes from. There is an ignore button and if you cant figure out how to use it I don't think you have a place on SL.
_____________________
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Try and read it. (It is Binary)
LittleMe Jewell
...........
Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
12-20-2008 13:40
From: Keturah Kirax
Better then ruining the fun of all of us.

I say suspend anyone who bitches about some ones avatar because that is where most of SL drama comes from. There is an ignore button and if you cant figure out how to use it I don't think you have a place on SL.
There's a contradiction in that. You recommend the ignore button, but want to suspend those that bitch rather than just ignore them yourself - and you say that those folks ruin "the fun for all of us", whereas if you ignored them they could not ruin your fun and still provide me my laughs at their ignorance.

I know that is bad, but sometimes I just need to get my laughs where I can.
_____________________
♥♥♥
-Lil

Why do you sit there looking like an envelope without any address on it?
~Mark Twain~

Optimism is denial, so face the facts and move on.
♥♥♥
Lil's Yard Sale / Inventory Cleanout: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Triggerfish/52/27/22
.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/littleme_jewell
Keturah Kirax
Nyaa~
Join date: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 10
12-20-2008 13:47
From: LittleMe Jewell
There's a contradiction in that. You recommend the ignore button, but want to suspend those that bitch rather than just ignore them yourself - and you say that those folks ruin "the fun for all of us", whereas if you ignored them they could not ruin your fun and still provide me my laughs at their ignorance.

I know that is bad, but sometimes I just need to get my laughs where I can.


If they had used the ignore button they would not be bitching. Enough bitching leads to two things. either I get in trouble or they do. So even if i ignore them what good does that do because they haven't ignored me so they are STILL bitching about me.
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Try and read it. (It is Binary)
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