Why do clubs not pay DJ's more?

I am figuring that this is like RL supply and demand. It appears that there are DJs willing to work for that (quality not taken into account there) and therefore why should anyone pay more?






Probably not, but mostly because I view the economy different in SL -- heck, I sure don't pay the equivalent of RL costs for a dress that I buy in SL.

That said, I will usually tip a DJ or performer anywhere from $200L - $5000L depending on my perception of how they do and how long I am there enjoying it - with the live performer usually getting a bigger tip. My tips are almost always in the form of multiple tips throughout the time-span that I am at an event.

if the lindens would clean up the events listings, it would be a lot easier to find stuff in there

QFT

As the owner of a (yet to open on a regular basis) club, I agree with HoneyBear. Where is the club going to get the money to pay the DJ? Tips? My donations box is competing with the DJ's tip jar...and who do you think customers are going to pay, the person who's right there providing them entertainment, or some faceless club owner?

That sounds like sour grapes, and it's not. I don't mind getting a smaller amount in donations than the DJ makes in tips. After all, the DJ is putting in more hours and effort than I am. But, if it's not fair for the club to take a cut of the DJ's tips, then it's just as unfair for the DJ to demand a salary that is, in effect, a cut of MY tips.

what if the DJ took a salary but had no tipjar?
would that be more fair?

Where is the incentive for the DJ to do a good job? If what you earn in tips can exceed your salary, wouldn't you do your best to build up a following? Or are you just expecting to get tipped directly if there is no tip jar set out?

I know ZIP about clubs. So please keep the bashing in check.

I pay the regular DJ for the pool partys quite well. She does an awesome job, she doesn't just play the music but she interacts with my guests. She talks to people, honors requests and she is very entertaining. No one has been able to stump her on song requests.

She also gets tips from my guests. I do not get a cut since I am not running a club I am just throwing a party. She has told me that she works in some clubs and gets no tips from the patrons even though she is doing a great job.

I guess my whole point is people are paid what the market will bear. There are so many clubs and so many DJs maybe the demand isn't there.

"CX" (pool party animal)

odd side note to running a club, friend of mine just opened her own club and recieved a curious offer... Bot Dancers...this person offered to have 10-12 Bot dancers show up every night to fill the dance floor and make the club "seem" more lively than it was... they said the bots would even randomly shout how "this club rocks" flash Ascii art, even occasionaly shoot off a poofer or two....

My friend turned them down as she already had a good following from DJing at other clubs... but I am curious now, is the use of Bot dancers common in clubs?

The incentive would be doing your job well, and knowing that the club owner is paying you to do a good job (sadly not everyone thinks that way, however I do)

as for the last comment, I am not even going to justify that, that is downright insulting to insinuate that I would expect to get direct tips (and that being the reason no tip jar)
IF I wanted tips I would put out a tip jar (much prefer a split one cuz I KNOW clubs are money pits)




that would explain why a lot of times when going to a club, no one speaks to you, yet you see the occassional shout and gesture that is totally out of place (I have been checking out clubs lately and sadly they are not what they used to be)

I am tempted to restart mine, but.. as mentioned they are a money pit, and until Rha! Designs can cover the cost of the land AND hiring staff for a club, I just won't do it

Sorry, Rha, I do not mean to offend or suggest that that is what you thought. But my general position is to trust no one, and that is a practice that happens... the staff member may say "I can't set out my own tip jar" which leaves the patrons to draw the conclusion that they are to tip the person directly. So if the house does not provide a tip jar for the staff, that is the conclusion to be drawn if one wants to tip the staff member.

Haven't seen or heard of it, but it's just another fraudulent use of bots, and doesn't surprise me in the least.

Good luck to your friend. Tell her the 6 month survival rate continues

never thought of it that way
(sorry I jumped to conclusions, I do that too much, I know)

You've just identified the major reason I don't stay in clubs long. Maybe I will if there's ever a feature to filter out gestures.

You can always mute the people doing the gestures

and turn off particles

just curious about the secondlife wages since i'm sure my field will become affected just as well soon...

I'm a scripter... and i get paid a decent wage... (my linden fee works out to about 20 US$ an hour).

Why is it so different between? Dancers, DJ's, Models, Reporters ... it seems every field gets pennys per hour while scripting does not.

On the flip side, i just bought Sam4, and got a stream, wanting to learn how to be a DJ .... anyone know a good way to learn? or is it just practice practice practice....

as an addendum, I tip DJ's well if i request a song and it's played along with the mention it was a request and who it is for... I tip DJ's less if they are just playlist playing. I do not tip dancers or hosts... or the club, just the DJ's .... perhaps i am bias'd in that, but I just don't feel like anyone else is actually doing work... they are dancing and enjoying the music just like the rest of us.

sounds like you answered your own question...

dancers, models, some hosts, and a few other positions, usually do not involve much knowledge, just the ability to click a pole or whatnot, or use gestures, etc

scripting on the other hand, requires actual knowledge of how scripting works and understanding the lsl language

I think the reason scripters get paid way better is because there are a lot less of them, being it is a job that does require a lot more knowledge than being able to point and click, or type a shortcut to a gesture

DJ's I feel should get paid more because they have to have a certain knack for doing what they do, IF they do it well
the problem is there are so many ppl who will DJ who are not good, and will do it for pennies, that the places that need DJ's will "hire" them, because it is cheap and enables them to say they have a DJ

Hi, I'm Seven, and I'm a former DJ for hire. I'd craft up multihour playlists according to a venue owner's genre whims or moods they wanted, tuning and tweaking them on the fly, and doing my best to keep the crowd engaged with banter in chat. I brought my own gear as wearable attachments to avoid busting prim limits and I even brought my own stream.

I stopped taking out my weekly classified when I started realizing how non-fun DJing in SL could be. Even putting pay scales and tip jars aside, the job itself is a pain in the ass and is certainly not worth the pocket change you get in return. When I took work requests from various clubs invariably I'd land in a pile of suck from the "MS-Paint and Pr0n Mystique" school of interior decorating, with 5-6 people dancing, once of which was the alleged host who did no hosting beyond randomly blasting us with horrible ASCII art macros.

I still DJ now and then, but only for friends, for audiences that I know will actually be receptive in locations that aren't embarrassing to be seen in. At those places, the money isn't the deciding factor, it's how much fun I'll have performing and how much fun folks will have listening to the music.

What we buiy from you we can use to sell and make a continuos income.

Come to my CLUB SCHOOL, register and you can learn how to save playlists, load sound effects, take requests and use multiple shoutcast streams (slurl below or check my picks to teleport).

The Dancers and hosts anre working just as hard as the DJs. The Hosts post the events, run the scripted contest board and greet everyone that enters. Dancers are sociable eye candy and worth 50L.

.

hi seven, I did not know you used to DJ in clubs, im me next time you do a session, I would love to come listen

yeah, it is not all the glory some folks tend to think it is

Scripting takes a lot more knowledge that those other jobs and it takes a certain amount of skill/talent to actually be good and efficient at it.



This is the crux of the whole issue. If people will work for pennies, then pennies is what the pay will be.

For dancers and hosts, it really depends if they're doing their job--and the tricky bit is that their job is to have fun, in an infectious sort of way. In newbie clubs, that doesn't really take a lot of effort or skill (for hosts, ASCII art gestures with dopey sound effects, and for dancers a good skin, some sexy clothes, and... well, more gestures with dopey sound effects). In clubs frequented by folks who've been in-world a month or more, the bar gradually raises: the staff is really responsible for setting the tone of the place--the *way* this place is fun that's different from the way all the other places are fun. So, if they do a good job at that, they deserve something for the effort.

Tipping the venue is harder to explain because there are so many different arrangements for how clubs expect to get revenue. But if there aren't any boxes with stuff for sale, you can pretty much bet that tips are what (someone hopes) will pay the tier for the club. Except for escorts, any cut the house can take from other tips will barely cover just the cost-of-money for the various dance animations in use. But usually, no matter what, owning a club is a money-losing proposition.

So why do so many people open clubs? And why is "a club" the most common social venue in SL? Do real people spend that much of their RL in clubs--or want to?

Folks, for the vast majority of venues, it's a hobby. If you really want to be a DJ or dancer and earn that kind of wage, go do it in the real world or work for an inworld club with a real business plan other than "let's throw a party and have fun." Because the culture here is to pay GUESTS to show up (sploders, contests, freebies). Paying staff anything that approaches real world wages, even minimum wage, is not doable for a hobby.

This is why most clubs come and go. There is no money in it, even if the club is the lure for rentals or a mall, because the traffic rarely converts to sales. Rentals don't have that high a profit margin, because so much money goes back into luring people there in the first place.

If you want to run a club that pays those kinds of salaries, please do!! We could stand some more professionalism. But you will be hard pressed to make the money back.

I don't think all of that, or even much of that, can be attributed to reduced stipend. Do the math. To earn that much in tips people have to be paying real money.

I think what's happened is that clubs don't really have many live people present. Would you pay good tips for the level of interactivity you get at clubs these days?

0 interactivity = 0 tips