Fix the forums now or tell us why not !!!!!!!!

Fixed that for you.

I'm not sure what you're querying there, so I'll explain. Firefox, with the 'Linkification' add-on, converts link text into clickable links without needing tags. IE may well have something similar, for all I know.

Actually this is just a miniscule part of the picture. Malicious code can be injected through bbcode in older forum software. vBulletin sent out a red alert on LL's version of the forum software a year before LL acted on it and shut off bbcode. During this time we were nothing more then lucky that a hacker/hackers never noticed or we would have all lost our $L. vBulletin has been through generations of updates since this version was declared dead by them.

The forums are much more then just RA or the particular uses you use it for. bbcode and PHP tags are critical for the Scripting forum because indentation is a part of how the code is read and interpreted and since it was turned off, participation has dropped dramatically with many of the older more experienced people that helped leaving in disgust. Name one major piece of software you have on your computer that does not have an up to date forum somewhere where people can come and get help? For SL this includes not only various technical questions but also Content creation including Textures, Animations, Building and Scripting.

It is one thing to expect the older users here to know how to be able to read our posts without leaving frustrated. It is much different to expect the same of the critical audience which is both new users and older users learning new skills. I have bbcode enabled thourgh gm or gm like code for Firefox, Chrome, and Opera and even I am frustrated that what is posted from one version can not always be seen or read by the other browsers. A simple matter of pictures. I can post a pic in img tags in Chrome and no one else can see that pic. I can post the same pic in Firefox and the majority can see it but I can't with Chrome.

LL has stated several times over the last year and a half that the forum will be upgraded and bbcode re-enabled. Hopefully it is sooner then later, but remaining optimistic about it ended a long time ago for many of us. I personally will be the first one to get up and dance around the room when it is accomplished.

So no, we can not all post nor read perfectly well here.

I don't disagree with any of that, Jesse. My disagreement is with the "fix the forum" idea that is often accompanied with the idea that it's broken. Apart from the SQL thing, it isn't broken at all. It's intentional.

I also agree that the lack of a means of indenting is bad for posting scripts, but again, it isn't broken and, to be fair, it's not really that big a thing. People who don't understand scripts can simply copy and paste, and leave things as they are. Those who do understand them can also add the indentations if they want to - I do when I copy a script from here. Having said that, the biggest downside of not having a means of indenting, is the reading/following of scripts in the post itself, and I think that's what you mean. Yes it's a big downside, and darned inconvenient, but it's not broken. It's only the frequently stated idea that the forum is broken that I'm talking about. As far as I know, they only thing that's broken is the SQL problem. Everything else is intentional.

I wouldn't even have posted if the thread was about "upgrade the forum" or something like that. It's the frequently touted idea that it's broken that I'm posting about.

It's broken.

It doesn't work as intended. Crucial features are turned off to avoid a security hack, which has been fixed by the provider of the software, but not incorporated by LL.

It doesn't do what we need it to do, and what it used to do before they turned off the necessary features (saying it'd be temporary at the time, TWO YEARS AGO).

Really. It's broken, by any reasonable meaning of the term. Borked, messed up, inconvenient, missing important features, hosed.

It's about time they fixed it. Very annoying!

BTW, Phil, when copying a script, hit the QUOTE button, and you'll get the original formatting.

The fact that you have to use such a silly workaround that is a clue that IT'S BROKEN.

The broken part is the security hole that requires them to turn off necessary features. The fix is available. They just need to incorporate it.

I'm glad you don't work for my company's customer service! If you did, our products would rarely be considered broken, and our customers would hate us.

Thank you for the tip, Lear. I hadn't thought of that.

I disagree with you about the forum being broken though (except for the SQL thing). If something is turned off, for whatever reason, it isn't broken - it's simply turned off intentionally.

Seems we're in some semantics argument again, which is probably not going to resolve. (I dunno: seems to me something can be broken either by accident or because somebody intentionally nerfed it.) But anyway, I'm just not following the distinction about the SQL filter: it's intentional, too, presumably patching around some other, more recently discovered vulnerability that was properly corrected in an update long ago. I don't really see how that's any more or any less broken than turning off some but not all bbcode markup (e.g., the highlight tag still works, but not bold, italic, size, color, etc.).

I just hope this is all moot soon. (The forums seem to be running very slowly for me today, so one wonders: could they be maybe just maybe dry-running a backup-and-migrate to the new software?)

Yep noticed it this morning. Keeping fingers crossed.

I forget how many actual residence we have concurrently. but this forum is intergrated with there other software (database) (so we dont have to signup here) so my thought on it is, maybe it might be a big problem porting the db over and the vb db over? I am looking at what they mostly do on a tech aspect and try to keep from judging them on flaws and things.

But it can be done but not easily. I ported from 3.48 to 3.68 2 months ago from vb and the stupid db some how corrupted so we lost everything on my forum. thats a huge risk to take here and they might not want to do that. but this is my thoughts. I am not liable for my actions or sayings

I'll just get off my horse.
Yep, there is a major problem with upgrading and keeping the old forum data. That's a given. The sooner it's archived (and searchable) and a replacement introduced, the better. Then things can move forward with new features and functions.

Plenty of sites have introduced much better forum communications, like, I hate to say it, but facebookish using newer tech and web2 type stuff.
It would be busier, more engaging, more betterer. I don't thing disk space or severs is a problem. Maybe some staff and people to implement it is. Maybe Xstreet is being cued up for this.

Disengaging passwords from forum to the grid would be a good thing too. No need for total integration on that. Then there is no worry from that side.

Semantics. But, simply put, it's broken.

What LL has done here is tantamount to welding my front door shut because the manufacturer of the doorknob issued a recall stating the lock had a flaw, and requiring family members and visitors to climb in and out through the kitchen window. Even though the doorknob manufacturer will ship me a free replacement lock, I just haven't gotten to it, and likely never will. In the meantime, I simply explain that the door isn't broken, that it's intentionally disabled.

o.O

Don't tell Pep.

But, WHY was it turned off? Because it's BROKEN: there's a security hole. So, FIX IT, and then turn the features back on.

(YW)

The poor forum is limping along but nevertheless has brought answers, help, information, and fellowship to many.

And it looks like it is really true this time and it is going to be archived and done away with in the near future. Hopefully easily searchable considering the years of irreplaceable data in Content Creation. Very interested in seeing what we are going to get in exchange.

Since the endless thread will finally die, I wonder if there is going to be a general ban on lolcats in the new??????

Yes, I'm anxious. I won't believe things will be saved until I see that it has been done.
As I recall it was Robin who said the forum contained our history and would be saved, so all bets are off.

Good point! It's certainly not completely broken! Just a bit borked.

lear may have said it, but LL said it first... although I believed they used the terms 'bug' and 'security issue' and even promised to 'fix' both the problem, and the stop-gap measure used to secure it (poorly I might add, since there were still BIG holes a year after that even).

LL can't fix what isn't broken, ergo LL says "Iz Brokked" =)



PS while looking for just the right image, I came across this... http://www.raulcrimson.com/2007/06/27/donut-worry-lindenz-peepl-iz-profesionls/
ah seredipity

The part that's working is the people-part.

Are they are going to dump the forums?

Read all of Torley's yellow highlighted comments in the "Coming Soon...." blog post.

Edit: actually comments #2 by Blue and Torley's comment #37

i dunno... do any of you really trust ll to fix it and fix it right? do you believe they are capable of running update scripts, patching the bridge, and not dropping all the tables or somehow losing all the forum data?
i dont. i reckon they should leave it well enough alone.

But is forum really necessary to sl or is it a convenience for people who cant go on to sl because they are at work or in a restricted environment where it would be inappropriate to do so or they prefer the chat-format of the site itself?
I will miss resident chat but not aspects of it. "Endless thread" has gone beyond focus upon sl and has served its purpose - it would be more appropriate in-world liek forum cartel group chat. It suits in-world. Here on teh "outside" it has become exclusionary.
The entire forum system needs a makeover. I would even argue that this virtuality should not subscribe to "history" which by its very fabric/dynamic is a reality-based phenomenon. History is fleeting here. Yesterday is irelevent to electric "organisms". Tomorrow is inconceivable. Let Lindens edit and dump forums. SL depends on change so why are we so afraid of it?

I can't even express to you how much crucial information I have found here over the years.
Look at it this way: in Second Life we have some but not all of our senses. We lack, for instance, a sense of smell. The forum is like a sense that we have for SL but don't have in rl.