Make them able to fit

Why is it you guys who make clothing as well as other items not make them modifiable? Making them non-tranferrable I can understand, maybe even non-copiable as you don't need copies of the same type clothes. But not making them modifiable I just can't understand why not.

I tend not to buy anything that's not mod and for good reason, especially clothes. Recently, I brought a pair of pants and they were way too tight but being non-mod I couldn't do anything with them. And forget about calling the shop owner for an exchange or a mod type item, that's like getting root canal to them.

I also brought sneakers that looked fine on the ad but were tiny, I mean really tiny and once again I could do nothing with them. I called the person who I got them from and forget it, seems they're too greedy to do anything about it so again I lost out.

So, I'd like to know what reason is their for making clothes and other items non-mod? I just don't see any real reason for this except the person making them just doesn't care if it fits right or not, long as they get the money for it.

I guess it's because when you spend hours and hours carefully crafting something you don't want people mussing it up by changing it. Artists are a tempramental bunch and don't like their art being modified or changed.

I agree, especially for items like prim skirts. But even "basic" clothes should be Mod...I have a couple of pretty long sleeved T shirts that I can make into short sleeves or tank tops with the appearance sliders. I appreciate the flexibility.

So very frustrating and unnecessary! Add to this, when they dont bother to mention it when you hit "buy" or "pay", so you purchase the item and THEN find out that it's no mod!! This makes me so damn mad! Also, these places that have things for sale and then don't allow you to even friggin Rezz them at the damn store, so you can put the item in your inventory, ARGGGG.

I, too, REFUSE to purchase ANY and ALL items that are NO MOD! In fact, once I see that an item is NO MOD, I LEAVE THATS STORE IMMEDIATELY AND NEVER RETURN!!!

Thanks for bringing up the topic!!!!!!!

I don't sell clothes but I sell houses and a car design.

The houses are no mod, no copy, no transfer because: If people see my designs badly modified, that would reflect on me. If they were 'copy', estate owners could buy one house and copy dozens of them all over their land.

I make the cars 'copy' though, because it is possible to lose a vehicle in s sim border crash and it's easier to rez another than wait for it to appear in Lost and Found.

With clothes, if they have a border to the fabric, that would be lost if the sleeves or collar are altered. What would be ideal with clothes if for some parameters to be modifiable e.g. loose or tight fit, while other params are locked. but that would add complication!

PS: All my clothes are freebies or ones I've made for myself.

No Mod - Because you dont want your name attached to something that someone will mess up and change, making your work look bad.

Copy - most clothing (and huds) are copyable and does need to be so you can make outfits, and the clothing can be copied to the outfit folder(s)

No Transfer - Since they DO need to be copyable, they are no transfer, otherwise people will resell.

I personally care a whole lot more about mod on prims (attachments, furniture, etc), than mod on clothes.

The only reason I've actually heard so far is "I don't want people stealing my stuff" (same silly excuse often given for not wanting to sell NC/T) when asking if it was possible to get something no-mod as mod.

In addition to what others have said about making something no mod to preserve the look of a creators original design granting Mod permissions also lets people edit individual prims and get all their specific measurments in the edit window making them much easier to replicate ( and steal the design). Also, I think the copybot script can work on any prim item that is left mod.

For the tiny shoes: can't you resize the entire shoe? You won't be able to edit individual prims but you can always get the 4 little gray squares that let you scale the whole thing up and down, right? same for prim skirts.

I agree that it is always better to know the permissions of something before you buy it, but I guess I consider the permissions package as much a part of what I am buying as the product. No one permissions set fits all buyers or all creators.

Prim parameters are sent across the wire whether the prim is mod or no-mod because the viewer needs to know them to render the prim. In the actual code the only thing keeping you from seeing the numbers on any prim is just a simple "if item is no-mod, skip showing the numbers". Comment that out and you'll see prim params for every prim in-world, regardless of permissions or ownership.

If someone wants to steal something, it's trivial to do and permissions won't bother them in the least. The only people who are bothered by restrictive permissions are your customers.

You need mod to resize. The only thing you can do with a no-mod linkset is position it and rotate (and delete/move from the contents).

I don't agree with that approach at all... I'm not buying a zillion dollar highly praised work from a renowned artist... I'm buying pants from a department store and shoes from payless. Since when are pants and shoes in RL one size fits all? Since when are AV's in SL all the same shape/size? It pisses me off to no end when people sell their stuff like shoes for size 0.. ok fine.. do they realize that even at size 0 feet, if you have a mere 2 more points on the leg muscle value than the AV the shoes were modeled on that feet pop through and their product is worthless? Do they care? Obviously not... I can understand not wanting to deal with a flood of IM's from noobs who've gone and messed up their pair of shoes, but that is something a single 10L disclaimer texture on a flattened box board can solve. Instead they choose the Micro$oft approach and lock everything down for everyone. My thanks to these type of designers is to never ever buy from them, no matter what. They've earned it.
Clothing is an even bigger farse. Someone explain why I'm not competent enough to reduce the flair leg on a pair of pants please... or why I shouldn't be able to lift a bottom hem or shorten sleeves on a shirt. Why is it such a no-no to allow me to tint something I've paid for to match something else I've boughten? I think I know why... GREED. Because right next to where you bought them flaired pants is another vendor selling the same thing without the flair. Stuffed into a different clothing ensemble is the same shirt you wanted to mod, apparently modded the same way you would have, mixed in with other stuff most would have a hard time GIVING away, and costing even more than the original outfit. Maybe, just maybe I would actually wear that pair of pants I apparently got tricked into buying (because of a no-info PAY dialogue) if I could adjust them depending on if I'm wearing them with heels or boots. All I can say is I wont be buying from, or recommending places that sell nomod clothing. Even if it's the most beautiful article I've ever seen like it. Chances are I will actively dissuade people from ever even going there, instead offering up a suggestion to another place I know has the customer at heart and sells clothing you can actually use for more than a single predetermined look.

I stand corrected

It's not greed to want to make a living. Why should a retailer want to make it easier for you to not give them money? They're not there as a charity you know. When you buy pants in real life, do you complain that they can't be turned into shorts aswell? No, you just buy some shorts. Pants that can be converted to shorts exist in real life too - does that mean all jeans retailers are greedy thieves? No. It just means that you don't get anything for free, and that's as it should be.

What it boils down to is this; retailers don't want to sell mod products, and they don't have to. Simple as that.

In terms of clothing and skins, that seems right. If a designer makes a *custom* item for an individual avatar, it may be a serious enough piece of craftsmanship to warrant protection of the designer's brand. But for anything off-the-shelf, no-mod reveals that the designer simply doesn't understand the vagaries of SL avatars: it may have been a work of art on the creator and an alt, but it may need all the mod it can get on the actual buyer.

Prims are slightly different because the right to mod pretty much grants the ability to copy. That distinction is kinda moot, though, because copybot could clone no-mod stuff, too.

"No Mod because you don't want your name attached to something someone may mess up and change, making your work look bad." someone wrote.

Do you realize what you're saying? You can't be serious. Go to a crowded club or event look at the all the people there and how they're dressed. Do you in all honesty know who made their clothes? You can't tell who made what in 99+2/3%. Unless of course you have the same item and in most cases you won't even remember where you got it from much less who made it.

You can't tell who made the jeans or the booty shorts or just about anything else anyone is wearing so saying the reason for no mod is because someone may mess up an item making it reflect on the creator is a very weak excuse.

Besides, people who spend their hard earned money don't go around "messing" up what they've paid for and are now wearing. If anything, they want to look as best as possible.

In the long run these people lose business. Once some people see the no mod in shops they walk out without buying as someone else stated. And like the op many others simply tend to stay away from no mod items in shops, as I do too.

What I think is many people who make items for sell in sl take it much too seriously and they need to be reminded, they're not rl designers. More importantly, once someone pays for whatever it is they're selling, it's none of their business what that person does with said item. It doesn't belong to them anymore although many actually believe it is, hence the no mod, no copy, no transfer by many of these creators.

Like I said, for the most part most clothes are the same or look the same and people don't go around investigating who made them. It's all the same and no one really cares who made what long as they get what they paid for. People don't stand around chatting about someones pants looking bad and therefore blaming the creator.

And let's not forget the part where these "designers" don't want to be bothered and won't exchange anything no matter how much you paid or what the problem happens to be. This is just icing on the cake. You're stuck with that poorly made item and not being able to modify it just makes it that much worse.

Skins are abit different. Even if they were mod, they can't be changed at all. When you change the sliders on the skin, you are changing the default skin. Any skin you buy is actually an all-over tattoo, which cannot be changed. A few skins exist where the lips and eyelids are transparent to allow people to change the make up on them. Beyond that, there is nothing that actually can be changed even if they were mod.

I make and sell houses and furniture. Every last piece is Mod/Copy No trans.
I will deliver items to other people if someone wants to give one as a gift or even change the perms to Trans No copy. But everything I make and sell comes with full mod rights.

I built it, I'm done with it. If they want to screw it up then it's on them.

I also will not buy any building that is no mod or no copy. It's my house. If I want to paint the walls I should be able to and it's far to easy to lose an item to SL to buy no copy houses. One ASL burp and there goes 3k down the drain. I have EVERY house Damini has made. Full Mod & Copy. I went back every week until I owned every one of them. I have never bought any house that was no mod or no copy and I never will.

My alt is bald. Bought a 2k skin, love it. But it's no mod and comes with short short hair. Guess what? No Mod. Bald wigs don't work. Can't get rid of the hair. So that 2k is wasted and sitting in a storage box. It's no transfer so I can't even give it away. I'll never buy no mod items again.

No they don't, but in RL you buy a size that fits you, in SL it seems to be one size fits all. People who are asking for mod clothing just want clothes that fit them.

Ah, well, I'm guessing your avatar isn't Asian If the skin is mod and has some all-over alpha channel, you can change the coloring. Mind you, this excludes like 99% of the high-end skins. Hence my very brief (one-off, actually) profession as a skin designer.

But the point is well-taken: the "mod"ability of skins is even less than for clothing. What little there is for either, though, is cherished by many buyers, among whom I am one. (Or, well... would be, if I could have found a plausible skin to buy.)

I have my merchandise set up so that people can left click on the boxes in my shop and get a list of the contents, including permissions for each item, and the option to buy. I certainly understand if they don't want to buy because of the way the permissions are set. Or if what I am selling is not exactly what they want. (Most of my prim clothes are modifiable so they will fit properly.)

Making clothes is something I really enjoy but it is also pretty hard work for me and it takes a long time to get each thing as good as I can get it. I'm selling each item of clothes as a piece by me for anyone who would like it.

I'm just not in the business of selling make-your-own-clothing kits.

If anyone IM's me that they wish the pants were looser or something like that, I will gladly give them another looser pair if I can make it look good. I don't think it's unreasonable to want everything I make to reflect my standards, even if most people don't know I was the original creator.

Sometimes people realize only after they buy something that they can't give it as a present. So far for every one who has IMed me with this problem I have put another copy of the item into a gift box and delivered it to their desired recipient at no extra charge.

And of course everyone is free to learn how to make their own textures and clothes just the way they want them - within the sometimes difficult SL constraints of course.

I'd love to know which real life department store you go to where you can reduce the flair leg on a pair of pants or shorten the sleeves on a shirt or change the tint of the clothing. Your title to the thread is deceiving. Prim clothing fitting on your avatar is often an issue but non-prim clothing fitting on your avatar is not. For non-prim clothing you don't like the particulars of the design. If you don't like the way the clothing is designed then don't buy it. Even when non-prim clothing is modifiable results are often mediocre with lousy fuzzy/uneven borders when you use the ingame appearance modifier. You're usually better off buying a piece of clothing that looks like what you actually want unmodified than buying clothing and hoping you can modify the cut to suit your tastes.

As for Ricardo, maybe it is because you're a guy, but I can tell you that I often get questions from other girls about where I got my clothes and I also ask when I see someone wearing something I like.

Quoting you, but others expressed the same sentiment so it's more of a general quote .

Why does that end at no-mod though? What is the difference between a badly modified item of clothing and the item of clothing as you intended it on a avie you consider to be ugly/hideous/whatever? Neither is going to be particularly flattering, and the second is actually far more likely to happen than the first.

Maybe you should just screen your customers to make sure they have a skin and shape combination that is acceptable to you and a written agreement to not wear any accessories or other items of clothing that you don't find fitting?

Bottom line: if you don't want people to "mess up" your creation or if you need absolute control over it, don't sell t.

I make clothing and my clothing is no mod/no copy/ yes transfer

if someone wants the clothing done a little different than pictured or wants a specific item as modify, all they have to do is ask

I will not be offended or upset

heck I had a lady who wanted the thongs I made as a pants layer due to her tattoos, I was on that and had no problem doing it


the prim clothes I do set mod rights to as they need to be able to size them

however the clothes I make are made to look a specific way, so therefor that is the way they are sold

(I do have a white mod thong in my thong sets so ppl can tint that one, and keep or give away the others)

however right now the situation of what my permissions are set at, is kind of a moot point, being I have not had enough sales lately to qualify much as a seller

I don't consider any avatar to be ugly or hideous. But if someone doesn't like the way my clothes, as they are, look on them I really don't think they will be able to get a better result by moving sliders around.

I do try each item on and then change my shape taller-shorter and fatter-thinner to try to design the best texture I can to work with the widest range possible. If your avi looks more like the ones in the pictures on my boxes chances are better that the clothes will look on you like they do on my models. If not perhaps my clothes are not for you.

I generally have to try out many - I'm talking dozens - of versions of each texture to get them to look as good as possible in the most sizes and positions I can. I make them so I can sell them and I don't want to set permissions to make it possible for anyone else to use my textures to make clothes.

To get things like hems to match up at the seems is particularly tricky. If you make a pair of my pants shorter by using the sliders you will get a very messy looking hem line. And while this might not bother you, it is the kind of - perhaps unconsciously noticed - detail which will not give you the impression that I am a good designer. I'd like to leave all my customers with the impression that I make quality clothes

Actually this thread has got me thinking about what a great business Make Your Own Clothes Kits could be. Honestly, making good looking textures for specific purposes is quite challenging. If I do learn how to make textures that look good on adjustable clothes I could get rich.

They have these RL things called sewing machines and dye. They're pretty nifty, you should try 'em sometime.

http://www.singerco.com/
http://www.ritdye.com/home.lasso

So by hacking, basically?