Since when does the word game notate shooting and vandalism?

I'm not quite sure what to make of your post. Are you bragging, justifying, lamenting your lack of control, or offering a possible explaination for how hard it is not to shoot people?

If you always shoot annoying people, and yet have only shot one person, then I have to applaud your hard work at control. Congrats.

You are a fine example to us all.

Kathy was griefing.

I was there.

She set her home location on top of Clint's apartment and refused to leave until we promised we wouldn't shoot her anymore. It's just her attempt at controling the gameplay styles of others.

It's no different than Mcewen going around kicking people randomly in safe-areas, trying to get them to fight him.

Look. I'm going to try ONE more time. I shouldn't have continued THIS long, but I have a fondness for the truth.

I wasn't griefing anyone. I was going to the Non-Ninjas Store to buy a DDR pad. I got NEAR the wall and was shot. I traveled all the way back from my house ($25) and was shot again. $25 dollars more, and that pad was getting expensive. This time, I set Home inside Jessie. What's his face came over, looked at me for a moment. I said "Hi " and he shot me. I re-materialized and set Home to his roof (never landed, by the way). I told THEM (Brentosh and this other guy) that all I wanted was to fly through unfettered. This made them mad, I guess, so they shot me a few hundred times. It took some effort, but I managed to get out a warning that this couldn't be good for the server. Eventually they stopped. After insisting for several minutes that I wanted to go about my business and was willing to stop materializing if they stopped shooting (not rocket science, eh?) they eventually let me go shopping. I did. BTW, I also bought some wings in the Black Pyramid. Business I assume the proprietor appreciated.

So, those are the facts. Perhaps Brentosh has a different interpretation of the occurance, but that's what this is all about, isn't it? People thinking that, if they feel strong enough about something, then it has to be true.

Anyway, as long as there are people or businesses available to me in Jessie - run by people who have NOT told me to stay away - then I will be back. Perhaps, someday, I will bring firends. I hope we don't have to see what the real server limit is to the number of deaths/per/minute. But, if we need to do that, I am willing to stand there for as long as it takes the system operators to kick EVERYONE off that sim.

As usual, I will be the un-armed shopper. Don't make me mount a shopping expedition!

[Please don't expect any further conversation of this topic in these forums - whatever fantasies you spin.]

The post was just a statement. I guess if I were to shoot another person, it would be because I didn't want that person near me. (outside of some sort of shooting at people event-thing.)
I don't work hard at curbing violent tendencies. I guess I have just been lucky enough not to encounter many people I want to send away. I still don't have any qualms about doing so.
If you were in fact griefing and resetting your home to my area to "make me behave," I probably would continue to shoot you. You would probably consider me one of those childish thugs, but I would consider you a tresspasser and eject you at every chance I got because I don't want people trying to legislate my behavior on my land. I don't have incidents like that. Maybe it is because I don't expect others to obey me.

Wrong I live in the lagoon and have been shot several times and had nets thrown over me while working on my own place.

That being said I am glad the wall is clean now and the debate from my end has no more fule. I care not what you do on your own SIM I just did not want it in my backyard. Your rights extend to the end of another members nose . Since there are many bruised noses in SL right now I say you have overextended your rights.

*lightbulb turns on above Tim's head*

let's all go out and buy one of these shirts...



then, remember the words of Vash the stampede!



LOVE AAAAAAAAAAND PEACE!

For those that can get a chuckle out of themselves and this whole situation I now have those shirts now on sale at my shop at Minna 124, 9 for cheap.

Put one aside for me. And one for Bentosh, I'll pay for his :-)


In fact, one for every Jessie resident who wants one - on me. (Please, one to a customer!)

:-)

Hey, wait a minute. There isn't a bullseye on the back or anything?

that is on the back with a repeat of a small heart on the front by the collar. No bullseye, I promise. Although, now that you mention it.. it anyone does want a bullseye, let me know... on a seperate shirt of course!

I'll be there with bells on, MJ.

I've sent a letter regarding this same concern and I patiently await an answer.

The artwork is pretty funny and it's all just good fun. As for the confederate flag, people who gripe about it flying are close minded morailty freaks. I don't care at all for the South, I live in the South but I still don't care about it, but this crap about the confederate flag being flown is getting really old. It's a flag, it flies just like any other flag, it has meaning in the USA, golly that's a perfectly good reason to bash it. If everyone would just accpet things for what they are instead of dwelling over the past maybe there wouldn't be so many problems. FREE YOUR MINDS.

Look sister, you moved into a sim that is described as being "the most dangerous game," a place where you can be killed or imprisoned. And you want to go shopping there?!? You want to build a temple there?!? You can't leave because, of all things, you had to dig into the ground for your temple?!? Why couldn't you dig into the ground, in exactly the same fashion, in Dore, or any other sim in the ~90% of the world that is NOT designated as dangerous? Oh, but your friend is there and you want to be next to your friend and your friend doesn't want to leave the Outlands. Well guess what, that's classified as T.F.B. - TOO BAD.

We all have equal rights? Yeah, but I guess some rights are more equal than others. Like yours. You seem to think you have a right to demand that people not shoot you in a sim that was designed for the sole purpose of violence and treachery. You might as well go to a chess game and demand that the rules be changed so that your opponent can't take any of your pieces but you can take any or all of theirs whenever you like.

Did I miss this newsletter?

I know the place was designated as Damage On, and that it's not against the Rules to shoot or detain there (within reasonable lilmits according tothe guidelines) but I never heard that that it was dedicated to the "sole" purposes you seem to imagine it OUGHT to be dedicated to.

Do you have a document you can post to that effect? If so, then you just may have cracked this whole misunderstanding. If you are right - that is was MEANT to be RESERVED for the use of ONLY those who shoot everyone at all times for no reason, then I apologize and now agree that "your" sim should simply be separated COMPLETELY from the rest of the world.

If you are mistaken, then you need to learn to play with the other girls and boys.

Thanks for the info Looking forward to reading it.

Fen I love your idea

Also Misnomer good point on the indain symbol

I will try to refrain from being to wordy here as I do not visit out often because of my laggy G2, So I have never seen the area in question.

But as far as symbols, flags, offensive materials goes I have an opinion that matters to me and me only. If it strikes a nerve with you so be it. Everyone is allowed to have their own views regardless of how many people like or dislike it.

But with flags being used and taken offensive? C'mon think about it.........

As I am part Indian and VERY proud of it. I never cry and complain that the American flag is a symbol of the oppression of my ancestors. I never say that it is a symbol of hate. But along the lines of some people's comments here I could have and still could... BUT what good would it do?

Also think of the countries that have been overthrown..Like Prussia for example.. They could raise all kinds of trouble about the polish flag and other flags of countries that occupy the land that once was part of that country..

And there are many others.

But the thing here is this is SECOND LIFE. The article I read that got me interested in SL said something like this being a 2nd life, where you can be something you are not in Real Life, or make it an extension of yourself from RL. I see no designations of countries in the sim names. There is no USA no Russia no Germany, etc.......

Flags can be used here for many purposes:

1. to be rude and offensive
2. to create hostilities to get a conflict going, so guns and toys can be "tested" in a fight to the virtual death.
3. Symbols of pride of heritage.
4. Just cuz it looks cool.

But I agree any placement of possable offensive material that would not get a ban or suspension should be only on ones own property, and others need to respect that it is their property (virtually) as we all know nothing in this game is "OURS".

There are many other things that could be made that are much more offensive than a flag. Things that could only be made with hate in mind. Ask any Native American, African-American, Cuban, Canadian, and others..... There are plenty of things that are in their ancestry that are much worse than a flag. I doubt you would have a nice calm conversation about this if at all.

Not to mention that the American flag and Confederate flag could be takin by me and other Natives as extremely negative. Ever hear of the Trail of Tears?? Now you know what Tribe I am part of. But I don't take offence I happen to like the true meaning behind both flags. I also like the design of the confederate flag.

So remember as MIS said....the Nazis (which I also have German blood in my veins) STOLE their symbol. Twisted it's meaning. And tainted the world view of this symbol.

I think all your points are excellent Charlie. Well said. I personally am not offended by the Confederate flag (or any other symbol... it's just shapes and colors after all. Words are another matter entirely). But I think you'd have to live in a vacuum not to know that a lot of people do find them offensive. If putting up a flag or a political poster or something else really annoys a whole lot of people then the question becomes, is it worth it? Does having that item enhance your play experience so much that it's worth offending a lot of people? I don't want to see the Lindens have to add in a lot of rules about what people can and can't do. SL is about freedom after all. But it's also about virtual community, and consequently, social responsibility. If the rules forced everyone to express themselves according to the lowest common denomenator we'd end up with a bland and homogenous world, but on the other hand people need to use some common sense. What's fun about provoking a negative response in others? or dragging contentious hot-button issues from real life into SL? It just doesn't seem worth it to me. If you really want a flag, why not make up your own? If you're all about southern pride then your flag can have that meaning for you and other people can admire it for being something original that they haven't seen before and don't have pre-conceived notions about. Stretch your imaginations and creativity a little and think about how others might perceive what you do... because it matters. If you really really need a confederate flag or other potentially divisive symbol why not hang it in your house? If you put something out on the wall, facing away from where you live, you're putting it up to make a statement to others, not to enchance your own property. And given the fact that the person who put it up did so to block the view of something someone else put up that expressed ideas they didn't like, it's like saying "I demand the right to express political views I agree with AND the right to suppress those I don't agree with." It's pretty hypocritical if you ask me, and there's not a lot to defend there. Motives matter too.

I never demanded that people not shoot me. If you read my post you'll see my complaint was getting shot a dozen times or more within a very short period of time, then chased into my basement and shot again. This didn't happen once or twice. This happened over and over and over again, with no way for me to see where they are or to retaliate.

I don't even own a gun. I don't play that game. I get shot once or twice, I don't care. It is a dangerous sim and I accept that. But I do object to being harassed by being unceasingly and unendingly shot. My post wasn't an excuse, it was an explanation. If the Lindens hadn't changed things I would have looked for new land, despite the awkwardness of transferring all that I've built.

The issue is moot in any event. There is currently no damage on my land.

The simple fact that it isn't against the rules, means it is acceptable. You're right, it isn't the sole purpose of the Outlands, but it is certainly a defining aspect of the gameplay within the Outlands.

Again, you shouldn't expect to not get shot. If you go into the Outlands with this expectation, you're only going to frustrate yourself in futility, as you hvae done. It is going to happen every now and then. What should you do? You should shoot back. Not only is your gun an offensive weapon, it is a deterrent.

Kathy, the stance you are taking on this, is simply untenable.

Chipster hit it right on the nose...



*claps*

So, if it isn't the sole purpose of the sim, then why are you insisting on MAKING it the sole purpose? How can you justify taking complete control of ALL access routes to the area with the sole purpose of restricting the area to ONLY your personal use? How can you hijack an entire sim to your own view (never dictated by Linden) of the game?

Don't tell me what you will do to me. I already KNOW. You're going to shoot me whenever you can get a bead on me. I could shoot back, if I wanted to. I'm not unaccustomed to the practice. I'm prior military. I've fired expert on every weapon except the .45. I have done my time on Half-Life since it came out (very familiar with spawn campers like you) and Couter-Strike since it acme out. Tired to death of exactly the kind of practice you seem to love. Not sure why you need to bring it here, but understand that I refuse to do so, Regardless of your opinion that I ought to simply shoot back.

Instead, explain to me why you think you're understanding of the purpose of the sim has any legal standing over mine? I'm still waiting for you to show me a document that says I must stay out of jessie or submit to being your perenial target - no other choices.

Go ahead. Take your time. I'll wait for you to find it.

Well, the description of the Outlands was "a danger zone where you could be harmed." I thought you were done posting in here?
It doesn't say that really bossy people who roam around and complain about people shooting them aren't welcome. The discaimer just warned that it was possible for them to be harmed. It also implied that other players are not the only danger in the outlands, yet I havem't found anything else.
There is a lot of wasted emotion on this topic. No one is really this pathetic victim that they make themselves out to be.
OK, there is nothing that says you can't go there. There is also nothing that says you can go there and demand to be safe.

geez, I can't believe that was my 100th post >.<
I swear the last dozen posts were me bitching that people need to stop complaining that their non-existent rights were trampled on.
silliness.

First, you're right. I was done posting on this topic. I must have gotten distracted at some point by another outright fabrication - sort of like now. Sorry :-)

Second, I don't remember. Were you there? I must have gotten distracted again, because it don't remember you. You obviously know enough about it to be able to classify me as "bossy" though. And you seem to have concluded that I raom around complaining. Could you give me a more accurate description of the "roaming" and the "complaining"? I seem to remember a few directed questions, several hundred shots, and a simple request to be left alone. Go ahead and fill out my recollection, though. It would be SO helpful.

In the meantime, let me clear up a seemingly popular misconception from those who embrace the art of thugery. I have never claimed I was a victim - of circumstance, hapenstance, or any silliness you folks could manufacture. In fact, I not only DIDN'T start this conversation, I ALSO didn't start out shooting anyone. And I don't intend to BE a victim. That is why - as I have said before - I will ALWAYS go to the outlands, until my last route in is sealed.

Only a thug would want me to restrict my own freedom.

Oh, and by the way, I never demanded to be safe (another fabrication). I simply insisted that I not be abused. Can you tell the difference?

"How can you justify taking complete control of ALL access routes to the area with the sole purpose of restricting the area to ONLY your personal use?" - Kathy

We don't - even though that option is available to anyone should he or she choose to attempt it. Lots of people come through Jessie, and socialize with the PvPer's successfully. Yeah, there's some shooting involved, but it's all customary.

The difference between these guys, and you... is that they don't whine and complain. They just go with the flow, and shoot back. Eventually everyone stops shooting and starts talking.

If you throw a fit about being shot, and set your home location to the roof of someone's apartment in protest (as you did), you're just asking to get shot more.

"Don't tell me what you will do to me. I already KNOW. You're going to shoot me whenever you can get a bead on me." - Kathy

Yeah, you're probably right. Unless you give me money or stop complaining.

"Tired to death of exactly the kind of practice you seem to love. Not sure why you need to bring it here, but understand that I refuse to do so, Regardless of your opinion that I ought to simply shoot back." - Kathy

Well, you do have another option available to you. Aside from shooting back, that is. You could always stop complaining and deal with it. Or pay me off, I would find that acceptable.

"Instead, explain to me why you think you're understanding of the purpose of the sim has any legal standing over mine?"

I have a gun and you don't. Power is law.

"I'm still waiting for you to show me a document that says I must stay out of jessie or submit to being your perenial target - no other choices." - Kathy

Not a problem. But, according to Linden Labs, you do have a choice available to you. That choice is teleporting out of the area.



There you have it.

Hope this clears up any misunderstandings you might have.

Quoth the Linden:
"Unsafe: The health meter that appears in the lower left hand corner of the screen indicates that you are in an "unsafe" area, i.e. an area where violence or aggressive physical interaction between residents is allowed. Some regions are entirely unsafe, such as the Outlands, while in others it can be set by land owners. The default setting is "safe". When the health meter is turned on residents should beware - this means they can be impeded, imprisoned, hurt, and even die. Death isn't painful, but could be very inconvenient, because it means being immediately returned to their home location. Escape from an unsafe area is always possible via the 'Teleport Home' option."

Is it becoming clear to you now?

And while we are at it, I would like it if you could address the following points from my original post:

1. Why is it not possible for you to dig a hole to lodge your temple into in a safe simulator, in exactly the same way you did in the Outlands? Why do you claim that it cannot be done?
2. Why does your proximity to your friend's property in the Outlands, and your refusal to learn how to use the landscaping tools, exclude you from the purpose of the Outlands, which is clearly to provide an area where you can kill or be killed?
3. Where, exactly, do you get off trying to tell people that they shouldn't shoot you, in a simulator where damage was deliberately turned on across the board?