Copyright Theft & Positive Experience with SLAC
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Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
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10-26-2004 02:04
From: Hiro Pendragon
It's still illegal, Eggy, even if China does it. I don't know if you've heard of it, but police in New York City will do large sweeps of knockoff rings, collect hundreds of thousands of knockoff items. Reverse engineering is NOT a legal way to get around copyright. Period. The design itself is intellectual property and that is really at the center of the copyright.
You just made a glorious display of your own ignorance. Bravo!  The DMCA has explicit provisions to ALLOW reverse engineering to occur. Counterfeiting is different from independently replicating, and it is a matter of TRADEMARK law. Even if you invented jeans, I can make as many jeans as I want, even if they look exactly like yours, as long as I dont try to claim they were made by you. Replace jeans with katanas or anything else really. It's not like there weren't plenty of katanas in SL before you arrived... you evil katana pirate you  Unless you patented them. Patents!=Copyrights!=Trademarks http://copyright.gov/help/faq/ |
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Hiro Pendragon
bye bye f0rums!
Join date: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,905
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10-26-2004 02:08
From: Korg Stygian
Now, there are literally two issues with this copy. The first, of course, is copyright/idea theft. Sorry mateys... it's damn near impossible to prove - I don't care what the lawyers will tell you about this situation as I described it.
The second issue is that you cannot "prove" that the "counterfeiter" didn't actually just design/make this item from scratch/from his head.
Two obvious counter-examples: 1. Currency. 2. Music. Regardless of your intent or if you designed either one completely seperate, if you come out with near duplicates you are violating copyright. In the latter example, there is an industry standard (I believe it's like 1/16 notes) that literally defines the difference between an illegal copyright theft and a legal knock-off. Again, it's the design that's intellectual property, and once published it belongs to the publisher. In the prior example, the US Secret Service comes to your door and arrests you for counterfeiting.
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Hiro Pendragon
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http://www.involve3d.com - Involve - Metaverse / Emerging Media Studio
Visit my SL blog: http://secondtense.blogspot.com
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Korg Stygian
Curmudgeon Extraordinaire
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,105
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10-26-2004 02:17
From: Hiro Pendragon Two obvious counter-examples:
1. Currency.
2. Music.
Regardless of your intent or if you designed either one completely seperate, if you come out with near duplicates you are violating copyright.
In the latter example, there is an industry standard (I believe it's like 1/16 notes) that literally defines the difference between an illegal copyright theft and a legal knock-off. Again, it's the design that's intellectual property, and once published it belongs to the publisher.
In the prior example, the US Secret Service comes to your door and arrests you for counterfeiting. Sigh.. As usual, can't stay focused and reply to what is offered, can you? We aren't talking about the real world in general.. and currency is NOT copyrighted silly. We are talking about SL creations. Try to remember that when you post, as you almost certainly will. Lasty, "violating copyright" is only something I will ever worry about when my lawyer tells me that he can't either win or stretch the case out long enough that the other side can no longer afford the legal action. |
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
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10-26-2004 02:21
*wags finger*
Now, kids! Play nice.
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Willow Zander
Having Blahgasms
Join date: 22 May 2004
Posts: 9,935
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10-26-2004 02:23
From: Siggy Romulus I pity da fool! that wears your jewellery?
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*I'm not ready for the world outside...I keep pretending, but I just can't hide...* <3 Giddeon's <3
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Korg Stygian
Curmudgeon Extraordinaire
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,105
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10-26-2004 02:26
From: Kris Ritter *wags finger*
Now, kids! Play nice. why? Much more fun to play rough. |
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Willow Zander
Having Blahgasms
Join date: 22 May 2004
Posts: 9,935
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10-26-2004 02:26
From: Korg Stygian why? Much more fun to play rough. OMG I LOVE THIS PERSON!!!!!
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*I'm not ready for the world outside...I keep pretending, but I just can't hide...* <3 Giddeon's <3
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Hiro Pendragon
bye bye f0rums!
Join date: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,905
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10-26-2004 02:27
From: Korg Stygian
We are talking about SL creations. Try to remember that when you post, as you almost certainly will.
Lindens regular enforce copyright just like this. In fact, Nova Linden oversaw it being enforced in my case. The medium does not provide an exception to copyright.
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Hiro Pendragon
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http://www.involve3d.com - Involve - Metaverse / Emerging Media Studio
Visit my SL blog: http://secondtense.blogspot.com
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Korg Stygian
Curmudgeon Extraordinaire
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,105
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10-26-2004 02:39
From: Hiro Pendragon Lindens regular enforce copyright just like this. In fact, Nova Linden oversaw it being enforced in my case. The medium does not provide an exception to copyright. wah wah wah...She happened to agree with you. So what? One instance. You simply don't know what you're talking about. If you seriously think it is as simple as a complaint, a comparison, and a bit of dispute resolution by a Linden employee.. you really are dreaming. If I make a katana... and it happens to look like yours.. and you complained... and a Linden got involved.. then my lawyer would get involved and YOU would lose. End of story. Go celebrate your "little victory" and try to live quietly in your little dream world. I live in the real world where big boys with big toys play real games for keeps. Good lawyers don't ever play softball. They play hardball or they play no-holds-barred-wrestling. They go for the jugular and eviscerate unwitting opponents. A good lawyer can find so many holes in even "well-written laws" that it should astound the average person - because all laws are written in a specific language. All languages are inherently vague and open to interpretation. The smallest vagary is enough to win a copuright case. Just go ... whatever. |
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Hiro Pendragon
bye bye f0rums!
Join date: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,905
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10-26-2004 02:47
pfft.
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Hiro Pendragon
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http://www.involve3d.com - Involve - Metaverse / Emerging Media Studio
Visit my SL blog: http://secondtense.blogspot.com
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Selador Cellardoor
Registered User
Join date: 16 Nov 2003
Posts: 3,082
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10-26-2004 02:51
<<They go for the jugular>> Yeah. It's a jungle out there.  |
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
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10-26-2004 02:53
From: Hiro Pendragon pfft. That was remarkably restrained of you, Hiro. Are you sure you don't want to borrow my boxing gloves? |
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Korg Stygian
Curmudgeon Extraordinaire
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,105
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10-26-2004 02:55
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Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
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10-26-2004 02:58
From: Hiro Pendragon pfft. Most eloquently put, Sir! I admire your argumentative prowess and would like to subscribe to your newsletter. |
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Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
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10-26-2004 03:00
I have a katana or three... Daitenshi Kato's... Spider Mandala's... and some other katana that is supposedly from FF7 but I cant remember its maker. |
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
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10-26-2004 03:01
Eggy! Korg! Come here!
Look, Hiro was being the bigger man here, knowing this would just degenerate into yet another slanging match, which it will, because you two are just being deliberately provocative.
So leave him alone and go troll elsewhere!
*slaps the both of you*
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Korg Stygian
Curmudgeon Extraordinaire
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,105
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10-26-2004 03:03
From: Kris Ritter Korg! Come here!
*slaps the both of you* Um.. please ma'am. May I have some more? Please? (OTOH, that was truly insulting.. placing me in the same gender as .... um.....forget it) |
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Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
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10-26-2004 03:06
Oh, whow. Kris touched me. I'll never wash this cheek again.
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Hiro Pendragon
bye bye f0rums!
Join date: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,905
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10-26-2004 03:09
From: Kris Ritter Eggy! Korg! Come here!
Look, Hiro was being the bigger man here, knowing this would just degenerate into yet another slanging match, which it will, because you two are just being deliberately provocative.
So leave him alone and go troll elsewhere!
*slaps the both of you* At this point it may degenerate into a kinky slapping dealio. This I don't have any immediate objections to. Eggy, can your katanas change color? **** SUBLIMINAL ADVERTISING FOR HIRO'S KATANA!!!! OMG BUY IT YOU KNOW YOU WANT IT OH BABY!!! *****
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Hiro Pendragon
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http://www.involve3d.com - Involve - Metaverse / Emerging Media Studio
Visit my SL blog: http://secondtense.blogspot.com
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
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10-26-2004 03:11
From: Hiro Pendragon Eggy, can your katanas change color? Why did this line having me giggling? o.O |
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Korg Stygian
Curmudgeon Extraordinaire
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,105
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10-26-2004 03:14
From: Hiro Pendragon **** SUBLIMINAL ADVERTISING ... lol... poor boy... needs to learn his own "claimed tongue" subliminal---Below the threshold of conscious perception. I think that to read a post on a forum, one must be perceiving consciously... ergo.. subliminal advertising in the form of text cannot exist in the fashion attempted above. Check your Barthes, de Sassure, or CS Pierce if you need to. That was about as subliminal as a bull in a china closet. |
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Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
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10-26-2004 03:16
Buy Hiro's Katanas Now!
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Willow Zander
Having Blahgasms
Join date: 22 May 2004
Posts: 9,935
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10-26-2004 03:17
From: Eggy Lippmann Buy Hiro's Katanas Now! What's a Katana  j/k
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*I'm not ready for the world outside...I keep pretending, but I just can't hide...* <3 Giddeon's <3
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Hiro Pendragon
bye bye f0rums!
Join date: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,905
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10-26-2004 03:19
From: Korg Stygian
That was about as subliminal as a bull in a china closet.
Thank you, Captain Obvious
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Hiro Pendragon
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http://www.involve3d.com - Involve - Metaverse / Emerging Media Studio
Visit my SL blog: http://secondtense.blogspot.com
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Siggy Romulus
DILLIGAF
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,711
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10-26-2004 03:20
From: Willow Zander What's a Katana The shitstirrer in me wants to answer 'a penis substitute' (and all parties concerned know me well enough to take that in the spirit it's intended)
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The Second Life forums are living proof as to why it's illegal for people to have sex with farm animals. From: Jesse Linden I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread
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