An Open Letter to Philip Rosedale and the Entire Linden Lab team

I've tried to be polite. really. I'm normally polite to a fault, actually.

But I'm gonna restate something someone else said.

Either you can't read very well, or you choose not to. Everything you are saying here has been refuted time and time again, from the very begining, and you have apprently managed to miss it every time.

At this point I honestly can't see there is any point in repeating myself or anyone else yet again.

[I* have asked linden lab to delete my account and have contacted a lawyer.

Yes. Yes you did. This is the part you don't seem to get.

Yes.

You.

Did.

Just because you think you were being polite about it (If you truely do), doesn't change anything.

In usenet there is the term trolling. Maybe Regnar really believes what he is saying. More likely in my opinion he just enjoys flame wars. The anti-troll faq speculates on reasons people may have for doing this.

Subject: 6. Why do they do it?

No one knows why the Trolls act as they do, but there are
several theories. Clearly an individual Troll may be in
one, or several of these groups, or indeed in none at all.
It is difficult to believe, but possible, that a totally
normal person would become a Troll.

------------------------------

Subject: 6.1 The Infant or Attention Seeker theory

Some believe that the trolls are just adults who brains and
morals have not developed beyond childhood, and they are
just behaving as attention seeking children.

------------------------------

Subject: 6.2 The retired bitter old person theory.

There is evidence that some Trolls are retired persons,
with a good pension and little to do with their lives.
They may have suffered a personal loss such as the death of
a much loved spouse which warped their outlook on life.

This type is particularly dangerous, because they may have
ample funds to buy computer equipment, own multiple domain
names, and multiple access to the internet. Worse they
may have, say 8 hour per day to invest in their "hobby".

------------------------------

Subject: 6.3 The insane person theory.

Some Trolls may be clinically insane, indeed one posts as
Mogadon John which may indicate that he/she is taking this
*major* tranquiliser, or it may just be a joke.

------------------------------

Subject: 6.4 The just evil theory.

There are people in this world who enjoy destruction. Some
enjoy murdering children. Some enjoy sexually abusing
children. Some Trolls may be in a similar category.

------------------------------

Subject: 6.5 The sad git theory.

There are unfortunately people with such restricted lives
that they cannot think of anything useful or constructive
to do with the powerful and expensive kit which they are
using.

------------------------------

Subject: 6.6 The loser theory.

This theory is that the Trolls are just losers who cannot
succeed in anything in their real lives. They can however
disrupt usenet with relative impunity.

LOL Essence,

It sometimes seems necessary when someone we disagree with is getting their opinion across more loudly than the vast majority that we should flame them, but when you start in on the psychoanalysis you are taking things too far!

How can you even talk about cruelty when there are children in developing countries that don't even have access to Prada shoes!

Cruelty is subjective, just like morality.

Oh, I am sorry for spewing all over this thread. I am a desperate man today. I'm just having a rough day. You see, I am an athiest but somehow I have the song "What a friend we have in Jesus" stuck in my head. I've had it for hours. I'm losing my mind.

Regnar is a pole smoker.

Technically, based on your rules, I can call you that. It does not contain any adult language.

I think what people most objected to was your tone, Regnar. That, and the fact that the incident that sparked your "request" was a clear example of sloppy parenting. Most adults (myself included) really don't appreciate having disapproving fingers wagged at them, especially over subjective (and rather puritanical) moral issues.

(edited for redundancy)

This is your very first post Regnar:



Here is your second post:




It does not equal your following post:




Despite the fact that I think you are wrong in all of these posts, it still boggles me that you cannot see the difference in attitude between the beginning and ending posts, and therefore understand the deserved reaction you received from the community.

It was ALSO you calling people "irresponsible posters" and that we should be ashamed of ourselves and that we can go on "being ugly" if we wanted to, implying we are not up to moral code.

Are you really so blind as to think that those statements were:

A. Fair
B. Justified
C. Respectful
D. "Polite"

Let's hear you defend that one; you've done a good job avoiding everyone calling you out on your inappropriateness in this thread and others.

Sure I could be wrong. But this has the marks of a troll. He starts off with a LOUD subject line. He is very vague about what his real issue is. Somewhere around page eight he fnally says what are the two threads he finds offensive. His story is inconsistent. He refuses to say anything about all the good points that have been made why his idea is a bad one. And if you were a person who loved trolling, what a better topic for second life than being a puritanical jerk. He's probably laughing and having the time of his life with every post you guys make.

Anyone really concerned about this topic would have started with something real . Like "I had to explain what wh*** meant to my daughter, and it made her cry. These posts caused it." And when people point out things like putting 18+ banners on the front page would only draw younger people would have something to say about it.

Sorry, I'll be sure to put a few more of these on next time:

I'm sure these points have been made but here's my "me too":

Is this kid's dad not upset with you for leaving this "disturbing stuff" accessible? He probably sues gun manufacturers too.

The problem isn't that children might view the general forum. The problem is that innapropriate content that violated forum guidelines wasn't removed.

Editted to reflect reality.

Well I certainly hope the kids parents were able to re-wrap it up in a shiny new coat of bubble wrap after seeing the horrible word 'whore'. Wow, that was shocking all right!

Umm, isn't the word whore in the bible? LOL

edit: Better not allow any dictionaries in the house either. And TV? Forget it!

Here's the thing people. He made up the story.

He says the parent was upset at the whore thread, the lame ass thread and others. Also, they saw 'colorful' metaphors in people's signature lines. Even the most idiotic of parents, upon seeing offensive material, wouldn't continue to dig around the page and find more. "Honey, omg, you just saw the word whore. We'd best look into this more and find out what else could have offended you." Someone of that level of idiocy just doesn't exist.

Translated: Regnar is generally disgusted with the moral level of SL and decided to attack us in this way. He keeps saying that it is a Fact that LL should put the 18+ thing on their webpage if they don't want people under 18 here.

NO NO NO NO

It is a Fact that they already require a credit card to do this. It is a fact that the SL webpage is open to the general public. It is a fact that you have to be a member to reach the "mature" forums.

It is Regnar's opinion that a warning should be put on the page. It is EVERYONE else's opinion that it shouldn't.

Regnar, you have yet to address the repeatedly presented (and very valid) argument that putting an 18+ label on the webpage and locking down the forums would:

a) attract MORE children and perverts (what a great mix)
b) cut down on SL's almost sole form of advertising.

Neither A nor B is acceptable to the community.

I'm waiting for that knife line again and for Reg to assert his politeness.

Oh, and Regnar - I'd like you to present me with one other SLer who thinks I'm a rude, cruel, or rash person. Had you responded at all positively to any of my suggestions, you could have had a good ally in me.

As someone else said, I'm polite to a fault. However, once you start attacking SL, then yes, you are attacking me as well. I will respond.

Just more of Regnar's usual Morality and Properness Police banter. He's had a few of my posts removed because they weren't "proper" (no hard feelings to the Lindens who removed them, they were just acting on a complaint.)

Regnar, again, was the one who berated me originally for not acting like a proper lady in SL. (The female sit, not any profanity, not any nudity, not any lewdness.)

The guy has an obvious bone to pick with the fact that everyone isn't walking around and acting Victorian.

Regnar, SL is not for you. This is clear. You're seeing a microcosm of society that isn't controlled and policed for moral content violations as you would like.

Unfortunately, your morality barometer is not neccessarily everyone else's morality barometer, and you're not the one who sets these standards.

What I'd like to know is, what were you doing letting an 8 year old onto your computer unsupervised. There's a whole lot of places that 8 year old could have gone that are far, FAR worse than the general forum, where she may have learned more than just a few words.

I kind of have my doubts that an 8 year old was navigating through threads, however, and I think this just continues your one-man battle as self-appointed morality police for SecondLife.

I have to wonder how you step outside each day without freaking out.

INDEED!!!!!

Here are the real issues:

Thing 1: When I was 8, the cool kids were the ones who new the swear words. The ones who proclaimed the word naughty and/or stated that they weren't allowed to say it were made fun of or got beat up.

Thing 2: 8 yr olds are brutal. Coddling them like they were some sort of small human is likely to decrease their survivability in the wild, as well as put you at risk for being kicked in the shin. I avoid young children when I see them now for fear they might be 2nd graders. I'm all for providing grade school teachers with flame throwers to hold them at bay. I was a camp counselor, I know what its like... Ever see the movie Aliens?

Thing 3: Asssstronaut. As someone who hasn't mentally matured passed 8, that's pretty funny stuff right there.

Conclusion: Sometimes its easier to build a wall around the man that fears everything than a wall around everything he fears.

P.S. Can any of us just call up Phil with our random thoughts at anytime? Isn't that a good way of getting him to stop answering the phone all together and become bitter and jaded and crash his plane into something?

If THAT was a polite request, i shudder to think of what your impolite requests sound like.
==Chris

Regnar--RESPOND:

You called people "irresponsible posters" and that we should be ashamed of ourselves and that we can go on "being ugly" if we wanted to, implying we are not up to moral code.

Are you really so blind as to think that those statements were:

A. Fair
B. Justified
C. Respectful
D. "Polite"

Explain.

If, in fact he did call Philip, why haven't we seen Mr Rosedale post about said conversation.

Minor grammatical edit.

I will be more specific for you:

"You know as well as I do that children arent always watched all of the time. It is the responsibility of you and your staff, Mr. Rosedale to help control the content posted by your users especially if children can access this part of this site."

Okay, then why do you keep saying this child (now we know s/he was fake) was supervised?


"Thanks to some irresponsible posters there is an 8 year old little girl that learned some new words. Now dosen't that make you feel real good?"

This goes back to ABCD above. Respond.


"He took down Linden Labs Name and phone # and said he would take care of it after his vacation is over. It's his situation and not mine. I am sure he can and will handle it ."

"Like I said, It is out of my hands. These people are friends of mine and were playing on the computer while I was out. Like I said, It is gonna be taken care by my friend in his own way."

Then why did you call Phillip? There are holes in your story.


"I dislike people that have absolutely no respect for others."

"If all you people want your adult content, then have it. I can only wonder what you are like in real life. So keep being ugly."

ABCD--Respond.


"When it does change I promise you will never hear me complain about it ever again. I promise."

What if your actions cause you to never want to be heard from again anyway? Part of me wants the sticker on the front page so we don't have to deal with your belligerent posts all the time. The other part of me says no, there are enough people in Second Life who don't believe you do--and why do you honestly believe your voice is more important than everyone else's? One more point, why is it that all of the sudden -you- are on the mission instead of your friend?


"The messages in question were something about Lame w2 group and an attention wh*** and so on.
There are several users that also sign their messages with lets say (as spock in star trek 3 said) colorful metaphores."

Children at the age of 8--and you should know this, Regnar, being a teacher--are just leaving preoperational thinking and moving into concrete thinking. Concrete thinkers do not grasp metaphors. It takes the development of formal operational thinking, which begins at early adolescence, to truly grasp abstract concepts. The 8 year old could not have cognitively recognized the metaphors you speak of, further showing that she does not exist to begin with. (Check Piaget's model of cognitive development.)


"Comments I dont mind. Personal insults I do mind.
have a nice day people."

Requesting a response is not a personal attack. If you cannot find means to justify yourself and you consider that grounds for personal attack, then you are still in the concrete operational phase of development and you firmly believe that "If you knew what I knew, then you'd be as smart as me." Time to move forward; unfortunately for you, we aren't preoperational like your elementary school students--you can't play games and make demands with us the way it sounds like you would treat your own students. We're over 18 years of age, formal operational, and we aren't going to tolerate your self-righteous demands when we don't believe you are right.

Because no one cares. That's right, no one. We like to make fun of you, though. To quote yourself,

"Keep posting If you Want to be Ugly ."

Toy nominates Regnar for poster child of the Cranial Rectumits Foundation

You know I saw a cat that had kittens once.

The mother cat was very protective of the kittens: watching them, feeding them, cleaning them, attacking other animals that approached the kittens.

This leaves me to conclude:

Housecat > Regnar and company.