Second Life Forums Archive - Christmas Celebrations Becoming Politically Incorrect?

Blake Rockwell

Fun Businesses

Join date: 31 Oct 2004

Posts: 1,606

12-15-2004 11:46

From: Chip Midnight

Common sense and trial and error. Morals aren't static. They vary by culture and are influenced heavily by circumstances. If morality was implanted in our minds by God then it stands to reason they would be the same everywhere, in every time, and in every culture. This is clearly not the case. If the ten commandments were written today, would not coveting your neighbor's oxen make the top ten? Methinks not.

That does not compute. "Too Human is Error" Error..Error..Error..Error..C o m m o n S e n s e. . . . H u m a n Error..Error..Error..

_____________________

Siobhan Taylor

Nemesis

Join date: 13 Aug 2003

Posts: 5,476

12-15-2004 11:50

From: Chip Midnight

Common sense and trial and error. Morals aren't static. They vary by culture and are influenced heavily by circumstances. If morality was implanted in our minds by God then it stands to reason they would be the same everywhere, in every time, and in every culture. This is clearly not the case. If the ten commandments were written today, would not coveting your neighbor's oxen make the top ten? Methinks not.

Leave my neighbour's oxen out of this... sometimes they're the only partnership a girl can get.

_____________________

http://siobhantaylor.wordpress.com/

Rose Karuna

Lizard Doctor

Join date: 5 Jun 2004

Posts: 3,772

12-15-2004 12:04

From: Blake Rockwell

*Stirs the Pot*

Who's to know what started morality, if not religion; then how did it start and how did we decipher good from evil to begin with?

Wherever religion has appeared in human development it has; (a) it claimed to unveil the eternal, (b) explained the disquiet and tension which arise from the disclosure of the eternal, (c) provided a means of overcoming the estrangement created by the disclosure of the eternal, and (d) it provided a way of life or fellowship or union with the eternal.

(This according to Nygren a historian of religion)

Religion and morality are not necessarily synonymous. Morality tends to be a mode of social organization, that allows humans to reproduce and survive as a society. For example, in some religions eating pork was forbidden as part of a moral edict. There was good reason for this - pork carried a worm that killed people. Cannibalism is forbidden in almost all societies across the board - people now know that one can get prion diseases (kuru) from the practice. The practice is doubly "distasteful" to species survival in that it involves death and the eating of death.

Take a good look at moral codes and you will see that many were initiated for species survival. Monogamy, while political, can also be seen as a species survival technique because in being certain of the paternity of a child, the father was more likely to support that child to adult hood. OTOH - this was also asking humans to supress a natural drive to propagate with as many as possible to diversify the genome of the species.

So Religion and morality joined hands to better hold a club by which to enforce rules that were valid at the time (and some remain valid even today).

It seems to me that the problem is religion is a philosophical determination based on faith - hence stagnant, whereas morality is based on what is good for the human species which should change from region to region and in time, with the advent of scientific knowledge.

So.. ask a simple question and get a diatribe about cannibals - only in SL

_____________________

I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To

Eggy Lippmann

Wiktator

Join date: 1 May 2003

Posts: 7,939

12-15-2004 12:25

Oh, *GROAN*!!!!
For the love of god, people, grow a f*cking spine already!
Enough of this PC bullshit. This is just ridiculous.

_____________________

Help us document Second Life history at http://slhistory.org!

Blake Rockwell

Fun Businesses

Join date: 31 Oct 2004

Posts: 1,606

12-15-2004 12:42

ERROR ERROR ERROR ERROR

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Pleze Playfair

Registered User

Join date: 27 Aug 2004

Posts: 100

12-15-2004 13:58

From: Shiryu Musashi

Why should i tell Happy Holydays if i am christian and celebrate christmas? For me its Merry Christmas, if one celebrates a different festivity he can respond in the way he likes.
But if someone goes as far as being offended by being told "Merry Christmas" he's not religious, he's a paranoid.
People following different religions are just that, different, sure shouldnt treat each other like enemies.

What if I was a satanist and told you that I hope you go to hell next month? Would you take offense to this?

David Valentino

Nicely Wicked

Join date: 1 Jan 2004

Posts: 2,941

12-15-2004 14:19

From: Pleze Playfair

What if I was a satanist and told you that I hope you go to hell next month? Would you take offense to this?

I wouldn't. I would just ask you politely if you would care to join me.

_____________________

David Lamoreaux

Owner - Perilous Pleasures and Extreme Erotica Gallery

Rose Karuna

Lizard Doctor

Join date: 5 Jun 2004

Posts: 3,772

12-15-2004 14:29

^
|
|
|

***Hollers up from Hades *** Beer & Pizza's here.

Takes one last woosh - naked - on the baby oiled slip and slide.

Naked Twisted Next Guys!

Followed by Prison Sex.

_____________________

I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To

Hensonian Pennyfeather

Registered User

Join date: 17 Aug 2004

Posts: 19

Festival of lights

01-31-2005 17:47

From: Kendra Bancroft

I can't speak to Kwaanza --but Hannukah simply means "Festival of Lights" which is descriptive, whereas Christmas actually refers to the religious ceremony of "The Christ's Mass". If Christmas were called "Pretty Tree Party" then it would be named simarly to Hannukah.

Actually, the festival of Lights is another historical and religious holiday...It celebrates a miraculous act of God where there was no more oil for the lamps for more than one day, and they lasted 8.

Hensonian Pennyfeather

Registered User

Join date: 17 Aug 2004

Posts: 19

01-31-2005 17:49

From: David Valentino

If you think about it...doing away with all religions, (say you could remove the memory of all religions and religious teachings and references from everyone), would probably be humankinds biggest step toward a harmonious, peaceful and tolerant society. Hmm..perhaps I will begin to practice and preach religious intolerance against ALL religions.

nahhhhhh....before religion was invented we already had violence.

Kendra Bancroft

Rhine Maiden

Join date: 17 Jun 2004

Posts: 5,813

01-31-2005 18:01

From: Hensonian Pennyfeather

Actually, the festival of Lights is another historical and religious holiday...It celebrates a miraculous act of God where there was no more oil for the lamps for more than one day, and they lasted 8.

exactly --and so it is descriptive of an historic event albiet one with miracle oriented overtones -- as opposed to Christ's Mass which is a religious ritual a church service. If the holiday were called Jesus' Birthday Bash, it would be much more analogous to Chanukah.

Isis Becquerel

Ferine Strumpet

Join date: 1 Sep 2004

Posts: 971

02-01-2005 09:43

Man is it Christmahannakwanzakka again already? Surely I am going mad...

Although religion is not the sole cause of war it does have an effect on man's willingness to go to war...though without religion I am sure we would find another excuse such as how a person eats their Reece's Peanut Butter Cup....

Ohh and man has always worshiped something. There is not a time in written history where man did not have some sort of religion brewing and even before writing man had oral traditions concerning religion. So unless you are speaking of way back when we were knuckle draggers without a language who ran around bonking each other over the head for the last fig, I would say that you will be hard pressed to find a time in man's brief but colorful history bereft of idolotry, mysticism, nature worship and religious musings.

_____________________

One of the most fashionable notions of our times is that social problems like poverty and oppression breed wars. Most wars, however, are started by well-fed people with time on their hands to dream up half-baked ideologies or grandiose ambitions, and to nurse real or imagined grievances.
Thomas Sowell

As long as the bottle of wine costs more than 50 bucks, I'm not an alcoholic...even if I did drink 3 of them.

Christmas Celebrations Becoming Politically Incorrect?
Blake Rockwell Fun Businesses Join date: 31 Oct 2004 Posts: 1,606	12-15-2004 11:46 From: Chip Midnight Common sense and trial and error. Morals aren't static. They vary by culture and are influenced heavily by circumstances. If morality was implanted in our minds by God then it stands to reason they would be the same everywhere, in every time, and in every culture. This is clearly not the case. If the ten commandments were written today, would not coveting your neighbor's oxen make the top ten? Methinks not. That does not compute. "Too Human is Error" Error..Error..Error..Error..C o m m o n S e n s e. . . . H u m a n Error..Error..Error.. _____________________
Siobhan Taylor Nemesis Join date: 13 Aug 2003 Posts: 5,476	12-15-2004 11:50 From: Chip Midnight Common sense and trial and error. Morals aren't static. They vary by culture and are influenced heavily by circumstances. If morality was implanted in our minds by God then it stands to reason they would be the same everywhere, in every time, and in every culture. This is clearly not the case. If the ten commandments were written today, would not coveting your neighbor's oxen make the top ten? Methinks not. Leave my neighbour's oxen out of this... sometimes they're the only partnership a girl can get. _____________________ http://siobhantaylor.wordpress.com/
Rose Karuna Lizard Doctor Join date: 5 Jun 2004 Posts: 3,772	12-15-2004 12:04 From: Blake Rockwell Stirs the Pot Who's to know what started morality, if not religion; then how did it start and how did we decipher good from evil to begin with? Wherever religion has appeared in human development it has; (a) it claimed to unveil the eternal, (b) explained the disquiet and tension which arise from the disclosure of the eternal, (c) provided a means of overcoming the estrangement created by the disclosure of the eternal, and (d) it provided a way of life or fellowship or union with the eternal. (This according to Nygren a historian of religion) Religion and morality are not necessarily synonymous. Morality tends to be a mode of social organization, that allows humans to reproduce and survive as a society. For example, in some religions eating pork was forbidden as part of a moral edict. There was good reason for this - pork carried a worm that killed people. Cannibalism is forbidden in almost all societies across the board - people now know that one can get prion diseases (kuru) from the practice. The practice is doubly "distasteful" to species survival in that it involves death and the eating of death. Take a good look at moral codes and you will see that many were initiated for species survival. Monogamy, while political, can also be seen as a species survival technique because in being certain of the paternity of a child, the father was more likely to support that child to adult hood. OTOH - this was also asking humans to supress a natural drive to propagate with as many as possible to diversify the genome of the species. So Religion and morality joined hands to better hold a club by which to enforce rules that were valid at the time (and some remain valid even today). It seems to me that the problem is religion is a philosophical determination based on faith - hence stagnant, whereas morality is based on what is good for the human species which should change from region to region and in time, with the advent of scientific knowledge. So.. ask a simple question and get a diatribe about cannibals - only in SL _____________________ I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To
Eggy Lippmann Wiktator Join date: 1 May 2003 Posts: 7,939	12-15-2004 12:25 Oh, GROAN!!!! For the love of god, people, grow a fcking spine already! Enough of this PC bullshit. This is just ridiculous. _____________________ Help us document Second Life history at http://slhistory.org*!
Blake Rockwell Fun Businesses Join date: 31 Oct 2004 Posts: 1,606	12-15-2004 12:42 ERROR ERROR ERROR ERROR _____________________
Pleze Playfair Registered User Join date: 27 Aug 2004 Posts: 100	12-15-2004 13:58 From: Shiryu Musashi Why should i tell Happy Holydays if i am christian and celebrate christmas? For me its Merry Christmas, if one celebrates a different festivity he can respond in the way he likes. But if someone goes as far as being offended by being told "Merry Christmas" he's not religious, he's a paranoid. People following different religions are just that, different, sure shouldnt treat each other like enemies. What if I was a satanist and told you that I hope you go to hell next month? Would you take offense to this?
David Valentino Nicely Wicked Join date: 1 Jan 2004 Posts: 2,941	12-15-2004 14:19 From: Pleze Playfair What if I was a satanist and told you that I hope you go to hell next month? Would you take offense to this? I wouldn't. I would just ask you politely if you would care to join me. _____________________ David Lamoreaux Owner - Perilous Pleasures and Extreme Erotica Gallery
Rose Karuna Lizard Doctor Join date: 5 Jun 2004 Posts: 3,772	12-15-2004 14:29 ^ \| \| \| *Hollers up from Hades * Beer & Pizza's here. Takes one last woosh - naked - on the baby oiled slip and slide. Naked Twisted Next Guys! Followed by Prison Sex. _____________________ I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To
Hensonian Pennyfeather Registered User Join date: 17 Aug 2004 Posts: 19	Festival of lights 01-31-2005 17:47 From: Kendra Bancroft I can't speak to Kwaanza --but Hannukah simply means "Festival of Lights" which is descriptive, whereas Christmas actually refers to the religious ceremony of "The Christ's Mass". If Christmas were called "Pretty Tree Party" then it would be named simarly to Hannukah. Actually, the festival of Lights is another historical and religious holiday...It celebrates a miraculous act of God where there was no more oil for the lamps for more than one day, and they lasted 8.
Hensonian Pennyfeather Registered User Join date: 17 Aug 2004 Posts: 19	01-31-2005 17:49 From: David Valentino If you think about it...doing away with all religions, (say you could remove the memory of all religions and religious teachings and references from everyone), would probably be humankinds biggest step toward a harmonious, peaceful and tolerant society. Hmm..perhaps I will begin to practice and preach religious intolerance against ALL religions. nahhhhhh....before religion was invented we already had violence.
Kendra Bancroft Rhine Maiden Join date: 17 Jun 2004 Posts: 5,813	01-31-2005 18:01 From: Hensonian Pennyfeather Actually, the festival of Lights is another historical and religious holiday...It celebrates a miraculous act of God where there was no more oil for the lamps for more than one day, and they lasted 8. exactly --and so it is descriptive of an historic event albiet one with miracle oriented overtones -- as opposed to Christ's Mass which is a religious ritual a church service. If the holiday were called Jesus' Birthday Bash, it would be much more analogous to Chanukah.
Isis Becquerel Ferine Strumpet Join date: 1 Sep 2004 Posts: 971	02-01-2005 09:43 Man is it Christmahannakwanzakka again already? Surely I am going mad... Although religion is not the sole cause of war it does have an effect on man's willingness to go to war...though without religion I am sure we would find another excuse such as how a person eats their Reece's Peanut Butter Cup.... Ohh and man has always worshiped something. There is not a time in written history where man did not have some sort of religion brewing and even before writing man had oral traditions concerning religion. So unless you are speaking of way back when we were knuckle draggers without a language who ran around bonking each other over the head for the last fig, I would say that you will be hard pressed to find a time in man's brief but colorful history bereft of idolotry, mysticism, nature worship and religious musings. _____________________ One of the most fashionable notions of our times is that social problems like poverty and oppression breed wars. Most wars, however, are started by well-fed people with time on their hands to dream up half-baked ideologies or grandiose ambitions, and to nurse real or imagined grievances. Thomas Sowell As long as the bottle of wine costs more than 50 bucks, I'm not an alcoholic...even if I did drink 3 of them.

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Christmas Celebrations Becoming Politically Incorrect?